SOOOO mad at our school district....

[Royd]

Until America is ready to get rid of the NEA and teachers' unions, which is all about keeping a voting block of teachers happy, and nothing to do with a quality education, for the students, we will continue down the path of moral and intellectual destruction......Take up home shcooling, on your own computer...Obviously, if you are typing messages on this website, you have a computer.
Purchase some good homeschool courses and get your kids started, instead of sending them off to the glorified babysitter.

Governor Christie, of NJ, has it right....Time to kick the slats out from underneath the bloated, tenured teachers' unions and make every teacher stand and justify their existence and pay, every year.


Edited, for the spelling of existance, existence.....Quality does matter. If you don't care about spelling and punctuation errors, quit complaining.

 

[Muggsmagee]

I think homeschooling has its place. I gratefully homeschooled my kids for 4 years, and quite frankly would pull them out of public school in a heartbeat if I didn't think our school was doing a good job. There are pros and cons to both public education and home education.

Royd...I'm not sure I've agreed with you on anything (no offense

), however, I agree about getting rid of the teacher's unions. NY state is filthy with union corruption.

 

[Dunkopf]

Quote:
If that was true we would have a totally non functioning society. Agreed that a percentage of our children in public schools do poorly. I'm sure that some homeschooled kids in a smaller percentage also do poorly.

I could introduce you to my kids. Or both of my sisters kids, or any number of other kids I have personally met that were public schooled and do quite well. How a child does in school has a lot more to do with parents and their home environment than it does the school.

It's too bad this thread is degenerating into the old self righteous argument about home schooling. In my opinion, most people home school so they can indoctrinate their kids without any real world issues figuring in. It also makes it easier to keep your kids on the straight and narrow. Unfortunately, real world experience is a necessary evil in my opinion. The very narrow segment of life and different people that home schooled kids are exposed to keeps them very sheltered.

The public school system doesn't always live up to our expectations. It's part of why this country is great though. The only people who's opinions have any weight are those that have been involved in the system. Those that listen to politicians blather on about how we're wasting money on our education system are fools. IMO of course. We need a lot more money directed towards our education. We rank near the end of the list in civilized countries for our education. They need to put more money towards education, but spend it where it's needed, instead of just throwing it at the system and letting them waste millions on an astro turf football field. The current system of property taxes paying for the schools doesn't work. All the wealthy districts have all the best schools and equipment, while the poorer districts have trash. Just another reason for the huge difference between the wealthy and the poor. The better your education the better you make out in this country.

 

[Royd]

Quote:
If that was true we would have a totally non functioning society. Agreed that a percentage of our children in public schools do poorly. I'm sure that some homeschooled kids in a smaller percentage also do poorly.

I could introduce you to my kids. Or both of my sisters kids, or any number of other kids I have personally met that were public schooled and do quite well. How a child does in school has a lot more to do with parents and their home environment than it does the school.


It's too bad this thread is degenerating into the old self righteous argument about home schooling. In my opinion, most people home school so they can indoctrinate their kids without any real world issues figuring in. It also makes it easier to keep your kids on the straight and narrow. Unfortunately, real world experience is a necessary evil in my opinion. The very narrow segment of life and different people that home schooled kids are exposed to keeps them very sheltered.

Sir, I don't know where you have been, these last few years, but today's education system, from K-college, is one huge government indoctrination system, so, I guess you choose your poison.


The public school system doesn't always live up to our expectations. It's part of why this country is great though. The only people who's opinions have any weight are those that have been involved in the system. Those that listen to politicians blather on about how we're wasting money on our education system are fools. IMO of course.

Haven't we all been involved in the public school system? Why should a teacher, who's only desire is to get on the secure side of the tenure system, care about anything, beyond reaching their desired goal? Very few people have the moral capability to police themselves and do the right thing, when it's so much easier just to go along, to get along.



We need a lot more money directed towards our education. We rank near the end of the list in civilized countries for our education. They need to put more money towards education, but spend it where it's needed, instead of just throwing it at the system and letting them waste millions on an astro turf football field. The current system of property taxes paying for the schools doesn't work. All the wealthy districts have all the best schools and equipment, while the poorer districts have trash. Just another reason for the huge difference between the wealthy and the poor. The better your education the better you make out in this country.

Sadly, all that the powers that be, know how to do, is to throw money at a problem.....I was thinking about this, last night....Government's job should be to eliminate itself from peoples' lives, by being effecient. Instead, it becomes a huge, plodding machine, which will, eventually, get stuck in the mudhole of its own making, and completely grind to a halt.

Public sector unions retirement packages, local, state and federal, are completely unfunded, and you can only rob the private sector for so long.

 

[Ridgerunner]

On a different note, the voters in a local city recently rejected a millage increase for schools. Part of the millage was to go for new schools which are needed because the population has and is growing. If that were all that was in the millage, it would have probably passed. But there were also football stadium upgrades in the millage, upgrades to two stadiums, one pretty new. The voters rejected the stadium upgrades. Now the school board has to come back with another millage request because they really do need the new schools. I'm waiting to see if they try a millage without the stadium upgrades.

I agree with some other posters. Sometimes there is no choice on how money can be spent, whether it is from federal or state sources or a dedicated revenue stream, like a special millage. So before you get too upset with the members of your school board or the administrators, you need to see what their choices really were. However, sometimes they do have choices and you need to let them know what you would choose and why.

 

[Muggsmagee]

Quote:
If that was true we would have a totally non functioning society. Agreed that a percentage of our children in public schools do poorly. I'm sure that some homeschooled kids in a smaller percentage also do poorly.

I could introduce you to my kids. Or both of my sisters kids, or any number of other kids I have personally met that were public schooled and do quite well. How a child does in school has a lot more to do with parents and their home environment than it does the school.

It's too bad this thread is degenerating into the old self righteous argument about home schooling. In my opinion, most people home school so they can indoctrinate their kids without any real world issues figuring in. It also makes it easier to keep your kids on the straight and narrow. Unfortunately, real world experience is a necessary evil in my opinion. The very narrow segment of life and different people that home schooled kids are exposed to keeps them very sheltered.

The public school system doesn't always live up to our expectations. It's part of why this country is great though. The only people who's opinions have any weight are those that have been involved in the system. Those that listen to politicians blather on about how we're wasting money on our education system are fools. IMO of course. We need a lot more money directed towards our education. We rank near the end of the list in civilized countries for our education. They need to put more money towards education, but spend it where it's needed, instead of just throwing it at the system and letting them waste millions on an astro turf football field. The current system of property taxes paying for the schools doesn't work. All the wealthy districts have all the best schools and equipment, while the poorer districts have trash. Just another reason for the huge difference between the wealthy and the poor. The better your education the better you make out in this country.

For us, that couldn't be further from the truth! Don't overgeneralize from a biased point of view with little or no experience of your own to draw from. I personally wanted more time with my own children, that's why I chose to homeschool. We didn't homeschool our kids under a religious thumb, nor did we shelter them. The point in all of this is homeschooling is a valid option when sometimes people find no other. If you can give your child a better education at home vs the public school system, you'd be stupid NOT to do it.

I couldn't disagree with you more that we need more money for education. We don't. As a society, most of our kids take education for granted and could give two figs if they pursue it. Most homeschoolers I know have kids that have a LOVE for learning. Though I don't personally care for their teaching methods, learning is the point of schooling!

The better your education, the better you make out in this country? My husband has a bunch of college degrees, that basically look good on a resume, but the fields available are so limited, finding a job is near impossible in an area he would like to reside in. So he has had a FANTASTIC education (still paying on those loans) but that hasn't gotten him any further for it.

The schools that have the best test scores, usually get the best funding. So it isn't merely a matter of wealthy vs poor, but demographics within these school districts that play into the educational funding.

I can agree with you that a student with an active participating parent will do better in school. There's no question. That doesn't serve solely on the education of the student. The school is there to teach our kids. We are there to teach our kids. It goes hand in hand. And in case anyone forgets...the institutionalized public school system is only a century old. And in all this time, they still haven't worked out the kinks.

 

[mom'sfolly]

I think parents are also very important to a school's success and funding. I'm pretty active in my school's PTA. Our general rule of thumb is any money spent must benefit 80% or more of the students. Last year our giving campaign was targeted at technology. Because our's is an high performing, older school we were way down on the list for new technology. New schools and Title 1 schools get the goodies, but we had to wait. The district coughed up the money for document cameras, and the PTA paid for smart boards or slates for every classroom. Kindergarten and special ed got podiums, and music and art got the smart boards.

This year the PTA slashed funding for teacher education, but added funding for virtual field trips.

I also pay attention to bond issues. Bond money can only be spend on what is laid out in the bonding vote. Buyer's remorse on a twenty million dollar football stadium (usually referred to as "the Palace) meant a school building bond failed. BOOO HISSSS!!!! But the stadium is rented often, has district offices, and is not quite the boondoggle I expected. Our district is growing rapidly, and new schools are needed. The next bond issue that passed had fewer schools, and less land for new schools, but also stream lined a few things. New elementary schools were all going to be built by the same plan, costing less in the long haul.

We also now have a position of District Advocate as a member of the PTA. This person's job is to represent the issues and needs of our school at board meetings. We also have a PTA grant writer, and a vice-principal who is active in writing grants.

Just for kicks: here's the football stadium and the Performing Arts Center. Both are used by middle and high schools in the district. The PAC also serves as gallery space.


http://www.roundrockisd.org/index.aspx?page=3708

http://www.roundrockisd.org/Modules/ShowDocument.aspx?documentid=9614

http://www.pvillepanthers.com/stad-rrisd.html

 

[woodmort]

Some thoughts before this thread is locked:

My mother was an excellent teacher but, in 1928 she was forced to quit teaching because she got married. No other reason except female teachers could not be married. My wife was an excellent teacher but she was forced to quit in 1960 because she was pregnant. No other reason except she was with child. It was these kinds of arbitrary rules that forced tenure laws and teachers' unions on the public schools. Unless you've done it, you have no idea how hard it is to teach while looking over your shoulder worrying about offending some crackpot parent who has no idea of what the teacher is trying to do. Granted there are incompetent teachers that have tenure but that is neither the fault of the unions nor of the tenure laws, it lies with those who gave them tenure in the first place, usually incompetent administrators who have no idea of what does or does not constitute good teaching.

As far as homeschooling is concerned. IMHO unless parents are doing this for religious reasons there is no real good reason for it. If one is that concerned about their child's education chances are the child will do well whether he/she is in school or not because the parents will be involved. If the child is not in school, however, he/she is being deprived of the social contact with his/her peers which is as much a part of education as reading, 'riting and 'rithmetic. There is a lot more to one's education than learning stuff. (As a way of disclosure: my grandson was homeschooled through 4th grade. While he learned a lot, he had a problem making friends. It wasn't until he went to public school that he blossomed socially.) Besides, given the complexity of some of the more advanced subjects, I doubt very much as getting a book or computer program will allow someone who has never had the subject to teach it. In which case, homeschooling is a determent to the child's future.

If this country is going to continue as a free society with the possibility of the "American Dream" to be realized then public education is the only way to go. Otherwise we'll create an elitist society where those that are lucky enough to be able to afford the education will be successful and the rest will be left behind. Unfortunately there are always going to be a problem funding it as well as with those whose educational experiences color what they think should be taught and how. There is no simple solution. The only way to arrive at one is through rational and educated debate--leave one's emotions out of it. As I said in an earlier post we have to involve competent educators--primarily good classroom teachers--into this revision. Currently, with a few exceptions, this is not being done.

As far as funding is concerned. My Dad, who was a school administrator, used to remind those that complained about their school taxes that someone paid for their education now it was their turn. I guess when it comes to funding schools, we must "pay it forward".

 

[Muggsmagee]

mom'sfolly :

I think parents are also very important to a school's success and funding. I'm pretty active in my school's PTA. Our general rule of thumb is any money spent must benefit 80% or more of the students. Last year our giving campaign was targeted at technology. Because our's is an high performing, older school we were way down on the list for new technology. New schools and Title 1 schools get the goodies, but we had to wait. The district coughed up the money for document cameras, and the PTA paid for smart boards or slates for every classroom. Kindergarten and special ed got podiums, and music and art got the smart boards.

This year the PTA slashed funding for teacher education, but added funding for virtual field trips.

I also pay attention to bond issues. Bond money can only be spend on what is laid out in the bonding vote. Buyer's remorse on a twenty million dollar football stadium (usually referred to as "the Palace) meant a school building bond failed. BOOO HISSSS!!!! But the stadium is rented often, has district offices, and is not quite the boondoggle I expected. Our district is growing rapidly, and new schools are needed. The next bond issue that passed had fewer schools, and less land for new schools, but also stream lined a few things. New elementary schools were all going to be built by the same plan, costing less in the long haul.

We also now have a position of District Advocate as a member of the PTA. This person's job is to represent the issues and needs of our school at board meetings. We also have a PTA grant writer, and a vice-principal who is active in writing grants.

Just for kicks: here's the football stadium and the Performing Arts Center. Both are used by middle and high schools in the district. The PAC also serves as gallery space.


http://www.roundrockisd.org/index.aspx?page=3708

http://www.roundrockisd.org/Modules/ShowDocument.aspx?documentid=9614

http://www.pvillepanthers.com/stad-rrisd.html

I like the position of District Advocate. Even though the taxpayers, parents, teachers all have a say...one representative helps.

So your district uses bonds for future funding? I need to wrap my brain around that.

As far as the smart boards...aren't those great? My MIL was the technology coordinator and had every class room in the district supplied with them a few years back. My DD told me she can order her lunch in the morning on them, and the cafeteria cooks/prepares what is needed and this keeps their waste WAY down. Huge money savings. So the smart board has more uses than just classroom learning. They are fantastic....ummm until the power goes out, I suppose!

 

[tinychicky]

i can't stand how people always seem to put sports before anything else! other classes are just as, if not more importent! our high school is doing the same thing- that nice sledding hill we all went to is now flattened into yet another field for the stupid football team, while in art class we have to deal with cheap paint and old brushes! can't they just spread the funds evenly throughout the school instead of focusing on getting more sports equiptment every year!? i mean, our sports teams aren't even that good.....