Tatanka Breeders Club: Meat Quail project with history, discussion, pictures and videos

[Chaneys Ranch]

Excellent point, Da Falcomer. There is more to it than selecting by simply bird and egg size to develop a healthy animal. I come from an equine background and have seen narrow minded selectibe breeding ruin two noble breeds. The paint breeders and apaloosa breeders ruined both breeds by breeding just for color. The native americans developed them for hunting and hardiness for 300 years and white folks ruined them in about 70 years by indiscriminantly breeding them into tall, awkward creatures with bad feet. They were supposed to be nimble, surefooted, fast and brave. I'm glad to hear that some here are breeding for more than just size. I hope to select breeders (within the guidelines for tatankas, of course) with a more docile demeanor than my current browns. Its a good thing they aren't flight conditioned or I would have lost one today.

Too close for comfort.

Mine are meant for food mostly for us, so big is better IF they are strong and healthy. We also eat a lot of quail eggs, i grab a handful of hard boiled eggs for lunch, pretty tasty! I have about 130 that are about ready to process. I do 20 in an evening and just marinate and seal em up. Try to get several in the freezer for summer. Once they are laying, I know its time to process roos. I can usually sell quads, but will process hens if they don't sell quick. I usually only hatch every 6 months to swap out my breeders, and put a bunch in the freezer. There's some I keep no matter what, they are pets. but I try not to get attached to all of them!

 

[Tammy N]

Sill, I said the bigger eggs of the same Coturnix breed that are being called the Tatanka. I am not saying a bigger egg from another breed. Your right that it takes longer for them to hatch, but no longer for the cellular division. The breed hasn't changed just that time it takes to get out of the egg. A lot of the time I see fecal matter in the hatched egg, this isn't right. This tells me the chick is slow or sluggish because it has already used it's food source, it has been bred to be huge not healthy. Also some of these huge eggs are defective, and in my opinion are some of the chicks problems. For a lack of a better term the eggs are not "egg shaped" ie long thin, come to a point, have bumps in them or ribs. I believe all eggs are pretty much the same shape because the chick needs it not only to grow in but also to hatch out of. This is why I choose to hatch the select eggs that barely fit the quail trays, look like eggs, but may not be the largest ones my hens lay. I don't need to redesign/reconstruct a tray to hatch chicks that need special care the first week because they are basically being hatched starved. I am using trays I can buy, hatch healthy chicks I can mix with other chicks a few days older and not have a problem.

Da Falconer , where did you Get your Info and also Your eggs ?
you make some really hard statements about the Tatanka I do not raise them but i know people that Do and love them. So maybe you got someones Sick birds that was not healthy but to insinuate that all of the birds lay deformed eggs , are sick, babies tale special care . I'm thinking you might of got a bad batch , Ive had Bad turkey eggs sent or there might of been eggs in that egg carton of poop . ive also had show birds sent to me for top dollar with Disease . I don't blaime the animals I blaime the breeders so more info please where did you get your Tatanka

 

[Da Falconer]

Tammy N you can answer your own questions. If you place a Coturnix quail egg next to a Tatanka are they exactly they same except proportionally? No, they are not. Why did a well know university develope a quail for food, also conturnix, but it is mixed? ie has different genes mixed in, instead of just breeding for "mutant" size? Oh yeah! The Mutant part! I'm sure there are people out there that just love thier birds, just like there are dog lovers out there that love some of the breeds us humans have come up with. Here is a short clip " Texas A&M University researchers have developed a heavily muscled, light-fleshed coturnix strain that attains a live weight of 10 to 13 ounces at slaughter age of 7 weeks. Smaller coturnix strains yield small, dark-fleshed carcasses less desirable as a gourmet item. " note the word "strain" to read more google Texas A&M Conturnix Quail. There are humans that have the "giant gene" also, most have health issues too, as do most animals bred for size, again Google works great for information in this area. PBS has documentarys on the subjects also, check your local stations, you can even watch full length shows right on your iPad.
I use 3 full grown quail a day (more if feeding younger) on a slow day, if I have any visitors that is doubled. I have 2 incubators that never shut off hatching chicks every 2-3 days so as to has fresh birds on hand. I get my information first hand working every day with birds. I bred the Tatanka up, then back down again. Breeding for a "mutant" huge bird may be fun and cute. May even be OK for a short run to put a few on the table for human consumption but Max (the photo) really doesn't care if the quail if huge or skinny. He does like eating day old chicks, hawks and birds of prey like the yoke sack. The yoke sack is absent in the Tatanka chicks. Google why there should be a yoke sack and what it is for. I remember from 4-H (40 some years ago) the yoke sack was the food source for the first few hours of the chicks life, no yoke sack no food right? Sound like I am thinking correct, getting info from university's and working with birds daily, not to mention being federally licensed?

 

[Tammy N]

I can not Answer the same Question I do not have Tatanka Quail. So dont assume please .
this is all interesting But i see no proof of the Sick unhealthy birds like i said i bought show chickens that came sick.
they had many issues but for the yolk sack i am sorry a egg has to have one to form.

this is interesting i may try some Tatanka to see if this is all true

 

[Da Falconer]

Tammy, the yoke sack, not yoke. Again try Google. A yoke sack is in the chick after it hatches, the food for its first few hours of life (all chicks are like this not just quail) Why you can leave the chicks in the incubator up to 12 hours after they hatch.

 

[Fat Daddy]

Tammy N you can answer your own questions. If you place a Coturnix quail egg next to a Tatanka are they exactly they same except proportionally? No, they are not. Why did a well know university develope a quail for food, also conturnix, but it is mixed? ie has different genes mixed in, instead of just breeding for "mutant" size? Oh yeah! The Mutant part! I'm sure there are people out there that just love thier birds, just like there are dog lovers out there that love some of the breeds us humans have come up with. Here is a short clip " Texas A&M University researchers have developed a heavily muscled, light-fleshed coturnix strain that attains a live weight of 10 to 13 ounces at slaughter age of 7 weeks. Smaller coturnix strains yield small, dark-fleshed carcasses less desirable as a gourmet item. " note the word "strain" to read more google Texas A&M Conturnix Quail. There are humans that have the "giant gene" also, most have health issues too, as do most animals bred for size, again Google works great for information in this area. PBS has documentarys on the subjects also, check your local stations, you can even watch full length shows right on your iPad.
I use 3 full grown quail a day (more if feeding younger) on a slow day, if I have any visitors that is doubled. I have 2 incubators that never shut off hatching chicks every 2-3 days so as to has fresh birds on hand. I get my information first hand working every day with birds. I bred the Tatanka up, then back down again. Breeding for a "mutant" huge bird may be fun and cute. May even be OK for a short run to put a few on the table for human consumption but Max (the photo) really doesn't care if the quail if huge or skinny. He does like eating day old chicks, hawks and birds of prey like the yoke sack. The yoke sack is absent in the Tatanka chicks. Google why there should be a yoke sack and what it is for. I remember from 4-H (40 some years ago) the yoke sack was the food source for the first few hours of the chicks life, no yoke sack no food right? Sound like I am thinking correct, getting info from university's and working with birds daily, not to mention being federally licensed?

Mr Da Falconer. You seem to have a internet PHD from google. And thats just fine, But most of the above is just straight out horse feathers.... If you'll check back at the start of this thread, you'll find that it clearly states, every "Tatanka" that has ever existed, its ancestors were passed by me. Also if you read the thread, it clearly states that even with in this line of birds, they must hit several "marks" to be considered a "Tatanka"... If I send you eggs from pure stock, all the chicks you hatch will not make it to these standards. So to say you "bred Tatankas up and then back down again", is simply, by definition not true... While on that subject, we both know you do not have "Tatanka" stock at all. Again, if you actually read the thread, you have never been able to buy these eggs. 90% of the stewards. Did'nt have a breeding flock for long. We kept in touch! There just were not that many that actually received eggs. Some lost interest after the fad worn off, some lost their birds to dogs, coons or yotes. Some simply did not have the skills needed to hatch, brood and raise birds of any sort and failed... The rest I still talk to almost daily at Flock University, http://flock-u.org/forum/index.php I can say for fact, you sir were never sent Tatanka eggs. As far as the "yoke sack" statement, again pure horse feathers. Tatankas hatch in the same time as any other coturnix period. You see I DO have first hand experience here too, Not only with coturnix but most other game birds, chickens and other barnyard fowl. I am still in contact the vast majority of the folks in the first half of this thread daily. I can back up every thing just said with REAL first hand experience and the people who actually did it! Bill, Fat Daddy,

 

[Da Falconer]

Mr Bill, I'm not a PhD but just a US Congressional Appointee to Anappolis, former USMC disabled. I hold 5 degrees. I enlisted as a grunt at 17 years old, farm boy. I need to ask what part about the yoke sack is "horse feathers" considering 20-25% of a chicks body weight at hatching is yoke sack?

 

[Fat Daddy]

Quote:

I need to ask what part about the yoke sack is "horse feathers" considering 20-25% of a chicks body weight at hatching is yoke sack?

 

[dt1958]

I myself would like to know from whom did mr falcon obtain his Tatanka's from ??? They definitely didn't come from me that's for sure !!!

 

[Da Falconer]

Sorry for the delay in responding Mr Bill, if you go back and read the conversation from the start it is about the larger eggs not fitting the quail trays. My oppinion is that the larger eggs produce a chick that hatches late and is slower than the others. When I inspected the hatched eggs I noticed fecal matter inside, this tells me the chick had been sitting in its own waste. Also, as stated earlier, I feed day old chicks to my falcons as treats. They like the yoke sack, in these slower chicks the yoke sack is absent. This tells me that the sack has already been absorbed and the chick has basically been starving or at best malnutritioned.

I was PM that the Tatanka was nothing more than a jumbo Conturnix, I was unaware that you trade marked the name and private branded the strain much like the Texas A&M. Your strain must not be doing as well as the A&M because I have not heard of it before now being as special strain with set standards all coming from one source.