The Evolution of Atlas: A Breeding (and Chat) Thread

[speckledhen]

Happy Thanksgiving, Friends!
I am especially thankful for my good friends and wonderful family, you guys are the best

We have a good group here, don't we? Hope everyone is having a good time with family. Amanda graced me with her 3rd egg in a week! From now on, she shall be called Amanda the Wonder Hen. How long this laying spurt will continue is anyone's guess. Last year, she went until the middle of April.

Betsy's crop was much smaller this a.m. and pliable first thing, not super doughy. She only drank water and rested all day yesterday. Today, I cut up some chicken in tiny pieces from the rotisserie chicken and she was very interested in eating that. She probably ate no more than the are of a quarter, all in all, but she is getting high protein, no grain food. And when I took a yogurt cup of a tablespoon of plain yogurt with the few unsweetened apple pieces from the jar of my dad's canned apples, she pecked around in that, too. Have to check her crop this evening and tomorrow a.m. to see if it's really getting better.

 

[speckledhen]

Okay, I have another mystery here. Now, Bailey, my very dark partridge Brahma who is in molt (on the upswing of feathers coming in like gangbusters) has a doughy crop. WTH? No birds in any other pens have issues, even the very old ones and the ones in hard molts like Zara. She looked like she didn't feel great just like Betsy and Bonnie, but Bonnie's crop is just fine. I put Bailey in the cage with Betsy last night so I could see if it was nothing, but she has stuff in her crop this a.m., though it did go down a good bit from last night, seems to be a tad sluggish.

So, what is going on with the Brahmas? This makes me wonder if the group encountered something on range, maybe a dead animal my cat left and picked at it. I know I'm grasping at straws here.

The Brahmas are my biggest eaters. I fill their feeder more than any other pen. They chow down like they're starving sometimes, especially B.J. There have been no food changes, same feed brand they've had since they were chicks, both starter, layer and scratch grain mix. I'm at a loss here. But, if they can't molt without a crop problem, I can't keep them. They are half sisters, at the very least, same sire, could be same mother, in case there is a genetic component, but I can't think of what that would be to cause this and if it was, why it would not show up sooner than a year and a half old. I hate mysteries.

 

[getaclue]

It does sound like they got into something while ranging. Even tho Betsy's crop is still sluggish, it's doing better, so that's a good sign. Do the same thing for Baily. I'm wondering if a little grit would help them some too.

 

[speckledhen]

I'm putting grit in whatever they eat and both have been outside to pick up grit on their own-they can't miss picking up grit on this property, it's covered with it.

I hope they don't tend to crop issues like the Blue Orps I had. That is genetic and passed along in some lines. Dusty's half-sister, Smoky, had pendulous crop and Smoky's daughter did. I lost both Velvet, my first blue Orp hen, and Skye, another one, to crop issues. Thankfully, Dusty had only the one bout of it at the end of her life, but otherwise was a butt-kicking tough gal right up until the day she kicked the bucket.

 

[speckledhen]

Well, I let them go back. They were both clamoring to get out when Bash and the others went out the door, especially Betsy. And both their crops are fairly small balls so I let them out to free range with their sisters. I'm about to the point that I hope I've aided in the healing enough that the crop will begin to regulate itself, sort of like Dusty's did after a week of treatment. They are out in the sunshine, beautiful cool weather, acting completely energized. Bash didn't even try to mate Betsy, which surprised me. If I lose one or both, well, they had something wrong I could not fix, I suppose. Better they act as normally as possible. I'll just restrict grains for that group, even though the scratch I buy has grit mixed into it already. We'll see. I can't do much more for Betsy now, after going on two weeks of treatment. She is acting energetic and interested in stuff out there, so she's very happy to have been released.

What is weird is that Brandy, who never really got back into the group well after her last broody spell, and Bonnie, the other Blue Partridge hen, went back to their barn pen and are staying inside while the others range far and wide. Brandy gained her weight back from being broody and Bonnie has gained a lot of hers back as well from her molt and last broody spell, and both are at the very tail end of their molts. Brandy never started back laying after her last broody spell and she pants a lot, which is mildly concerning in this cool weather. Bonnie sits a lot underneath the roost in a back corner, for no reason that I can determine. Crops are perfectly fine on those two.

 

[robhuncor]

Well, I don't talk much, I'm mainly a listener but I've lived with poultry my whole (long!) life and the last 20 years I have bred and raised many different breeds. I just love the big heavy breeds but I've noticed that, conformation-wise, they seem to tend toward pendulous crops which often brings on crop issues. Right now my biggest hens are Bielefelders. They are huge, beautiful and such sweet gentle souls but because of the way they are built, their crops just tend to hang down, especially when full. I also think that the older they get, the crops kind of get stretched out. The more upright hens are less likely to have problems, I think.
It sounds like you've taken good advice, used your own expertise and done everything you can. Once you've done that, whatever happens, you know you've done all you can and you just have to wait and see.

 

[robhuncor]

By the way, even if they did eat something dead, unless it was poisoned, it should not be a problem. I've heard of old-timers bringing home road kill for their chickens - disgusting as that sounds!!!

 

[speckledhen]

Well, I don't talk much, I'm mainly a listener but I've lived with poultry my whole (long!) life and the last 20 years I have bred and raised many different breeds. I just love the big heavy breeds but I've noticed that, conformation-wise, they seem to tend toward pendulous crops which often brings on crop issues. Right now my biggest hens are Bielefelders. They are huge, beautiful and such sweet gentle souls but because of the way they are built, their crops just tend to hang down, especially when full. I also think that the older they get, the crops kind of get stretched out. The more upright hens are less likely to have problems, I think.
It sounds like you've taken good advice, used your own expertise and done everything you can. Once you've done that, whatever happens, you know you've done all you can and you just have to wait and see.

Thanks, Robin. After free ranging, Betsy's crop is a tiny ball and Bailey's is big. So, maybe I should put Betsy back and give Bailey a day or two of special treatment and then put her back as well, unless her crop goes down before then.

I was not going to get more big chickens, though I love them, because of the issues with the Orpingtons I had over the years, but I fell in love with a blue partridge Brahma rooster I saw on the web and since I'd had two hatchery hens I loved, I wanted more. But, one of those two girls, Caroline, my Buff Brahma, had pendulous crop, so you may be onto something here. We had to watch her for sour crop and impacted crop for the last three years of her life. Much as I adore Bash, especially, I may end up phasing out the Brahmas, though I really have enjoyed them. They do eat more than any other birds here, plus with this crop stuff coming up again, maybe they do tend toward that and I can't keep dealing with it.
Any suggestions for a smaller bodied, but not necessarily Leghorn-ish type, bird that lays pretty well and is not a big eater, that could free range with a mixed group?

By the way, even if they did eat something dead, unless it was poisoned, it should not be a problem. I've heard of old-timers bringing home road kill for their chickens - disgusting as that sounds!!!

I know, but I am just grasping at straws. Should not be a problem, no, and I certainly cannot do a property sweep to chicken-proof acreage, nor should I really have to.

 

[oldhenlikesdogs]

There are lots of good breeds, are you looking for show quality or it doesn't matter?

I find my hatchery birds to be a bit more healthy than some show bred birds which are big and gorgeous.

I will have to see if my English chocolate Orpingtons are more prone to problems than the hatchery stock. Hatchery stock lays better in general too.

 

[speckledhen]

There are lots of good breeds, are you looking for show quality or it doesn't matter?

I find my hatchery birds to be a bit more healthy than some show bred birds which are big and gorgeous.

I will have to see if my English chocolate Orpingtons are more prone to problems than the hatchery stock. Hatchery stock lays better in general too.

Show quality does not matter, per se, except I do like them to look like the breed they're supposed to look like. I quit hatchery stock because they all died of reproductive malfunctions, one by one, as they passed two years old, they started dropping. And three times over the years, after my first Speckled Sussex hen, Nelda, died of a crop issue, oddly enough (got her from a hatch of eggs bought from Gina Rinks in TN), I tried the Speckled Sussex from Ideal and every single pullet I got had some malfunction of the crop or they failed to thrive. When I quit getting hatchery stock, I quit seeing egg issues almost entirely, with only a couple of exceptions. And later on, I got a NH and a Buff Orp from Mt. Healthy, but sold them before they laid one egg, they were such skinny birds.

So, I'm leery of hatchery birds, or at least, those that are the common ones at feed stores in the spring. I had one Silver Phoenix hen from Ideal that I really liked, but she died unexpectedly after being broody for a long time-her chicks were two weeks old when we found her dead and her chicks scared to death, so thank goodness my Belgian D'anver hen was also raising chicks and took them in with hers. She was beautiful, and of course, much smaller bodied than most all my other LF hens.

But, to answer your question better, I don't necessarily mind them being hatchery birds if they'd look like they were supposed to. But I"ll never again get RIR, BR, SS, Orps or any Wyandottes from hatcheries. Bad luck on all of those. Phoenix, maybe. I think my best layers have been my accidental crosses like Rita. I think Tom is really ready to go back to a mixed flock with a couple of look-out roosters that are small and won't hurt the hens with their antics, like my Xander. He was hatchery, but he also had two side sprigs on his comb. In my case, it didn't matter because he had big hens he could not breed successfully and if he bred the Belgian D'Anvers, the side sprigs would not matter being combined with their rose combs. That is a fun cross we made, what Ladyhawk called our designer chicken, the Coch'Anver.