The Great Egg Shipping Experiment!

[ronott1]

I love it!

I just found(got an ovation) for the first post I posted regarding the resting tips from Aveca's vet. The recommendation back then was to leave them on the turner for 7 to 14 days!

We have really come a long way with this technique for sure.

 

[Henny]

I have learned so much from this thread--beginning to end. I just started incubating 24 shipped eggs today. First time incubating with shipped eggs. None broken. New to candling and unsure I think I might have one air cell that is like a level--the cell moves down the length of the egg and a second egg might have loose air cells floating around. I let them all sit for 22 hrs at room temp and then put them in the incubator with 22 eggs in the turner and 2 broken celled ones nearby to rest longer without turning. I'm unsure of the incubator temp as at one point I had about 8 thermometers (could've had more but ran out of nearby stores with different ones!) half reading 99.9 and the other half 101--so I'm hoping it's within that range and not higher! I'm using the default setting on the Hovabator 1588. The humidity ranges from 35-45%. Wish me luck!
I just wanted to add that I enjoy reading articles on the internet. If anyone is interested I found a cockatiel website that had many pictures associated with incubation and hatching. It explained so much about candling, assisting with hatches, examining eggs that didn't hatch. It has great pictures even though they are of cockatiels not chicks the same principles apply. Here are the links--make sure you scroll to the bottoms of the pages for the pictures..
http://www.justcockatiels.net/assist-hatches.html
http://www.internationalcockatielresource.com/candling-eggs.html
http://www.internationalcockatielresource.com/breakouthellipthe-inside-story.html
http://www.internationalcockatielresource.com/assisted-hatches-updated.html

 

[ronott1]

I have learned so much from this thread--beginning to end. I just started incubating 24 shipped eggs today. First time incubating with shipped eggs. None broken. New to candling and unsure I think I might have one air cell that is like a level--the cell moves down the length of the egg and a second egg might have loose air cells floating around. I let them all sit for 22 hrs at room temp and then put them in the incubator with 22 eggs in the turner and 2 broken celled ones nearby to rest longer without turning. I'm unsure of the incubator temp as at one point I had about 8 thermometers (could've had more but ran out of nearby stores with different ones!) half reading 99.9 and the other half 101--so I'm hoping it's within that range and not higher! I'm using the default setting on the Hovabator 1588. The humidity ranges from 35-45%. Wish me luck!
I just wanted to add that I enjoy reading articles on the internet. If anyone is interested I found a cockatiel website that had many pictures associated with incubation and hatching. It explained so much about candling, assisting with hatches, examining eggs that didn't hatch. It has great pictures even though they are of cockatiels not chicks the same principles apply. Here are the links--make sure you scroll to the bottoms of the pages for the pictures..
http://www.justcockatiels.net/assist-hatches.html
http://www.internationalcockatielresource.com/candling-eggs.html
http://www.internationalcockatielresource.com/breakouthellipthe-inside-story.html
http://www.internationalcockatielresource.com/assisted-hatches-updated.html

It all sounds good so far!

 

[Henny]

Oh thank you! That means alot to me! Will update next time I candle--in 1 week.

 

[ozexpat]

i just got candling data completed for march 24 set


expected set viable
sally sunshine WFS 36 33 White Faced Spanish 6**
sally sunshine B 3 3 Blue Partridge Brahma 1**
piglett NE 11 11 New England Whites/mixes 8
piglett S 2 2 Silkies 0
piglett BO2 24 23 Buff Orpington 22
La Palma Chicks BBR 18 18 Banty Barred Rocks 17
La Palma Chicks BBC 10 10 Banty Barred Cochin 2
La Palma Chicks NH 4 4 New Hampshire 3
La Palma Chicks SF1 12 19 Swedish Flower Hens 8
La Palma Chicks PR1 6 19 Silver Pencilled Rocks 14
La Palma Chicks RR2 12 1 Rhode Island Reds 2
Phage AM 3 3 mottles americauna 0**
Phage M 6 6 Maran 1**
Phage BLRW 8 8 Blue Laced red wyandotte 2**
Phage CL 6 6 crème legbars 5**
OGM SA1 4 1 Salmon Faverolles 1
OGM PH 2 2 Houdans 1
OGM C 5 5 BBS Cochin 3
OGM PR2 20 17 Silver Pencilled Rocks 13
OGM SF2 5 5 Swedish Flower Hens 5
Rarefeatherfarms BF 18 19 Breda Fowl 12
Hangtown Farms bp 3 3 black penedesenca 2**
Hangtown Farms we 3 3 white empordanesa 2**
Hangtown Farms cp 6 6 crele penedesenca 3**
SurvivalSeeds SA2 30 32 Salmon Faverolles 21**
Dblott1 BB1 18 20 Black Bresse 7
mullinschickenranch BB2 12 15 Black Bresse 10
icpb123 MH 6 6 Mottled Houdan 4
juddlisa BCM 30 36 Black Copper Marans 27
323 336 13 202
** eggs within packaging sustained visible damage in transit

 

[Sally Sunshine]

My articles are there for helping, THEY WILL NEVER REPLACE YOUR OWN RESEARCH AND "HOMEWORK"!
Take time to read the links I have provided in the article, for the article is not based on HEARSAY! This is how the article started, there was way way too much hearsay and I was thoroughly confused at ever turn! I dove in to research for PROOF, and in turn this is how the articles have come about. especially the HATCHING 101 Article!


@ronott1 if you have suggestions for changes I would love to here about them, I don't want to take over wishers wonderful thread by any means, although this is still on topic, if can be moved to the diary thread if @Wisher1000 so ummm wishes.

here is a paste of the shipping section as well as the turning sections from the HATCHING 101 Article, ALWAYS there for your reference,

Setting Eggs & Turning
It is important to ALWAYS wash your hands before handling your hatching eggs!
It is likewise important to SANITIZE your incubator AND equipment before AND after use!
Omphalitis, yolk sack infection is caused by a bacterium that enters through the porous egg shell and easily kills embryo's and newly hatched chicks. Unfortunately, incubation conditions are ideal for breeding bacteria as well as incubating eggs.
​

WHY IS EGG TURNING IMPORTANT EVEN WITH SHIPPED EGGS?​

REMINDER to see the Shipped eggs section of the article and to treat every shipped egg differently as its air cell is presented to you!​

Failure to turn eggs during incubation CLEARLY​

reduces hatchability in every scholarly study and every clinical trial. ​

http://www.aviagen.com/assets/Tech_Center/BB_Resources_Tools/Hatchery_How_Tos/08HowTo8EggTurningEN.pdf
Also SEE HERE for DETAILED Scientific explanations of WHY TURNING IS IMPORTANT!
HUBBARDS GUIDES: http://www.hubbardbreeders.com/managementguides/Incubation%20guide%20(english).pdf

WHAT FACTORS ARE IMPORTANT FOR EGG TURNING?
Frequency of Turning, Angle of Turning, Smoothness/Gentleness of Turning
SIGNS OF TURNING INADEQUACY
Increased Deaths
Malpositions
Sticky Chicks due to unabsorbed Albumen
We were able to demonstrate that it is critical to turn eggs for at least the first three days of incubation and better for the first seven. READ MORE HERE and HERE
The effects of turning during a critical period for turning, from 3 to 7 days of incubation, were also recorded. Generally, failure to turn eggs retarded growth of the area vasculosa. Turning during the critical period stimulated the extent of growth of the area vasculosa by day 7 of incubation and of subsequent embryonic growth by day 14. Incubation at low temperature resulted both in reduced expansion of the area vasculosa and retarded embryonic growth in a pattern similar to that observed for unturned eggs. It is suggested that turning stimulates development of blood vessels in the area vasculosa via localized increases in blood pressure.


Only add room temperature eggs to your incubator to prevent SWEATING. Sweating/Condensation weakens the egg's natural defense mechanisms, providing an ideal environment for the growth of bacteria and penetrated through the shell pores and kill the embryo. Eggs can be laid on their sides or placed in turning tray with pointed end down/big air cell end up. For shipped eggs, please refer to SHIPPED EGGS section of this article.

Mark eggs, using a pencil, with an X on one side and an O on the other. Make sure to turn the eggs at least 3 times a day, or odd number of times. Turning by hand they should always be turned an odd amount of times and move them to a different part of the tray to protect them from temperature variation. You basically roll the eggs with your fingers/palm from X to O. It is important to NOT ROLL the eggs in the same direction every time. Improper rolling can cause the chalazae that holds the yolk in place to tear. Turning the egg prevents the embryo from touching and attaching to the membrane inside the egg. The most convenient way to turn eggs is to purchase an egg turner. Take extra precautions when turning eggs during the first week of incubation. The developing embryos have delicate blood vessels that rupture easily when severely jarred or shaken, thus killing the embryo.


When adding Eggs the temperature will immediately drop. DO NOT ADJUST THE THERMOSTAT, or risk accidentally cooking them. Wait 2/4 hours and if the temperature is still low, make a small adjustment, as small as you can. (Note: Small adjustments on the manual Styrofoam incubators make BIG changes!)
















Shipped Eggs = Change Of Plans!
Shipped eggs have a MUCH lower hatch rate, even with experienced hatchers!
The following Word File can be used when ordering shipped eggs,
it is our suggestion that you copy/paste/edit to help you get the best eggs possible.


An open letter to egg shippers.doc 27k .doc file


It’s always best to get local eggs to get the best hatch rate. Sources for eggs are to search the BYC buy sell trade section, Craigslist and eBay. Your local thread on BYC may be the best bet for local eggs! Look for your local site in the “Social section” “Where am I? Where are You!” on BYC.

BELOW ROLLING AIR CELL OF A SHIPPED EGG
Rolls like a Carpenters Level



UNDERSTANDING what goes WRONG with SHIPPED EGGS
The yolk of an egg is held in place on each end by what is called Chalaza. These are delicate cords that keep the yolk centered in the egg. When you crack open an egg, you notice a white stringy thing on the yolk, this is the Chalaza. When eggs are shipped they encounter postal handlers that toss the packages, sorting machinery, bumpy vehicle rides, temperature changes and possibly X-ray Machines! So by the time the eggs get to you they are pretty much scrambled inside. So if you are going to buy eggs and have them shipped to you, be aware that the viability drops TREMENDOUSLY. There are rare instances when they ALL arrive safely but it is always a gamble.
See Egg anatomy here http://www.geauga4h.org/poultry/egg_parts.htm



CONCLUSION ~ Shipped eggs
If an egg has a normal intact air cell PLEASE TREAT IT AS A NORMAL EGG!
PLEASE PLEASE READ THE TURNING SECTION of this article FIRST!

For rolling, detached or disrupted air cells
(cells no longer at fat end of the egg but like a bubble level on the long side, rolling or saddle shaped cells), you’ll need to change your hatch plan. These eggs need to sit and settle to room temp 12-24 hours NO TURNING, pointy end down in a Egg Carton to possibly reattach air cells.

For SETTING in the incubator......

If your air cell is ROLLING end to end do not turn for 36-48 hours of the first incubation hours to help air cell re-attach and in some cases are really bad loose air cell should not be turned either, if after 48 hours and you have embryo growth and the air cell is still completely loose, do not turn another 24 hours.

If air cells are saddle shaped but intact (meaning not jiggly) I put them in the turner and begin with the gentle turning or you can turn by hand in the carton by simply tilting side to side, see image below.

TREATMENT AT LOCKDOWN.......
I personally have found that any shipped egg that survives to day 18 lockdown has an awkward but re-attached air cell so I lay my eggs down for hatch. Please refer to day 18 lockdown for more information on why laying eggs for hatching after day 18 is the best way to go.

REMINDER~ Never Set COLD eggs in the incubator.



Below image are Eggs in A Carton with Bottoms cut out for Ventilation



Below image of Turning damaged air cell Shipped Eggs, just lean to opposite side.
​

 

[ronott1]

@ronott1 if you have suggestions for changes I would love to here about them, I don't want to take over wishers wonderful thread by any means, although this is still on topic, if can be moved to the diary thread if @Wisher1000 so ummm wishes.

Keep up the good work!

 

[bamadude]

Chicken nerd fight after school. Lol

 

[ronott1]

Chicken nerd fight after school. Lol

It's all good now!

 

[ozexpat]

time for a group hug