The Heritage Rhode Island Red Site

[FOGELLY]

I knew someone would challenge me on that.

According to this hatchery, their Rhode Island Reds lay 250-300 eggs per year, and their Black Sex-Links lay 200 eggs a year. The Black Sex-Links do not lay as well as Red Sex-Links.

They sell Production Reds also, and they lay the same number of eggs as the Rhode Island Reds. The Rhode Island Reds also do as well as the Red Sex-Links. There are only a few hybrids that can lay more brown eggs than the Rhode Island Red.


http://www.cacklehatchery.com/rhodeislandrdpage.html

http://www.cacklehatchery.com/blacksexlinkpage.html

Is your conclusion based on your own personal experience or by compairing write ups in a catalog or website? I been keeping a record of my hens production and if I get over 180 a year I will be more than happy.

 

[greathorse]

Bob, that is a nice bird. I have one that looks a bit like him, but needs more keel. He does have a nice flat back like that. I finally got a picture of him and will get it loaded up as soon as I figure out how to do that. I would love your and other's opinion on the bird.

 

[Bullitt]

So your using only Cackles versions of birds to compare notes to. I'd say if that's all they could muster(200 eggs annually) out of their cross to make BSL's they better find a different source of stock to breed from. IF you cross a production type RIR or New Hampshire breed(Male) from a a breeder flock of chickens that the hens lay in the neighborhood of 300 eggs annually onto Barred Rock(females) that lays around the same number of eggs per year and DON'T get a hybrid BSL that lays at least the same amount or that actually lays more eggs than the parent stock lays due to heterosis(hybrid vigor), then there's definitely something wrong with the picture. You might need to look somewhere else for better info and get away form the hatchery adds to begin with. As I said earlier the RIR's discussed on here(this thread) are Heritage type RIR's and never have came from any type hatchery, they are raised by poultry fanciers/breeders and not raised up by the tens of thousands annually. You can't raise pure-bred/quality birds from the way factory/hatcheries operate, no way, no how. Great egg-layers YES, pure to standard NOPE

Jeff

In my mind, either it is a Rhode Island Red or it isn't. Is the consensus here that the hatchery Rhode Island Reds are not Rhode Island Reds? That could explain why we are talking in circles.

Why are you shooting the messenger? You can do your own research and find out how many eggs these chickens lay. I seem to be the only one posting references. But I wouldn't bet my life that these references are accurate.


Rhode Island Red:

http://www.mypetchicken.com/chicken-breeds/Rhode-Island-B97.aspx

http://www.keepingchickens.com/rhode-island-reds/

 

[Bullitt]

Is your conclusion based on your own personal experience or by compairing write ups in a catalog or website?
I been keeping a record of my hens production and if I get over 180 a year I will be more than happy.

My conclusion is based on the information I can find. Can you point me to a study that states differently?

The only way you would be able to accurately determine how many eggs a breed of chicken lays would be to get a representative sample of many strains, keep track of their laying for their first year, and then average that out. If you have done that, I would be impressed.

So you only get 180 eggs a year from your Rhode Island Reds? The numbers I am discussing are average for hens' first year of laying.

 

[ronott1]

The Hatchery RIRs are not pure--that is why they are the wrong color. Somewhere in the late 40s or early 50s they were crossed with New Hampshire chickens and maybe leghons.

Yes, that is why comparing the Heritage to the Hatchery does not work.

Edited to add: Hatcheries do this with Americaunas too.

Quote:

 

[Bullitt]

The Hatchery RIRs are not pure--that is why they are the wrong color. Somewhere in the late 40s or early 50s they were crossed with New Hampshire chickens and maybe leghons.

Yes, that is why comparing the Heritage to the Hatchery does not work.

Edited to add: Hatcheries do this with Americaunas too.

So you do not consider the Rhode Island Reds from hatcheries to be Rhode Island Reds?

This hatchery has some pictures of their Rhode Island Reds. They appear to have that dark red color that the Rhode Island Red is supposed to have. Is that not the correct color?

http://www.cacklehatchery.com/rhodeislandrdpage.html



It is well known that hatcheries usually can't meet the standards with Ameraucana. I did not know it was true for Rhode Island Red. What about other breeds?

 

[ronott1]

Those are Good from a hatchery but yes, they are too red.

This is from Dick Hortsman:

Quote:

 

[Bullitt]

So if the chickens from that hatchery were put in a poultry competition, would they be immediately kicked out or would points just be deducted for not having the correct color?


What I have been talking about is the general Rhode Island Reds. I guess they have been bred to be better at laying eggs, and probably with less focus on size and color.

By the way, the chicken in your picture barely has any red color in its feathers. Why was the breed given the name red if that is the original color?

 

[ronott1]

I am not a Poultry Judge. There are automatic dis qualifiers. The ones from Cackle look good, but my guess is the ones they ship will not look like these. If you got enough good ones, you could begin breeding to get rid of the not SOP features but it would take a long time.

RIR's are supposed to be Mahogany which is a type of brown or very dark red.

Check into the history of RIR's. Unless a hatchery has picked up breeder stock that is pure, they were crossed in the 40s and 50s. The resulting chicken became popular with the egg industry and quickly became the only type you could get which lead to the Heritage RIRs to be declared extinct in the 70s. Later they crossed those already crossed RIRs again to get the current production Reds. There are actually three types now that are called RIR sometimes: Heritage RIR, Hatchery RIR and Production Reds.

I hope this helps,

Ron

So if the chickens from that hatchery were put in a poultry competition, would they be immediately kicked out or would points just be deducted for not having the correct color?


What I have been talking about is the general Rhode Island Reds. I guess they have been bred to be better at laying eggs, and probably with less focus on size and color.

By the way, the chicken in your picture barely has any red color in its feathers. Why was the breed given the name red if that is the original color?

 

[Bullitt]

I am not a Poultry Judge. There are automatic dis qualifiers. The ones from Cackle look good, but my guess is the ones they ship will not look like these. If you got enough good ones, you could begin breeding to get rid of the not SOP features but it would take a long time.

RIR's are supposed to be Mahogany which is a type of brown or very dark red.

Check into the history of RIR's. Unless a hatchery has picked up breeder stock that is pure, they were crossed in the 40s and 50s. The resulting chicken became popular with the egg industry and quickly became the only type you could get which lead to the Heritage RIRs to be declared extinct in the 70s. Later they crossed those already crossed RIRs again to get the current production Reds. There are actually three types now that are called RIR sometimes: Heritage RIR, Hatchery RIR and Production Reds.

I hope this helps,

Ron

Yes, that is very helpful. Thank you.

I know about production reds. I don't think anyone is trying to pass those off as Rhode Island Reds because they look very different.

The hatchery Rhode Island Reds probably vary widely. I can see the color difference after you pointed it out. I would guess that the hatchery stock is different in size also.

I am not planning to show Rhode Island Reds, but it is good to always learn something new. I am impressed by the egg laying ability of the hatchery Rhode Island Reds. But I do like that mahogany color of the heritage Rhode Island Reds.