The Heritage Rhode Island Red Site

[mrheinz77]

Today was the Eastern Iowa Poultry Association's 142nd show. It was a great day. I was fortunate enough to have the opportunity to visit with Mr. Underwood himself. He confirmed that he is still raising Large Fowl Reds and hopes to until at least 2014, at which time the line will have been in his family for 100 years. There couldn't be a nicer man. Mr. Underwood entered 2 Large Fowl. I will post pictures of a few reds that were in the show, including Mr. Underwood's Rose Comb cockerel and my Single Comb hen (from my Rose Comb pen). My hen placed first place hen. This show excited me even more with this breed.

I posted this a few pages back. I've seen it posted several times though that he didn't have Reds anymore.

 

[CharlieVoda]

Yes NYREDS someone did insinuate that he no longer had reds. I found that hard to believe.
Guess it was not true he showed and sold some in November at the MN State Poultry show in Hutchinson MN.
Charlie

 

[Chris09]

Chris-does Dennis still have birds?

He has Bantam Reds and I think either him or his son has Bantam Modern Game or something like that.
I know he got rid of a bunch of Bantam Reds about a year or two ago, he said that he was cutting back some do to health problems that he [Dennis] had.


Chris

 

[nicalandia]

Well the first cross with this line way about 8 years ago when I got 3 good hens off of Denny Myers [one of the best single comb red breeders I know of up north here] and my best rooster was a RC Rooster.
For the most part I cross them now to add size to the SC line and improve color of the RC Reds.

Chris

so the SC are not as large as the RS? do you have exact numbers? like by half a pound larger? I would guess that RC are even more rare than SC and they have mantain about the same type they did so long ago, I hear the SC are somewhat smaller than the original RIR..

 

[nicalandia]

Glad I could help.

When you cross RC and SC you will also have to watch for narrow rose combs and double comb


Chris

does this occurs on first cross F1s? or are you talking about using a R/r+ x r+/r+ then you get some R/r+ with wierd combs? its my understanding that Rose comb is one of the few Clompletely dominant gene our there in chicken genetics, most dominant genes are partially dominant, could the weird outcomes you are seeing are mainly occuring on the Rhode Island Red breed? because for decades the Wyandotte breeders have use R/r+ roosters to mate with R/R hens(R/R hens dont have fertility issues) to enhance their fertility as homozygous R/R Wyandotte roosters have poor fertility..

for the white Wyandotte Homozygotes R/R and Heterozygotes R/r+ are Phenotypically indistinguishable. Source: http://www.rosecomb.com/federation/articles/infertility.html

another source

Source
http://www.genetics.org/content/48/9/1141.full.pdf

there could be other genes affecting R/r+ Heterozygotes pressent on the RIR

 

[Chris09]

so the SC are not as large as the RS? do you have exact numbers? like by half a pound larger? I would guess that RC are even more rare than SC and they have mantain about the same type they did so long ago, I hear the SC are somewhat smaller than the original RIR..

There is about a pound or so +/- difference between the two types [RC larger than the SC]
Yes the rareness of the RC plays a part but also keep in mind that all though they are the same breed the RC Red has or could have a extra breed added.
I don't think all SC Reds are smaller than standard weight I know mine are within standard weight but I like mine on the high end of the scale.

Chris

 

[Chris09]

does this occurs on first cross F1s? or are you talking about using a R/r+ x r+/r+ then you get some R/r+ with wierd combs? its my understanding that Rose comb is one of the few Clompletely dominant gene our there in chicken genetics, most dominant genes are partially dominant, could the weird outcomes you are seeing are mainly occuring on the Rhode Island Red breed? because for decades the Wyandotte breeders have use R/r+ roosters to mate with R/R hens(R/R hens dont have fertility issues) to enhance their fertility as homozygous R/R Wyandotte roosters have poor fertility..

for the white Wyandotte Homozygotes R/R and Heterozygotes R/r+ are Phenotypically indistinguishable. Source: http://www.rosecomb.com/federation/articles/infertility.html

another source



there could be other genes affecting R/r+ Heterozygotes pressent on the RIR

No, not in F1's.
I would say that the first sign of a Double Comb popped up about 4 years after starting a line breeding program with the beginning pair being a RC Sire over a SC Dam.

I cant say that I have ever had any fertility problem do to comb type in my Reds. Both comb types have always had very good fertility.


Now I don't know if it has anything to do with it or not but the Rhode Island Red has a good bit of Malay in its heritage and this can be seen in the early Reds in old texts and pictures.



Chris

 

[melroseladi]

Thanks for all the RC info and the pics. Pictures really do help us beginners more then I can say.

I have 2 chicks from the RC/SC pen. One is a RC and one is a SC. If they turn out to be a male and a female, would I be better off breeding that pair, better off crossing the RC to one of the other SCs that came from the SC pen, or will it matter?

I know I am jumping the gun here since they are just hitting the 2 week mark, but I really want to be as prepared as I can be and I am very excited about having both the SC and the RC. I do want to get enough so that I can keep them separate at some point.

Penny

 

[nicalandia]

Thanks for all the RC info and the pics. Pictures really do help us beginners more then I can say.

I have 2 chicks from the RC/SC pen. One is a RC and one is a SC. If they turn out to be a male and a female, would I be better off breeding that pair, better off crossing the RC to one of the other SCs that came from the SC pen, or will it matter?

I know I am jumping the gun here since they are just hitting the 2 week mark, but I really want to be as prepared as I can be and I am very excited about having both the SC and the RC. I do want to get enough so that I can keep them separate at some point.

Penny

what is your objective with this cross? same as Chris? to bring size to SC?

There is about a pound or so +/- difference between the two types [RC larger than the SC]

Chris

one Pound? wow thats alot...

Quote:

would you say the F1 of a Pure RC and SC will likely be like the research papers stated?


Here Mrs. Kaz posted good genetic info on Rose Comb, nice to confirm Rose-comb is caused by a 7.4 Mb inversion on chromosome 7 source http://www.the-coop.org/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=107153#Post107153

 

[nicalandia]

I cant say that I have ever had any fertility problem do to comb type in my Reds. Both comb types have always had very good fertility.


Chris

seems weird RC RIR show no sign of fertility issues...

The Rose-comb Mutation in Chickens Constitutes a Structural Rearrangement Causing Both Altered Comb Morphology and Defective Sperm Motility
http://www.the-coop.org/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=107153#Post107153

maybe they carry a different RoseComb mutation