The Heritage Rhode Island Red Site

[Fred's Hens]

I am new to chickens, and I believe my rooster is a rose comb RIR...he is 6 months old in this picture. Any thoughts?

Sorry. That's not a Rhode Island Red. Pink legs all kind of mixed breeding gong on there I suspect.
This is a an Red. I raised him and Nanny's gonna use him well.

 

[cmom]

Quote:
Reese.

 

[cmom]

I have 4 up and coming cockerels if anyone is interested. I know Freds Hens has dibs on the best of the four. Then three will be available. I'm northeastern lower Michigan if anyone is interested in them.

I noticed you are in Northeast lower Michigan. I am originally from Northwest lower Michigan, Traverse City, actually just north, Elk Rapids. Around 50 years ago I had Leghorns when I was there. Moved to Florida a long time ago. Have been in Florida most of my life though.

 

[bluebirdnanny]

Ah ok. Thanks.

 

[Asmorilda]

Oh she was an oops where a RIR got on a Rock hen. She is on her way out. Being nice and letting her teach the pullets from this year the boundaries first. She is in molt too. Have two rocks and about 3 kittle birds will cull soon. I want 100 percent Nelson Based Rhode Island reds for the next years. Building up my flock for better selection choices to breed and the rest for eggs, meat and sale in the future.

Would you mind telling me why you prefer the Nelson RIRs? I am new to RIRs & am still learning. Thanks.

 

[Fred's Hens]

Asmorilda. I have several "strains" or "lines" of Reds. There is far, far too much emphasis given to naming these lines. These persons of Reese, Blosl, Nelson, Rademacher, etc have usually not directly bred these birds. In fact, those venerable folks haven't bred their parents, grandparents on back for 6, 8 or 20 generations in some cases. And what about the breeders before Don Nelson blended all those birds into his own?

Use of the "so and so person" may have some value, but it is hugely overstated. Today, we might speak of Matt's birds (Ulrich) or Steven's birds (Gribble). The reality is that after YOU breed them for a couple of generations and YOU make the breeding decisions? They're your birds. The last breeder may want nothing to do with having his name attached to birds we may mis-manage under our care. Who is to say our beginning pool of birds is even a very good starting point? Do we know what we're doing when we mate them? Are we actually spiralling downward quickly with the birds given us? These are all good questions.

OK, so now back to why someone might like the birds attributed to Don Nelson. Unless you got them directly from Don last weekend in Knoxville, Don isn't likely to care very much one way or the other about birds you have. "They didn't come from me" might be what he'd say. Don cooped in a pullet right next to my two pullets in the show. His bird was a bit nicer in feather than the two I cooped in. Did it win? No. It didn't place significantly higher, as judged by ONE judge, at a moment in time, than my bird next to it. I could see the line's similarity, but Don must work every year, every year, and work hard to produce good birds by making good decisions about his breeding stock. So must I.

I hope this helps everyone understand that these birds do not magically maintain anything year after year without our constant oversight and selection process. Pretty good temperament is in most of the quality bred Reds. I've had a few individuals, here and there that were less than nice, but overall, I love the breed for it's curiousity and very friendly nature. Wonderful birds to handle and to show. Very special.

 

[Fred's Hens]

Nanny, This is #3 isn't it? He was the best male we put on the ground last year, I believe. He got a point torn off his comb so his trip to Knoxville was cancelled, but yes, Nanny, use him. He's the better of the two. Only use the other K#1, I believe his number was, if, God forbid, something happened to this one.

 

[cmom]

I would just like to add that those wishing to preserve these fine lines have to start somewhere and with selective breeding can produce some very fine birds (descendants of the lines) regardless of who started them. I also listen and learn. One of my favorite books is "The Call of the Hen" (Or the Science of the Selection and Breeding of Poultry) by Walter Hogan (1913), a poultryman. It is only available in reprint and the illustrations are rather poor but the information is great. Just my opinion.

Here is some good information about the different lines. http://jimspetsandpoultry.weebly.com/

 

[Beekissed]

Fred, after someone has bred a particular breed for some time, does that line tend to have sort of a look or physical stamp on them in a way where you can go to a show and say, "That must be one of so and so's birds, they are known for that head, that size, that type of feathering, etc."? And, does that stamp of the breeder tend to carry on if the new breeder has the same focus or do each of us put our own stamp on the line...sort of muddying the waters, so to speak? I'd think that would be inevitable over time, as you've explained.

I'm wondering if there are certain traits that are so strong that they get carried forth no matter who touches the line along the way unless someone deliberately tries to breed that trait out of the line. If so, could you give us some examples of some strong traits that tend to pop up in certain breeds that most breeders will try to retain if they get their hands on that line of birds?

 

[chicken pickin]

Fred, after someone has bred a particular breed for some time, does that line tend to have sort of a look or physical stamp on them in a way where you can go to a show and say, "That must be one of so and so's birds, they are known for that head, that size, that type of feathering, etc."? And, does that stamp of the breeder tend to carry on if the new breeder has the same focus or do each of us put our own stamp on the line...sort of muddying the waters, so to speak? I'd think that would be inevitable over time, as you've explained.

I'm wondering if there are certain traits that are so strong that they get carried forth no matter who touches the line along the way unless someone deliberately tries to breed that trait out of the line. If so, could you give us some examples of some strong traits that tend to pop up in certain breeds that most breeders will try to retain if they get their hands on that line of birds?

Those are great questions, Id be interested to see the response.