The Legbar Thread!

[KPenley]

The standard should readily accommodate the range of views on coloration which seems to be the ultimate sticking point.

I must admit that your post disheartens me greatly. I'm so sorry, but this is not how the American Poultry Association works, and threatening them or us will not change the rules. A standard without detailed description reflecting that of the PCGB is not an option for us. If you need to leave the club, then I understand, but it will sadden me greatly to see members leave because they don't understand the process of getting an existing breed accepted by the APA. I wish you the best in all your future endeavors! Perhaps we will meet one day should you choose to stick with the Cream Legbar or pursue the first color variety. Again, best wishes!

 

[HaplessRunner]

I must admit that your post disheartens me greatly. I'm so sorry, but this is not how the American Poultry Association works, and threatening them or us will not change the rules. A standard without detailed description reflecting that of the PCGB is not an option for us. If you need to leave the club, then I understand, but it will sadden me greatly to see members leave because they don't understand the process of getting an existing breed accepted by the APA. I wish you the best in all your future endeavors! Perhaps we will meet one day should you choose to stick with the Cream Legbar or pursue the first color variety. Again, best wishes!

I will not get into a dual with comments but your response is likewise very disheartening. Also, unbelievable is your invitation for me to leave the Cream Legbar Club. I am sorry but I have no intentions to leave the club so you will have to contend with my continued input and vote.

There was never any threat to anyone made or intended. I just merely stated and advertised my position in an open forum. So if this becomes a focal point for others who feel like I do, then so be it. One never knows how many votes that can be marshaled for a position.

While I am not familiar with the APA rules of admission, I am a an APA member. I do appreciate the work that has been and will be invested to get the cream legbar accepted by the APA. It is no small undertaking. We will succeed with a standard that majority will accept.

 

[lonnyandrinda]

We don't have to make a decision tonight folks!!!!

It's great to have these discussions- but as it has also been mentioned we need more than anything TIME working with these birds to see what the genetics hide- as we have been all combining the different GFF lines and EVERYTHING under the sun is popping up. Color should be the LAST of our worries- type and shape first!!! In the meantime, breed for whatever color suits your fancy- no one is stopping you.

I will say that the club will PROBABLY lean towards whatever Punnett and Pease intended with the breed and will be sticking to their description- which includes neither the silvery white favored in the UK nor the flamboyant reds we see often in the US. A standard is just that- something to strive for, not something that fits every bird. We can't have a standard that includes it all. BUT for now can we just focus that we all love this breed and want to work on it? Sometimes it feels like we can't see the forest for the trees on this thread!

It's amazing how much discussion has gone on the last few days- I can barely keep up with everything going on with my life right now. Discussion is great!!! But let's respect each other's right to their own opinions!

 

[Laingcroft]

I hesitate to make a decision until we can understand what the breed was or is in it's homeland and what we have here.

I've set up a thread to figure out the actual or likely genotype of the CCL as opposed to the phenotype. That same appearance (silvery) could be the result of several different genotypes. Which one is the correct one for CCL?

It's been hard to follow the discussion on color across three or four different threads. Would be much easier in one place. Just my 2 cents.

 

[nicalandia]

Quote:
Just Coincidence, the cream gene is an autosomal recessive gene.... egg color is a polygenic trait, even if the white egg shell is o+, other modifiers my turn the white egg into a tinted gene or mate whte, or even shiny white....

 

[nicalandia]

Quote:
I agree, Genetically

 

[nicalandia]

Quote:
there was not Silver Creasted Legbar. there were, gold legbars and Silver Legbar, Punnett used the creast and cream to make the difference, plus they laid blue eggs... how did punnett found cream in the first place? like any other Scientist, doing dedicated outcross and back to parents. at first he thought it was sex linked but later he found out that it was simple recessive, mind that all of the outcross he did were on none barred birds.

 

[ChicKat]

I hesitate to make a decision until we can understand what the breed was or is in it's homeland and what we have here.

I've set up a thread to figure out the actual or likely genotype of the CCL as opposed to the phenotype. That same appearance (silvery) could be the result of several different genotypes. Which one is the correct one for CCL?

It's been hard to follow the discussion on color across three or four different threads. Would be much easier in one place. Just my 2 cents.

Tru - probably a good idea - do you want to put in a link to your thread?

 

[nicalandia]

Quote:
Did you guys missed this post?.. we need to ask a few questions to the owner of such a bird(sing barred).. where did he get the bird from?(I hope not from GFF, but thats highly unlikely seeing all of the birds I've seen from them) I least I will go ahead and ask him.. do you know the partents of this bird? where did you get him or them? GFF or a local breeder? I am just curious, thats all

 

[ChicKat]

Quote: Perhaps...but if he had silver-looking birds, then did he just randomly outcross some to see if they had cream? What I am saying is that there must have been some visual difference. here is a quote from Punnett:

“It may be described as a Brown
Leghorn on a cream basis, to which has
been added the barring factor causing
it to be autosexing. It is also crested
and lays a blue egg”

R.C. Punnett 1957

If your theory were to be correct, then he would have said on a silver basis - perhaps saying "a silver ground, that hides recessive cream, which can only be found by outcrossing to prove that it isn't pure silver".

And this may be one place where the theories split apart. Presently, the UK is saying that the very light rooster that you pictured and said was genetically correct is the standard. What I am trying to communicate is that if the totally silver-looking bird is genetically correct, then how did Punnett ever see Cream in the first place. Cream was supposedly a color that had not been seen in the UK. Silver not so much. That is the reason that people are saying I want to breed to the Punnett bird, not to the UK standard (if indeed the UK standard puts cream indistinguishable visible from silver) With crest and blue dominant genes, why would anyone bother with cream if they wanted a silver bird? They could just add crest and blue to silver Legbar.