The Legbar Thread!

[GaryDean26]

it would be really nice if you did and did this experiment. i would love to have real word evidence of how they are effected.

this is an eye opener Ive seen these two things in my birds and others.

. With CLBs the contaminant is not as visual, but will be seen in the reddish or darker orange on the head, saddle of the male. And the females will have a brown cast to the body, especially on the wings coverts, instead of the grey-black back, wings and body.

And I was never really sure about the females, those with palest gold hackles were kept as CLBs.) Indeed some males had straw colored hackle and some had reddish heads tapering to creamishs ends of hackle or even the reverse, lighter at top, darker ends

Another option would be to cross the Cream Legbar with a Silver Leghorn. The split would result in a Cream Looking bird. in the first generation and 50% cream looking if you brother sister mated in the 2nd cross. It wouldn't be cream. but would shed some light on what the "golden" color looks like with barring on it.

 

[nicalandia]

Quote:
S/s+ B/b+ males will look very different from S/s+ B/B males... S/s+ B/b+ Ig/ig+ males would look much like the following Phoenix(this male is ER instead of e+) as you can see single barred males show very very dark barring and/Or the barring is not as defined...
Quote:
double barred males that are S/s+ B/B would be even more silver than the above bird... but the Barring would be more defined and grey instead of black..

 

[CibolaChooks]

I don't know why were still talking about color really. I think the post KPenly posted of Michael Pease description is the correct one. Didn't punnet stop working with them. He was apart of the start of the project and then he left the flock to Pease who did further breeding and refined the Cream legbar, separating it from the gold line into the silver looking birds we know as cream. and in the post KPenly posted correctly defined what it looks like as far as color goes. Yes or No.

Obviously we need to discuss color and the current topics to learn how to get all our overly colored birds to the correct silver looking Cream legbar but in my mind KPenly post correctly and exactly described the silver looking Roos. Can you re post the Pease Description or PM it to me KPenly.

 

[horsedirt]

Hello! I can't tell if this 3ish week old chick is male or female. Initially I was thrilled that it was a pullet, no dot head. Now I'm not so sure...Input would be greatly appreciated!

Karen

 

[KPenley]

ok, you gals caught me...I MISSED a typo in the history!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The original quote by Professor Michael Pease is:

"An interesting new autosexing variety is the Cream Legbar. The cream colour is indistinguishable to the eye from silver; but cream is, for reasons given on page 2, none the less a form of gold. It may be thought of as an extremely diluted gold. The Cream Legbar has a crest, which distinguishes it readily from the Silver Legbar. It has proved to be a prolific layer; its most striking peculiarity is that it lays blue eggs. The sex-distinction in the downs is the same as that in the Gold Legbar (Plate 11c)."
(Pease, Michael M.A., Ministry of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food, Bulletin No. 38, Sex-Linkage in Poultry Breeding, Other Varieties, page 8)

Page two just talks about the relationship between Silver and Gold, and reiterates that cream is diluted gold. So our history should not read that the crest distinguishes from both gold and silver, just silver.

Pease acquired all of Punnett's and his test birds when he moved on to other projects, so they are essentially the same.

@Nicalandia: Pease actually suggested breeding Legbar Roosters to Brown Leghorn Hens if you needed to improve or diversify blood line! It's interesting that you would mention that!

Edited to add: I love you too Kathy

I don't know why were still talking about color really. I think the post KPenly posted of Michael Pease description is the correct one. Didn't punnet stop working with them. He was apart of the start of the project and then he left the flock to Pease who did further breeding and refined the Cream legbar, separating it from the gold line into the silver looking birds we know as cream. and in the post KPenly posted correctly defined what it looks like as far as color goes. Yes or No.

Obviously we need to discuss color and the current topics to learn how to get all our overly colored birds to the correct silver looking Cream legbar but in my mind KPenly post correctly and exactly described the silver looking Roos. Can you re post the Pease Description or PM it to me KPenly.

 

[horsedirt]

I'm sorry, totally off topic.

 

[KPenley]

I don't know Karen. Can you update in two more weeks? Either it's a boy or you actually have a girl with proper body feathering

 

[blackbirds13]

Hello! I can't tell if this 3ish week old chick is male or female. Initially I was thrilled that it was a pullet, no dot head. Now I'm not so sure...Input would be greatly appreciated!

Karen

Looks like a pullet without a consistent back stripe. The head stripe looks to dark for a boy. The experts would not recommend breeding her due to the potential loss of the auto sexing nature but if you do I'd single mate her or separate her eggs to ensure the chicks are clearly auto sexing.

 

[blackbirds13]

I don't know why were still talking about color really. I think the post KPenly posted of Michael Pease description is the correct one. Didn't punnet stop working with them. He was apart of the start of the project and then he left the flock to Pease who did further breeding and refined the Cream legbar, separating it from the gold line into the silver looking birds we know as cream. and in the post KPenly posted correctly defined what it looks like as far as color goes. Yes or No.

Obviously we need to discuss color and the current topics to learn how to get all our overly colored birds to the correct silver looking Cream legbar but in my mind KPenly post correctly and exactly described the silver looking Roos. Can you re post the Pease Description or PM it to me KPenly.

The debate on 'correct' color has been going on since the first birds left GFF and I do not foresee it going away for a while. The SOP is a work in progress so I think it's only fair for those folks that are newly introduced to the birds feel free to express their own preference on that as well as any aspect of the bird. I'm not sure everyone's on board with the silver looking birds. What some may see as inevitable others may see as more malleable towards a more preferable description. I would hate to completely shut the book on any aspect of the Legbar at this point. I'm currently shooting for an overall barred crested bird with maybe just a hint of chestnut on the shoulders for the boys though I'm also not opposed to no chestnut, cream or gold anywhere. I'm also not opposed to a pale silver looking female but also like a slight bit of color to the hackle and I mean very slight but hope to eliminate any trace of red around the face. I would like to eliminate the hints of red, gold or brown on the overall body while maintaining the salmon breast but maybe the genes will say whoa! and I'll have to go with the parameters they delineate. These are my goals and I've said from the start that I was going to breed towards the British SOP but I'm sure others have different thoughts and ideas and perhaps for them the continued conversation is a valid one even if for some, like myself and some others the stone is set. I think we have time and room for it all.

 

[1muttsfan]

I don't know why were still talking about color really. I think the post KPenly posted of Michael Pease description is the correct one. Didn't punnet stop working with them. He was apart of the start of the project and then he left the flock to Pease who did further breeding and refined the Cream legbar, separating it from the gold line into the silver looking birds we know as cream. and in the post KPenly posted correctly defined what it looks like as far as color goes. Yes or No.

Obviously we need to discuss color and the current topics to learn how to get all our overly colored birds to the correct silver looking Cream legbar but in my mind KPenly post correctly and exactly described the silver looking Roos. Can you re post the Pease Description or PM it to me KPenly.

Perhaps you should limit your criticism of other colors to the Cream Legbar thread, as you seem to have a vision of the Creams that you share with some others, while some are not totally convinced that you are correct. While it is often confusing to try to keep up on 2 separate legbar threads, maybe having one dedicated to the creams as grey.silver coloring another to discussion of other colors, which you seem to find distasteful, would work for all of us.