The Legbar Thread!

[ChicKat]

hi boykin2010 --

Here's what I have heard. The hen/pullet needs to be mature and been laying for 6-weeks at least for the eggs to be the ones selected for hatching. Gail Damerow says that by 30-weeks the pullet's eggs will be full-sized. One reason for that selection criteria is "smalll eggs laid by pullets or old hens will give you smaller, less vigorous chicks" page 276. So although my first egg, for example, would hatch if fertilized, and given the right incubation conditions, my pullet's first egg was 1.260 ounces, I think....and a normal egg approaches 2.0 oz or goes over 2.0 for my flock.

If I had hatched that first egg..I think that the resulting chick would definitely have been smaller and 'less virgorous', even if it had hatched and lived.

I am targeting a really healthy flock with strong genetics. The conditions here are kind of rough (Texas ranch, you can imagine).... and I just want to give any chicks the very best start. That is where I got my formula for breeding plan. It applies to me and my goals....and I realize other people have other objectives. For example, I suppose if someone wanted to develop bantam Cream Legbars, they would select the smallest pullet eggs possible and get the size and work on vigor later. Hope that makes sense.

Thanks for the question, it sent me back to my books----although I think that wasn't the quote. I remember mature hen and 5-6 weeks of regular laying before selecting eggs for hatching. So I wrote that time on my chicken-management-calendar.

I will come back and edit this post if I find the exact quotes....but by that time...there will be a multitude of posts into the future. :O)

 

[ChicKat]

I had my Legbar chicks off heat by 4 weeks old. They have done great. As far as hardiness, I'm not sure about that. I've already lost 5 pullets and they are the first to pant in the heat. Someone was saying that over in England there isn't a huge climate change like there is in the US. And even in Florida there isn't a big climate change where they are imported. Maybe it will take time for them to acclimate to the shifting climate some parts of the US have.

madamwlf---

That is a really good insight. When I lived in the desert, the landscaper I had wouldn't even put a plant in the ground that hadn't been totally grown in the Cochella Valley, because he believed in natives. I hope that the subsequent generations of Cream Legbars do acclimatize as you are suggesting!!! I'm sorry that you lost your pullets, and it is somewhat comforting to know that your Cream Legbars are the first to pant as well....so it is breed-wide and not just my female. :O(

 

[boykin2010]

hi boykin2010 --

Here's what I have heard. The hen/pullet needs to be mature and been laying for 6-weeks at least for the eggs to be the ones selected for hatching. Gail Damerow says that by 30-weeks the pullet's eggs will be full-sized. One reason for that selection criteria is "smalll eggs laid by pullets or old hens will give you smaller, less vigorous chicks" page 276. So although my first egg, for example, would hatch if fertilized, and given the right incubation conditions, my pullet's first egg was 1.260 ounces, I think....and a normal egg approaches 2.0 oz or goes over 2.0 for my flock.

If I had hatched that first egg..I think that the resulting chick would definitely have been smaller and 'less virgorous', even if it had hatched and lived.

I am targeting a really healthy flock with strong genetics. The conditions here are kind of rough (Texas ranch, you can imagine).... and I just want to give any chicks the very best start. That is where I got my formula for breeding plan. It applies to me and my goals....and I realize other people have other objectives. For example, I suppose if someone wanted to develop bantam Cream Legbars, they would select the smallest pullet eggs possible and get the size and work on vigor later. Hope that makes sense.

Thanks for the question, it sent me back to my books----although I think that wasn't the quote. I remember mature hen and 5-6 weeks of regular laying before selecting eggs for hatching. So I wrote that time on my chicken-management-calendar.

I will come back and edit this post if I find the exact quotes....but by that time...there will be a multitude of posts into the future. :O)

Ok, Thanks that does make sense. I have never heard of anyone doing that before until now. My hen never laid a "pullet egg" the first egg she laid was the same size as the one she was laying 6 months from then. I do remember however, that when my turkey hen started laying I hatched her first eggs and had problems with those poults having spraddle legs. Turkeys are a lot more sensitive than chickens in my opinion but I imagine that the smaller turkey hens eggs didn't help any with development. Thank you for letting me know this. I may try it with my other breeds coming up soon.

 

[boykin2010]

I had my Legbar chicks off heat by 4 weeks old. They have done great. As far as hardiness, I'm not sure about that. I've already lost 5 pullets and they are the first to pant in the heat. Someone was saying that over in England there isn't a huge climate change like there is in the US. And even in Florida there isn't a big climate change where they are imported. Maybe it will take time for them to acclimate to the shifting climate some parts of the US have.

Yes you are definitely correct about the climate change. Plus, these particular breeds haven't been introduced to the germs and bacteria that are native to the US and that may not live in Europe. In imported chicks, it is common to have a 50% mortality rate after they hatch. Now, if you take those that lived and breed them then their chicks are a lot less susceptible to the diseases that are found here and you will have a better survival rate. The more and more the CL's are bred and raised in the US the less fragile they should be in a couple of years because the parents will have been introduced and survived different bacteria and germs.

 

[anniesmom]

hi boykin2010 --

Here's what I have heard. The hen/pullet needs to be mature and been laying for 6-weeks at least for the eggs to be the ones selected for hatching. Gail Damerow says that by 30-weeks the pullet's eggs will be full-sized. One reason for that selection criteria is "smalll eggs laid by pullets or old hens will give you smaller, less vigorous chicks" page 276. So although my first egg, for example, would hatch if fertilized, and given the right incubation conditions, my pullet's first egg was 1.260 ounces, I think....and a normal egg approaches 2.0 oz or goes over 2.0 for my flock.

If I had hatched that first egg..I think that the resulting chick would definitely have been smaller and 'less virgorous', even if it had hatched and lived.

I absolutely found this to be true this spring with my SFHs. I was so excited to get eggs, I was sticking everything in the incubator. The hatch rate at first wasn't so great and the eggs were fairly small. The ones from the smallest eggs are still smaller than the rest. After about two months the egg size was much bigger and I was getting almost 100% hatch rate. It was the same with some shipped eggs I got. The tinyest eggs didn't hatch at all and one very small chick that did hatch, died.

I've got my scale set to grams and 50+ grams seems to be a good weight. (That's 1.76 ounces according to a chart. Two ounces is about 56 grams and would be even better.) From now on I won't try to hatch anything smaller than that.

My GF Legbars are doing great. I gave one of the 4 boys away and another is penned by himself for now. The girls just weren't ready for HIM yet! They will be 18 weeks on Monday and I've got some big red pullet combs already. I saw one of the remaining 2 cockerels in with the 8 pullets breed one of them this morning. There was no squawking. She just let him.

 

[Phage]

If I had hatched that first egg..I think that the resulting chick would definitely have been smaller and 'less virgorous', even if it had hatched and lived.

I am targeting a really healthy flock with strong genetics. The conditions here are kind of rough (Texas ranch, you can imagine).... and I just want to give any chicks the very best start. That is where I got my formula for breeding plan. It applies to me and my goals....and I realize other people have other objectives. For example, I suppose if someone wanted to develop bantam Cream Legbars, they would select the smallest pullet eggs possible and get the size and work on vigor later.

I agree that small pullet eggs can produce smaller and 'less virgorous" chicks, (and that people may want to hatch every egg, these being such valuable chicks).

However, I don't see that selecting such chicks for developing banatms makes sense, as it is the genes that determine final size in later generations of offspring, and not the size the parent chick was when it was hatched. All the eggs come from the same pool of genetic material, so selecting the smallest adults (hatched from regular sized eggs) would seem more logical for developing bantams.

 

[FarmerBoy24]

I just found this thread! I am so excited to share with you guys that I have 3 Cream Legbar Pullets and 3 Cream Legbar roos. I will be getting rid of 1 or 2 of the roosters though They should begin laying in a couple of months. Super Eggcited!!!

 

[RyeRanch]

Welcome to the thread!

 

[ronott1]

I just found this thread! I am so excited to share with you guys that I have 3 Cream Legbar Pullets and 3 Cream Legbar roos. I will be getting rid of 1 or 2 of the roosters though They should begin laying in a couple of months. Super Eggcited!!!

Welcome from a fellow Californian! It's great to see more of us.

Ron

 

[ChicKat]

I agree that small pullet eggs can produce smaller and 'less virgorous" chicks, (and that people may want to hatch every egg, these being such valuable chicks).

However, I don't see that selecting such chicks for developing banatms makes sense, as it is the genes that determine final size in later generations of offspring, and not the size the parent chick was when it was hatched. All the eggs come from the same pool of genetic material, so selecting the smallest adults (hatched from regular sized eggs) would seem more logical for developing bantams.

You are 100% right Phage..... I guess I made up a bad example. Thanks for the insights. :O)