The Natural Chicken Keeping thread - OTs welcome!

Quote: @Bill Mathews: Highly recommend you check out Bulldogma's signature with its link. ;)

Garlic is high in sulfur which is toxic to the parasites that plague chickens as well as other animals. They physically cannot process it. It also speeds healing. The level of sulfur an animal can take is linked in large part to its size, and it takes a lot to overdose chickens, you'd need to be either force feeding it by drench or similar, or feeding it to severely liver-damaged birds, to harm them from it. When chickens have been on garlic for a while they can't become overrun by mites, lice, or worms as it permeates the flesh. It also helps fend off many diseases and harmful microorganisms as they too cannot tolerate levels of sulfur that are harmless to the birds.

The sulfonamide family of drugs was developed after studies showed the effectiveness of garlic, to mimic the qualities of naturally occurring sulfur compounds in herbs and particularly garlic, but these synthetic or other man-made/altered compounds are not as effective as the natural alternative in part because the natural alternative arrives in natural form and in proper balance with the necessary enzymes to digest it and make full use of it, but especially because it is 'fluid' and never the same in natural form, so viruses and bad bacteria cannot become immune to it like they do to stabilized/ pharmaceutical grade antibiotics and sulfur compounds which do not change.

The main known antibiotic in garlic is Allicin and this is proven to kill food poisoning bacteria among others that man made antibiotics cannot kill. Unlike man made antibiotics, the natural alternatives do not kill good bacteria too, only the harmful types. Russians refer to garlic as 'russian penicillin' and worldwide it is in much usage. I can personally vouch for it having saved my life and I cannot count how many times it's saved the lives of my poultry; I have never had respiratory diseases among them and chicks fed garlic from day one never get coccidiosis nor the majority of other diseases chicks get. This is especially important in those diseases which require buildup of bad bacteria in the gut to take hold, but are kept in check by healthy intestinal microfauna/flora. Keep in mind there are many types of garlic, many modern breeds also, and some are more potent than others. There is much more info which I hope to gather and present in a concise and easily referenced form... When I'm not so busy. ;)

About ACV, it maintains a correct PH which is crucial to preventing and healing everything from cancer to infections, and contains electrolytes, pro- and pre-biotics, vitamins, enzymes and minerals. The pectin in apples is one of the main heavy metal detoxifiers, relevant especially to mercury, lead and aluminium. About cayenne pepper, I will give a quick sample of how it works in some circumstances: since some diseases that it is used to prevent involve worm cysts that are infected, (blackhead) and these are activated by the stomach acid once eaten, if cayenne is also eaten it literally burns the now unprotected parasite and the protozoan disease that may have hitchhiked in there with it. It is also great for removing established adult tapeworm, as garlic takes longer as the sulfur has to build up to do its job, whereas cayenne burns the worms until they cannot feed and will evacuate the host to seek other 'pastures' lol. Best wishes.
 
I jthyset 216 eggs in the incubator. This is the first time using anything other that a styrofoam job. Thinking ahead to what a job candling is going to be and knowing I better or there is gonna be a problem, and that would stink.
I have had it on for 3 days and seems to be holding steady even in the garage.
216,,,, at 3-4 dozen a day, that pushed my 10 day viability belief... I wonder what my percentage will be as I didn't set them all fat side up.... Does anyone get eggs where there is no fat side?
I kept the really dirty ones out but with setting that many I didn't give much thought to genetically perfect eggs.... Too late to have this batch ready for the moult, but I guess that it is better than hatching in November. Still exciting to see what the percentage will be with zero care taken before they were unceremoniously placed in the bator. Never marked the date for my broody, but haven't seen any action from anything but her pecker.... beak, that is.
If you have an egg that looks the same on both ends like the marans eggs I just incubated, you put them on a flat surface where they won't fall, and the flat end will sit higher than the pointy end.
 
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Quote: Delisha
Del - I wonder if this could be what my friend's chicken had...the one I had discussed w/you all on pm?

Are you doing anything to treat? Does anything need to be done?
 
I have been extremely busy and didn’t have a lot of time to comment on what I had written about excessive, continual use of various items by forced feed in food. I’m under time constraint, but I wanted to at least comment on the dosage issue…I probably won’t be able to get back to this topic again for about 1.5 weeks as extremely busy the next few days.

Hope this is helpful :D
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On the dosage/side effects on cayenne:

Note: Dosages listed here are for ADULT SIZED HUMANS. What is normal for a person, is a LOT for an animal the size of a chicken.

-The Gale Encyclopedia of Alternative Medicine recommended dosage for an adult: preparing a tea from 1 cup of hot water and 1/4 tsp. of cayenne pepper for treating mild digestion or for use as a diuretic. Drink up to 3 cups per day after meals.



SIDE EFFECTS OF INGESTING TOO MUCH CAYENNE

- Mouth and Throat:
Drinking more cups of cayenne tea than suggested or drinking tea made with larger amounts of cayenne powder may cause mouth and throat irritation. As the amount of cayenne you ingest rises, so does the risk of mouth and throat irritation. Severe side effects include blistering and the formation of mouth and throat ulcers, according to PDR for Herbal Medicines.


-Stomach & Digestive System
Ingesting too much cayenne pepper may result in gastrointestinal distress, including diarrhea and intestinal colic and the formation of stomach ulcers
. With higher doses, you are also more likely to experience burning bowel movements.

-Additional Side Effects and Precautions
At the suggested dosage, cayenne may be beneficial in preventing some types of cancer, at higher, toxic doses, it may contribute to the development of cancer, although studies verifying this side effect are lacking. At therapeutic dosages, the PDR suggests using cayenne for two consecutive days and then discontinuing use for two weeks before repeating the dosage.

Do not give cayenne to infants or small children to avoid respiratory distress. Toxic overdoses of cayenne increase the risk of liver and kidney damage
. The risk of side effects increases incrementally with the amount of cayenne ingested.



I don’t have enough time to give info on oregano right now. In general, there is some evidence that long-term, continued use of oregano oil can also cause liver issues.

Hopefully I can get back on this before too long.
 
On the dosage/side effects on cayenne:

Note: Dosages listed here are for ADULT SIZED HUMANS. What is normal for a person, is a LOT for an animal the size of a chicken.

-The Gale Encyclopedia of Alternative Medicine recommended dosage for an adult: preparing a tea from 1 cup of hot water and 1/4 tsp. of cayenne pepper for treating mild digestion or for use as a diuretic. Drink up to 3 cups per day after meals.



SIDE EFFECTS OF INGESTING TOO MUCH CAYENNE

- Mouth and Throat:
Drinking more cups of cayenne tea than suggested or drinking tea made with larger amounts of cayenne powder may cause mouth and throat irritation. As the amount of cayenne you ingest rises, so does the risk of mouth and throat irritation. Severe side effects include blistering and the formation of mouth and throat ulcers, according to PDR for Herbal Medicines.


-Stomach & Digestive System
Ingesting too much cayenne pepper may result in gastrointestinal distress, including diarrhea and intestinal colic and the formation of stomach ulcers
. With higher doses, you are also more likely to experience burning bowel movements.

-Additional Side Effects and Precautions
At the suggested dosage, cayenne may be beneficial in preventing some types of cancer, at higher, toxic doses, it may contribute to the development of cancer, although studies verifying this side effect are lacking. At therapeutic dosages, the PDR suggests using cayenne for two consecutive days and then discontinuing use for two weeks before repeating the dosage.

Do not give cayenne to infants or small children to avoid respiratory distress. Toxic overdoses of cayenne increase the risk of liver and kidney damage
. The risk of side effects increases incrementally with the amount of cayenne ingested.



I don’t have enough time to give info on oregano right now. In general, there is some evidence that long-term, continued use of oregano oil can also cause liver issues.

Hopefully I can get back on this before too long.


Leah's Mom and Chooksforlife:

This has been really interesting to read the discussion on garlic, acv, etc - I'm learning a lot from both of you. I like seeing the different points of view, and the reasoning behind your thoughts.
Thanks!
 
If you read up on Infectious Bronchitis, it doesn't kill 50% of the birds--it will make sick 50% of the birds, but only kill 0-25%. That is morbidity versus mortality. However, you will lose many, many chicks. IB can be carried in your flock by some birds for up to a year. This is the disease that can affect egg laying in hens, and can cause hens to always lay a weird wrinkled egg.
 
Leah's Mom and Chooksforlife:

This has been really interesting to read the discussion on garlic, acv, etc - I'm learning a lot from both of you. I like seeing the different points of view, and the reasoning behind your thoughts.
Thanks!
now the question and the most important question is that of experience. Given both points of view through experience how has each worked? Discussions on theory's, thoughts etc are very interesting. But real world experience is what matters.
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Thank you for all the advice... I guess I'll tell him when he gets back. Thank you sooooo much for all the advice you guys have given me! This was a new situation that I really didn't know how to deal with. And I was by no way bashing, or vilifying this person for not using antibiotics! He doesn't know anythings wrong with his birds, and I just wasn't sure that it was my position to tel him! He take good care of his birds, just didn't realizing anything was wrong, please don't take what I said in the wrong way, we are very good friends, and I don't want to be seen as someone who talks about their friend behind his back, just asking for advice.On another note, I'll be getting a rabbit at the end of the week!! Not sure what kind, but plan on giving it the best life possible, not just stuck in a cage. Be posting pictures of it soon!!!
 
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Quote:
And - to that point: It would be very interesting to me to hear from everyone who wants to contribute. Please be as specific as you can:

As Preventative:
1. What additives do you feed? (Cayenne, Oregano, Garlic, ACV, Other)
2. What form are they in? (Fresh, Dried, Oil, Prepared Tea, etc.)
3. How is it given? (Mixed into feed, free-feed in a separate container, etc.)
4. How much is given? (Need to be as detailed as possible. If you put 30 garlic cloves in the feed, how much feed is that (by measure)? How many birds are eating from it?
5. How often is this given? (Daily, weekly, monthly, etc.)
6. Results? How do you believe this has affected your flock? Do you have anything to compare to? Have you raised without using these items? If so, what is your observation of the difference between the two methods?



As Treatment:
1. List the illness or symptoms you treated.
2. Specific items used.
3. Answer all the questions above.
4. How long was the duration of the treatment?
5. What were the results?


PLEASE TRY TO BE SHORT AND CONCISE. (Otherwise, folks may
sleeping-smiley-face.gif
)
 
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