The road less traveled...back to good health! They have lice, mites, scale mites, worms, anemia, gl

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I completely forgot about your position on the globe, Pete. When do they normally molt in your neck of the woods?

same as u, i'm guessing end of autumn (fall)everything the same just reverse the months/seasons . lol .u get a cold xmas, we bake in summer heat
 
Quote:
Moms are often right and the older we get, the more often right they are!
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You really and truly can't bring the country into the city without some problems...and vice versa, I'd just ask around folks at work, church or other social groups and I bet there is someone who has ashes and don't know what to do with them. Anywhere that has winter, usually has wood heat...somewhere.

Now, see? There is another money making opportunity....bagging up wood ash and selling it. Along with a little bag of feed, tiny bottle of mother vinegar with instructions on fermentation. Call it the Poultry Porridge Pack, idea as suggested by Mountain Momma.
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The only thing with a coop and keeping warm is it's hard to visualize your coop system without a pic and I'm having a hard time understanding where they sleep and shelter from the wind. I can understand that the run is tarped and roofed but I still can't visualize the coop and how much room is available inside it for all the birds.

Could you post some good pics at all angles so we could get a real good idea of the space and the setup?
 
It is helpful, I just today had a bad experiance. I am new to chickens since april and feel I am very cautious with my coops.. I clean weekly with new shavings and hay in boxes.. They do free range but there are days I keep them in a pen of 25x25 when weather is lousy....they have wateres in 5 gall pails hanging w chicken nipples and feeder off floor too.. Last night I was missing a girl when I went to close door at 8pm.. I thought maybe a predator got her, but this morning I went and opened my coops and did my feeding as I returned to the first coop I saw the missing girl ,she came back soaking wet and mangy from rain.. I noticed what I thought was appearing to be moltiing with some feather loss a few weeks ago on back and neck , but her activity didnt change at all.. So I watched her a few minutes today and saw her poop yellow liquid ,and she was a bit slow and not hungary..I called the breeder I got her from and she told me to look for lice and mites.. Well I found the little white bugs crawling around her but area.. so I quarentined her and was told to dust her and clean all coops with sevin dust and start with all new shavings and hay.. I dont know how this happened and i am worried about the rest.. I did check and so far I didnt see anymore lice.. what else can I do? Vinegar in water? Garlic? the rest of my flock still looks healthy..
 
It is helpful, I just today had a bad experiance. I am new to chickens since april and feel I am very cautious with my coops.. I clean weekly with new shavings and hay in boxes.. They do free range but there are days I keep them in a pen of 25x25 when weather is lousy....they have wateres in 5 gall pails hanging w chicken nipples and feeder off floor too.. Last night I was missing a girl when I went to close door at 8pm.. I thought maybe a predator got her, but this morning I went and opened my coops and did my feeding as I returned to the first coop I saw the missing girl ,she came back soaking wet and mangy from rain.. I noticed what I thought was appearing to be moltiing with some feather loss a few weeks ago on back and neck , but her activity didnt change at all.. So I watched her a few minutes today and saw her poop yellow liquid ,and she was a bit slow and not hungary..I called the breeder I got her from and she told me to look for lice and mites.. Well I found the little white bugs crawling around her but area.. so I quarentined her and was told to dust her and clean all coops with sevin dust and start with all new shavings and hay.. I dont know how this happened and i am worried about the rest.. I did check and so far I didnt see anymore lice.. what else can I do? Vinegar in water? Garlic? the rest of my flock still looks healthy..

I can only tell you what I would do. I wouldn't dust with Sevin and I wouldn't get all new hay or shavings. I'd stop raking out the shavings and start a good deep litter system. I would check all your other birds for lice as well and dust each and every one with wood ashes and place a box with the same for doing their own dusting. Wouldn't hurt to place some ashes in the nest boxes as well.

I'd get some NuStock and place it on any lice eggs at the base of feathers..mine were only located on the feathers around the vent. Any bare spots could also get a lick of NS, for good measure.

I would place some mother vinegar in the water. It wouldn't hurt to put a little garlic on the feed for awhile. It's kind of late in the year to start fermentation of feeds for the probios unless you live in a warm place.

Good threads to read up on...they may take a long time to get through but consider them each an interactive book with real life situations:

https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/...l-up-a-rockin-chair-and-lay-some-wisdom-on-us

https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/70/deep-litter-method

https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/644300/fermenting-feed-for-meat-birds

https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/...osis-and-other-poultry-diseases-in-chicks-acv
 
Ok so am I over cleaning my coops?? I was thinking clean clean !! I am afraid of having lots of poop in their shavings..thinking it is bacteria..
 
It is bacteria...their own. Clean clean leaves the way for other bad pathogens to populate the area. Deep litter that is composting down, with the feces, urine and carbonaceous materials all breaking down creates a place for beneficial bacteria, yeasts and insects to live and thrive. These microorganisms feed on bad bacteria and on parasite larvae and hold in check the bad yeasts and molds.

Clean is nice but there are two different kinds of clean. Properly cultured deep litter has an earthy, clean smell...sort of like good compost or rich soil. Particularly if there is plenty of ventilation. This system helps keep the coop environment a healthy clean as opposed to a clean that grows bad pathogens first. When you clean clean out all the goodies, the baddies get a foothold first and they grow faster than the goodies. Instead, why not make a healthy place for the goodies that can do all the work for you and keep the baddies in check?

Clean clean is a never ending story and usually a tragicomedy of errors. Healthy dirt is the kind that keeps animals and humans healthy.

Case in point...you have lice in your clean clean. In 36 years of keeping chickens I've never had lice until this old flock was living somewhere else(bad dirty) and then came home to me. The lice was gone in a few days, as they are standing on deep litter, and I'm confident that it will not be back. That's how good healthy dirt can be.

There is a learning curve that needs to happen about the concepts of healthy dirt and bad clean that needs to happen before one can understand the reasoning behind allowing some dirt to stay and some to go. It usually takes a lot of research with an eye towards natural ways of keeping animals healthy. If you really want a healthy flock that really stays healthy, I encourage you to study up on these methods and reasons.

I hope you give us updates on what you do and the results you found.
 
I used DE because I dont have access to wood ash. Dont have a wood stove nor does anyone on my block so I will put an add on Freecycle and see if someone wants to donate to the cause. I will stop giving the birds the leftovers (that will make the dogs happy
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) and just do the scratch and layer and I will fermant the scratch. I will switch over from straw to hay in the nest boxes. The twice a year cleaning of the walls and nest boxes will stop. Just to be clear the birds have access to the coop at all times in all weather and are only locked in it each night to protect from the local coons and even if I dont let them out of the chicken run they have 100 sq feet of sheltered dry pen for 9 birds .The coop itself is only 16 square feet but again they only sleep and lay there and I do have the smaller coop that will accomadate 2 birds. The birds never stay in the coop during the day even during extreme cold by their own choice. The silkies feed and go back to either the main coop or the smaller one during cold but the rest seem to prefer being outside even in rain and snow. I created a kind of dead air space in the run by tarping the north and west walls of the run leaving the south and east open to the light. The run only gets snow on the ground in there during extreme blizzard conditions and since I live in Colorado near Denver those bizzards arent an every winter event. In fact we never got snow again after the second week of January this past year.. The top of the run has a metal roof so rain and snow do not fall directly into the run. I do understand that the coop is really only big enough for 4 birds if they were shut up in it all the time but since they are only confined to it overnights do I still need to get rid of birds? If I do then I will. Besides freecycle where else could I look for a source of wood ash? Isnt that a strange question? Who knew that raising chickens in the burbs would be impeded by having a furnace instead of a wood stove?. Dang I wish I could move to a rural setting. My mom keeps telling me I cant turn city into country guess she was right lol.

Edited because I forgot to thank you for your help. appreciate your wisdom and will do the changes as suggested. Your awesome!

Might also try Craigslist and American Classifieds. The further from town, the more likely you are to find someone with a wood stove, with ashes they don't think they have a use for so putting the word out to people you know even casually may lead you to a reliable source. Ask at the feed store even.

To me, it seems the size of your coop really is too small for the number of birds you have, but you have options. You could enlarge your existing coop (build a frame under an area behind or next to your current coop, put on a floor, frame sides and a simple slant roof or frame to extend the roof you have, put on the sides and roof, put up a roost and cut a doorway into the exterior wall of your existing coop), look for another small one you could nestle up to your existing setup (if you watch Craigslist you will often find someone selling one for half the price of new) or even buy a kit and build it (check Amazon). The birds will appreciate more room inside to snuggle in during the cold months. Extra space in the separate doghouse helps, but it's the combined warmth of all the bodies in one space with plenty of room for everyone that makes it work best. Just my opinion, without seeing the setup you have, going only by your description, and I do not consider myself any kind of expert, just offering some ideas to expand the indoor space they have available. FWIW, my girls could not have cared less that it was blustery late last week in our state, they wanted to be outside more than inside most of the day. What I do see, though, is the afternoon nap time, when the sun isn't out, they all snooze in the coops.

There's a woman in Lakewood who builds coops from shipping crates and sides them with old barn wood - she is very reasonable, she advertises on Craigslist, and her tag line is almost always "Beautiful Coops". I bought one from her, she said it was the biggest one she had made to date, and it's almost 4' wide and a hair more than 8' long. What I found is that the spaces between her barn wood siding allowed for a lot of draft, so I wound up lining the interior with rolls of bubble-type insulation (it has foil wrapped around the outside so reflects heat as well) and am proceeding to cover the insulation with 1/4" plywood. I added vents by cutting holes for the floor-type vents which open and close near the top of two walls to maintain ventilation. I have 7 girls, so they will go from 2 coop-and-run setups inside a 10x10 chain link run, to this palace (in comparison) attached to the run - with their old coops removed of course, to give them lots more space both inside and outside. 2 of them get free range time for a couple of hours in the evenings after I get home, the other 5 will as soon as they are somewhat less inclined/able to fly to pretty decent height, which should be soon, but for now they are happy with what they have and should be ecstatic with their new digs :)

As BK often tells us, sun and fresh air go a long way toward healthy birds, and yours are getting those things, so it isn't as if you're doing a lot wrong, just a couple of tweaks will make it all good, from the sounds of it.

I wonder if the mulched area is causing some of the problems you're seeing? Splinters, critters living in the mulch, ? Might try limiting range area to the grass for now and just feed layer and maybe some scratch and veggie treats, I usually give veggies, scratch, yogurt, oatmeal, cooked eggs, corn on the cob - but in limited amounts, small treat first thing in the morning and again when I get home from work, and each treat only once or twice a week except veggies - I pick up scrap produce from my local Natural Grocer once a week and that is their treat that evening and again the next evening, and I give them the whole leaves of the greens so they have the pleasure of whapping them into pieces small enough to eat.

I am in the process of "farming" meal worms so they can have them as a treat once or twice a week. I bought 50 lb bags of cracked corn, whole wheat and whole oats to mix my own scratch, and the girls love it. Cook steel cut oats and throw in some peas or corn for one or two treats a week. Plain home made yogurt with raw pumpkin seeds or chia seed once a week. Slice up a Zucchini or Summer Squash once a week. All good treats, but none so often they can get overloaded. Layer always available to the girls who are laying, grower to those not quite there, and they often swipe snacks from one anothers' feeders :) Free access to grit and oyster shell. I doubt I have a perfect setup, there are many things I would love to improve, but we make due with what we have.

Overall I think you've been trying to compensate for lack of coop space with treat overload, and no doubt they love you for it, but are better served by letting them be chickens and giving them less treats and maybe some more coop space.

The reason I returned to being a chicken mama is the pure, unadulterated pleasure of watching a chicken chase a grasshopper, immersing myself in the soft and contented sounds hens make as they bed down for the night, and the silly way a Cochin runs when a treat might be in the offing with no hope of keeping up with her clean-legged sisters. There is an unspeakable satisfaction in the way a chicken lives its life, completely self-involved and always in pursuit of comfort and joy.
 
Really quick on the fermented feed arena. I somewhere got the idea that it took 2 weeks to a month to get feed to ferment instead of a day or two. As you know Bee, I have 85 birds more or less and was wondering, how much to start using crumbles, not pellets, and how do you feed them? You just glop some down in the gutter/trough and let them go at it?

What percentage in feed did it save you on your meat birds? 25% 50%?

Any thoughts if it would be healthy for hogs?

Thanks,

Shawn
shawn i can tell you on them meat birds feed . i save at the moment i save roughly 25%-30% on feed . that is feeding 2x per day . now that the babies are old enough to run with the free range big birds i will drop the feeding to 1 x a day. the fermented feed i use about 35 lbs on the 31 cx chicks. i use 15 lbs on the layers per week.
 
I used DE because I dont have access to wood ash. Dont have a wood stove nor does anyone on my block so I will put an add on Freecycle and see if someone wants to donate to the cause. I will stop giving the birds the leftovers (that will make the dogs happy
wink.png
) and just do the scratch and layer and I will fermant the scratch. I will switch over from straw to hay in the nest boxes. The twice a year cleaning of the walls and nest boxes will stop. Just to be clear the birds have access to the coop at all times in all weather and are only locked in it each night to protect from the local coons and even if I dont let them out of the chicken run they have 100 sq feet of sheltered dry pen for 9 birds .The coop itself is only 16 square feet but again they only sleep and lay there and I do have the smaller coop that will accomadate 2 birds. The birds never stay in the coop during the day even during extreme cold by their own choice. The silkies feed and go back to either the main coop or the smaller one during cold but the rest seem to prefer being outside even in rain and snow. I created a kind of dead air space in the run by tarping the north and west walls of the run leaving the south and east open to the light. The run only gets snow on the ground in there during extreme blizzard conditions and since I live in Colorado near Denver those bizzards arent an every winter event. In fact we never got snow again after the second week of January this past year.. The top of the run has a metal roof so rain and snow do not fall directly into the run. I do understand that the coop is really only big enough for 4 birds if they were shut up in it all the time but since they are only confined to it overnights do I still need to get rid of birds? If I do then I will. Besides freecycle where else could I look for a source of wood ash? Isnt that a strange question? Who knew that raising chickens in the burbs would be impeded by having a furnace instead of a wood stove?. Dang I wish I could move to a rural setting. My mom keeps telling me I cant turn city into country guess she was right lol.

Edited because I forgot to thank you for your help. appreciate your wisdom and will do the changes as suggested. Your awesome!
Breezy, do you have a spot in your yard for a small, portable outdoor fireplace? If burning wood is allowed where you are you can make your own wood ashes in a small chiminea (terra cotta free-standing fireplace). I use a portable fire pit - it's a metal bowl with a screen lid, on a low stand. I've seen them at hardware stores and garden centers and sometimes at Walmart or Target. They tend to be seasonal store items, so keep an eye out. You could also improvise with an inexpensive charcoal grill and some metal screening for spark prevention.
 
Breezy, do you have a spot in your yard for a small, portable outdoor fireplace? If burning wood is allowed where you are you can make your own wood ashes in a small chiminea (terra cotta free-standing fireplace). I use a portable fire pit - it's a metal bowl with a screen lid, on a low stand. I've seen them at hardware stores and garden centers and sometimes at Walmart or Target. They tend to be seasonal store items, so keep an eye out. You could also improvise with an inexpensive charcoal grill and some metal screening for spark prevention.

Great idea! Should be on sale about now, too!
 
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