The Seney thread

[Ducks and Banny hens]

I went to their website and read through all the info. I found it interesting. I have no interest in having one of these chickens as I find the vulture hocks completely unattractive, however I realize that there are plenty of things about my choosen breed that others would find unattractive. I cannot imagine anyone wanting to spend that kind of money on a chicken that cannot be shown at an APA sanctioned show, but to each of his own.

Well, the world doesn't revolve around showing. Look at Greenfire farms! $399.99 each for straight run chicks (a few breeds). Their breeds have less than 100 specimens worldwide! Value is not restricted to showing, but also rarity, utility, etc.
I sell Bow Lake fowl (-70 adults global) for $5 each adults, but I'm sure as more breeders pick it up, some will surely sell them for big $$$.
The reason I can sell so low is because they are hardy and broody enough that I don't pay anything to raise them, but more intensive situations require higher prices.
It is the choice of the breeder of what to sell for, and not the client.

 

[Ducks and Banny hens]

Ridiculous

I believe that anyone spends plenty of money to develop their birds. New breed or recognized. Those prices are just silly. Is this an advertisement?

Now, first, the price is lowering since they are beginning to pay for themselves. These are rare birds. Expensive birds. I would be willing to pay $450 for a trio of Seneys. They come in rare colors, and they are hardy. Only one problem - I'm in canada.

 

[Ducks and Banny hens]

Since you're such an expert on the Standard I'm sure you're familiar with the process for having a new breed recognized. It's a bit more complex than simply having an individual proclaim that "yes they are a breed". Without a sanctioning body recognizing a breed an individual's claim has little merit.

Well, I present unto you the Icelandic, the Finnish, the Rhinelander, the Bow Lake, the Ushanka, the Snyder, the Javanaise, the Kedu...

If everybody makes it so hard for the breeders, there is never going to be a new breed, ever. All of these breeds (except the first) could be recognised by the APA, but they aren't. Are they breeds? Of course not! (< very sarcastic) The Serama, under that criteria, wasn't a breed until last year. Yet it replaced the Old English game bantam as the nation's top bantam in under 10 years, without breeding true or being a recognised breed. It would seem that if they were bad, they wouldn't have caught on so well.


Don't get discouraged, Birkshire-spur. You are in the right. All that matters is that you know that the Seney is authentic, so don't listen to a bunch of virtual people (who don't know as much as you!) telling you that it isn't. Time will prove them wrong.

 

[v.cyr]

Quote:
Originally Posted by NYREDS
Without a sanctioning body recognizing a breed an individuals claim has little merit.




and the earth is flat, and the center of the universe, and every type of living thing that ever existed is living today, and only humans use tools, etc, and so on... historically speaking, those the most resistant to changing ideas always seem to look like the biggest idiots in retrospect... maybe instead of wasting time finding reasons why new varieties popping up aren't breeds according to the almighty APA( despite qualifying under real world definitions of the word), effort could be put to better uses, like encouraging the development/recognition of new breeds, preserving unrecognized breeds before they slip into oblivion and disappear, or any number of more worthwhile endeavors.


ps: I will add that I agree that the prices asked for these birds are ludicrous…

 

[fancychickenlover]

Omgosh I love these birds they have every trait that I love! Besides a crest but that would look silly, but really they are gorgeous I love the heavy foot feathering on them and the Ameraucana type face super pretty and I really like the tail they just look so elegant and exotic!

I also like the fact that they can lay any colored egg really awesome BREED i hope it gets accepted by the A.P.A. they really are spectacular!

 

[flyingmonkeypoop]

Folks, please don't argue too much, I would hate to see this thread closed.

I heard about these birds before and find them interesting. I personally wouldn't pay that much for them but that's just me. If they were showable I might pay a decent price just because they are eye catching. I encourage you to keep going with this project, once it gets more popularity people will start buying them like crazy. Have you thought about listing eggs/birds online for a lower price just for people to get started with them in an affordable way? If you start an auction for them at say, $50 for a pair and let the bidding go up from there, it is publicity. People will see it and want to get them so you start posting birds online with lower price for started pairs or something. Posting here on the forum and other sites is publicity. Spread the word more, make a facebook page for your farm, offer specials and have contests, I have a feeling these will become more popular with time.

p.s. I loved your story about your talk with the birds.

 

[Buck bird]

There are many misconceptions & misrepresentations about what constitutes a "breed" in this thread. A breed, for the term to have any meaning, has to breed true & certainly has to be consistant in egg colour. This board is full of reports of new "breeds" but there's more to establishing a breed than naming the offspring of a cross.
The birds in question in this thread are mutts & I think I do have an understanding of chickens breeding.
This thread brings to mind quotes by two famous Americans:
"A fool & his money are soon Parted"
"There's a sucker born every minute"

I agree, NYREDS. But then, you must remember that this is BYC. If you tell some on on here that you have created a new "breed" they will believe you and defend you with no information about it. Not to mention sell them for ridiculous prices. But "ignorance is bliss," right?

Buck bird

 

[NYREDS]

Interesting that you jump to the somewhat childish conclusion that I's suggesting these birds are somehow "bad". Your choice of Seramas as a defensive example is poorly chosen since Sreamas have been an established & exhibited breed for a very long time. Be advised that the world doesn't end at our shores.
We're not talking about Seramas here we're talking about "Seneys": a so-called breed developed by one person, named for that person & a breed who's defining characteristics were developed after seeing the result.
However another poster makes a good point. This is BYC & here there are no mutts, only new breeds. On another thread I saw a reference to a "breed", a double laced Seabright. They were the result of a croos between a Sebright & something else & there were only 2 of them but they were a "breed".
[BTW-love the sugestion that I'm an idiot. When in doubt name call]

Well, I present unto you the Icelandic, the Finnish, the Rhinelander, the Bow Lake, the Ushanka, the Snyder, the Javanaise, the Kedu...

If everybody makes it so hard for the breeders, there is never going to be a new breed, ever. All of these breeds (except the first) could be recognised by the APA, but they aren't. Are they breeds? Of course not! (< very sarcastic) The Serama, under that criteria, wasn't a breed until last year. Yet it replaced the Old English game bantam as the nation's top bantam in under 10 years, without breeding true or being a recognised breed. It would seem that if they were bad, they wouldn't have caught on so well.


Don't get discouraged, Birkshire-spur. You are in the right. All that matters is that you know that the Seney is authentic, so don't listen to a bunch of virtual people (who don't know as much as you!) telling you that it isn't. Time will prove them wrong.

 

[poularde]

Now I am no expert. Still pretty new to the chicken thing, but looking at the website it appears that the breed still needs quite a bit of development Color wise they still look like bad examples of the colors that they are supposed to be. The combs still look all over the place. I wish you luck on developing your breed further. If people will pay those prices than you must be doing something right.

Comparing them to imported birds does not make any sense to me. This is a great forum for learning and it is too bad that you can not take any criticism.

 

[Ducks and Banny hens]

Interesting that you jump to the somewhat childish conclusion that I's suggesting these birds are somehow "bad". Your choice of Seramas as a defensive example is poorly chosen since Sreamas have been an established & exhibited breed for a very long time. Be advised that the world doesn't end at our shores.
We're not talking about Seramas here we're talking about "Seneys": a so-called breed developed by one person, named for that person & a breed who's defining characteristics were developed after seeing the result.
However another poster makes a good point. This is BYC & here there are no mutts, only new breeds. On another thread I saw a reference to a "breed", a double laced Seabright. They were the result of a croos between a Sebright & something else & there were only 2 of them but they were a "breed".
[BTW-love the sugestion that I'm an idiot. When in doubt name call]

Very shrude. There were only two pictures, yes. Does that mean they are genetically unstable? Does that mean they are worthless? Does that mean they are mutts? No. You made the point yourself. This is an internet forum. Your not God. Nobody can look at a few photos and make a just judgement about the subject without having any experience whatsoever. How can you possibly know if a bird is a mutt or not by the photos? You cant. My advise is that people deserve the benefit of the doubt until they are proven to be dishonest about some birds. My point was not that you think the Seneys are bad, but that you've decided that they are mutts from just pictures.

I didn't suggest that you are an idiot. What did I say? I said that you aren't as knowledgable about Seneys as Birkshire is. Is that true? Yes. You haven't bred them, have you? Have you ever even seen a flock of them or even one specimen in person? No. Ryan and Birkshire are the only ones here who have experience with the breed. I don't myself, but I, like I mentioned above, would rather give people the benefit of the doubt when I don't know much about something. All I know is that it really hurts when you are trying to promote the fruits of years of hard work and everybody talks you down as some grifter.