Quote:
They Can.. But the have to expect to PAY good money for it....
They Can.. But the have to expect to PAY good money for it....
This really irks me (Show Quality VS. Non-Show)
- Thread starter little_grey_bantam
- Start date
Quote:
They Can.. But the have to expect to PAY good money for it....
ooh yeah..thats totally understandable.. Nothings free!
They Can.. But the have to expect to PAY good money for it....
ooh yeah..thats totally understandable.. Nothings free!
- Thread starter
- #23
Quote:
There are 4-H and county fair shows and then there are APA sanctioned shows. They can be as different as night and day.
I have birds that are from breeders that have won at shows with some of the parent stock of my birds. I would never claim that the birds I've got are show quality since I don't show nor do I plan to. But I do show potential customers pictures of my birds and the lines I started out with and let them decide if they think the price I charge is worth it.
I guess I'm not sure what exactly you're upset about or asking. Are you upset that people don't think your birds are show quality and don't want to pay what you're charging?
There is nothing wrong with a 4-Her wanting true show quality birds to show.....I think they're ahead of the game to NOT get from a hatchery and start out with good stock. Starting out with hatchery stock and trying to "breed up" to show quality is a long drawn out process which will more than likely take many generations of birds and you'll spend much more on feed over time with the numbers you'll have to hatch out and cull to get your birds where you want them.
Well, I don't mind that they want show quality birds, but last year when I was selling chicks, I had a lot of people say "Well, the hatchery only sells their SQ birds for $[insert 1-4 dollars]" and expected me to go lower! I was like O.O!!!!!!!! Mind you, my birds were as stated a few weeks old and they were only wanting to pay $3-5; I even had a lady rip me a new one for asking $5 for a pullet at I believe 4-6 weeks old >_<
I think most people get confused with teh terms. I never offer "SQ" birds for sale; I don't think my birds are "that great" lol because "I could better it".
But ti's just silly people will compare the birds I sell compared to Hatcheries
(Oh but they're cheaper!!)
I think people are wanting to get the cheapest bird to sorta feel good about themselves or are getting it all wrong in context. Out in the city before I moved out here, parents would purchase an adult animal for their kids to show and "raise" even though they were already raised right before the shows (or a month before). That sort of defeats the 4H ideas, thoughts, standards and the reason 4H started. LOL
I think people are just out to get things cheaper. I bit my tongue and purchased FBCMs and although sometimes I feel dumb for spending hundreds, I feel good because my birds are good (though not the best) but I'm hanging in there to try to better the line. I had people who wanted to purchase my adults (hens) for no more than $25. "Anymore is ridiculous! I can get a chicken at the store for $3.99/I can get other chickens for $3-$10" --- Well, than go buy them elsewhere and don't expect me to sell my birds from non-hatch lines to you for cheap like veryone else!
There are 4-H and county fair shows and then there are APA sanctioned shows. They can be as different as night and day.
I have birds that are from breeders that have won at shows with some of the parent stock of my birds. I would never claim that the birds I've got are show quality since I don't show nor do I plan to. But I do show potential customers pictures of my birds and the lines I started out with and let them decide if they think the price I charge is worth it.
I guess I'm not sure what exactly you're upset about or asking. Are you upset that people don't think your birds are show quality and don't want to pay what you're charging?
There is nothing wrong with a 4-Her wanting true show quality birds to show.....I think they're ahead of the game to NOT get from a hatchery and start out with good stock. Starting out with hatchery stock and trying to "breed up" to show quality is a long drawn out process which will more than likely take many generations of birds and you'll spend much more on feed over time with the numbers you'll have to hatch out and cull to get your birds where you want them.
Well, I don't mind that they want show quality birds, but last year when I was selling chicks, I had a lot of people say "Well, the hatchery only sells their SQ birds for $[insert 1-4 dollars]" and expected me to go lower! I was like O.O!!!!!!!! Mind you, my birds were as stated a few weeks old and they were only wanting to pay $3-5; I even had a lady rip me a new one for asking $5 for a pullet at I believe 4-6 weeks old >_<
I think most people get confused with teh terms. I never offer "SQ" birds for sale; I don't think my birds are "that great" lol because "I could better it".
But ti's just silly people will compare the birds I sell compared to Hatcheries
I think people are wanting to get the cheapest bird to sorta feel good about themselves or are getting it all wrong in context. Out in the city before I moved out here, parents would purchase an adult animal for their kids to show and "raise" even though they were already raised right before the shows (or a month before). That sort of defeats the 4H ideas, thoughts, standards and the reason 4H started. LOL
I think people are just out to get things cheaper. I bit my tongue and purchased FBCMs and although sometimes I feel dumb for spending hundreds, I feel good because my birds are good (though not the best) but I'm hanging in there to try to better the line. I had people who wanted to purchase my adults (hens) for no more than $25. "Anymore is ridiculous! I can get a chicken at the store for $3.99/I can get other chickens for $3-$10" --- Well, than go buy them elsewhere and don't expect me to sell my birds from non-hatch lines to you for cheap like veryone else!
Exactly my point in a year when a person has 15 20 dollars worth of feed bedding and care in their birds Whether or not they spent 3 dollars or 10 on the original bird is nearly insignificant, unless you are doing meat birds or something like that.
I think this especially true if you intend to hatch or sell a single bird. Purchasing birds from good breeders that have shown and won does not make a show quality chicken, but it sure gets you down the road a lot further than ordering from any of the larger hatcheries that pay little attention to the standard.
I think this especially true if you intend to hatch or sell a single bird. Purchasing birds from good breeders that have shown and won does not make a show quality chicken, but it sure gets you down the road a lot further than ordering from any of the larger hatcheries that pay little attention to the standard.
Just getting online now.....
Here is the response I sent to the guy last week after he posted that splash trio on Eggbid. I thought I was fairly courteous about it. He took down the pic of the lavendar rooster but kept the rest of my old pics up and wouldn't edit the description at all.....
I don't mind you reselling them. Once you purchase them they are your to do with as you please. The Eggbid listing is a bit mis-leading though. The first pic is of a lavendar rooster I used to have and sold to the Asians. Its not even 1 of the 3 birds in your listing. Putting old pics that were not taken by you is also a no-no. Take some new pics of their current condition and please don't use my pics. People are going to bid on them and think OMG these birds are in fabulous condition. I was more than truthfull about any faults and them being trimmed up for breeding/winter right now. That rooster is awesome, but he's not in the same condition as that pic on there right now. I gave you before pics AND pics of their current condition as of the time I sent them. Please have the courtesy not to mislead your buyers.
Amy
By looking at the buyers user id on that auction, I am fairly sure that is Jack Ferguson. Once those birds come out of a molt, I think he will be pleasantly surprised.
This is from an e-mail I sent to him before he purchased the birds from me. I was very clear on the condition and faults of these birds.
I do still have them available. I was planning on taking them along to the swap next weekend (Feb. 7th) if I don't have a buyer before that. I've used that cock for 2 years now and have saved back 2 of his sons that are just better than him though. He has been shown at least 3 times and has done very well. He has good toes, a decent comb, good foot feathering, nice body/stance, usually has a huge crest, and can breed naturally without AI. On the downside, he has 2 horns coming off his comb, has more of a mulberry skin/comb than black, and tends to throw some white on the toes of his chicks. On the pullets, they are both about 8 months old and have a really good blue color. They have good skin color, nicely shaped combs, good feet, etc. Neither are wide enough through the cushion for my liking though. Do take into effect that all these birds have been in group pens since November. They are not in perfect feather condition right now. I did trim crests and cushions for breeding season and so they could see. A few weeks ago when temps went from -30 to 30 above 0 it threw most of my birds into a molt too. Their price reflects this condition right now.
and this is from another e-mail... These was sent before payment was ever sent to me. I included dozens of before pics and roughly 10 pics of what they looked like at that exact moment fresh after their bath and dry.
Got them all bathed this afternoon. The rooster was still fairly wet underneath his wings and back through the cushion yet though. The dark splash hen looked like a porcupine while I was bathing her. She must have caught a toe on the carrier on the way in. Its nothing that will hurt her, but I will mention that she scraped it. She is just molting too and should look 100% better soon. Those 2 birds are massive in body structure. They also have lighter skin due to the double recessive splash and have some lighter skin on the toes too. She is missing a couple toenails and he is missing 1 from the wire breeder cages last year too. These 2 will get huge crests, have nice tight wings, nice cushions, and have some of the best foot feathering I have ever seen in splash. If you want the nice solid very typey birds, these are it.
All 3 of the blues are the correct shade, all hatched last March, and are pretty dang nice. All have good combs, tight wings, good foot feathering, etc. The 2 aren't as round through the cushion as I like. For show birds, I want a nice round full cushion and these are more V shaped. The 3rd blue is awesome through the body but has some light on the toes again. It goes back to the Mihalik breeding there. Not going to hurt her, but I am going to point it out. If you kept those crests taped up or separate them off from the rooster, I'm sure they will get to be at least baseball sized on these too.
Here is the response I sent to the guy last week after he posted that splash trio on Eggbid. I thought I was fairly courteous about it. He took down the pic of the lavendar rooster but kept the rest of my old pics up and wouldn't edit the description at all.....
I don't mind you reselling them. Once you purchase them they are your to do with as you please. The Eggbid listing is a bit mis-leading though. The first pic is of a lavendar rooster I used to have and sold to the Asians. Its not even 1 of the 3 birds in your listing. Putting old pics that were not taken by you is also a no-no. Take some new pics of their current condition and please don't use my pics. People are going to bid on them and think OMG these birds are in fabulous condition. I was more than truthfull about any faults and them being trimmed up for breeding/winter right now. That rooster is awesome, but he's not in the same condition as that pic on there right now. I gave you before pics AND pics of their current condition as of the time I sent them. Please have the courtesy not to mislead your buyers.
Amy
By looking at the buyers user id on that auction, I am fairly sure that is Jack Ferguson. Once those birds come out of a molt, I think he will be pleasantly surprised.
This is from an e-mail I sent to him before he purchased the birds from me. I was very clear on the condition and faults of these birds.
I do still have them available. I was planning on taking them along to the swap next weekend (Feb. 7th) if I don't have a buyer before that. I've used that cock for 2 years now and have saved back 2 of his sons that are just better than him though. He has been shown at least 3 times and has done very well. He has good toes, a decent comb, good foot feathering, nice body/stance, usually has a huge crest, and can breed naturally without AI. On the downside, he has 2 horns coming off his comb, has more of a mulberry skin/comb than black, and tends to throw some white on the toes of his chicks. On the pullets, they are both about 8 months old and have a really good blue color. They have good skin color, nicely shaped combs, good feet, etc. Neither are wide enough through the cushion for my liking though. Do take into effect that all these birds have been in group pens since November. They are not in perfect feather condition right now. I did trim crests and cushions for breeding season and so they could see. A few weeks ago when temps went from -30 to 30 above 0 it threw most of my birds into a molt too. Their price reflects this condition right now.
and this is from another e-mail... These was sent before payment was ever sent to me. I included dozens of before pics and roughly 10 pics of what they looked like at that exact moment fresh after their bath and dry.
Got them all bathed this afternoon. The rooster was still fairly wet underneath his wings and back through the cushion yet though. The dark splash hen looked like a porcupine while I was bathing her. She must have caught a toe on the carrier on the way in. Its nothing that will hurt her, but I will mention that she scraped it. She is just molting too and should look 100% better soon. Those 2 birds are massive in body structure. They also have lighter skin due to the double recessive splash and have some lighter skin on the toes too. She is missing a couple toenails and he is missing 1 from the wire breeder cages last year too. These 2 will get huge crests, have nice tight wings, nice cushions, and have some of the best foot feathering I have ever seen in splash. If you want the nice solid very typey birds, these are it.
All 3 of the blues are the correct shade, all hatched last March, and are pretty dang nice. All have good combs, tight wings, good foot feathering, etc. The 2 aren't as round through the cushion as I like. For show birds, I want a nice round full cushion and these are more V shaped. The 3rd blue is awesome through the body but has some light on the toes again. It goes back to the Mihalik breeding there. Not going to hurt her, but I am going to point it out. If you kept those crests taped up or separate them off from the rooster, I'm sure they will get to be at least baseball sized on these too.
- Thread starter
- #26
What? You got issues with Asians??!!!
Ack! You should have sold me your birds!!!!
Although I'm Asian
I would have kept them foreverrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr as pets! <3
I've always wanted a Lavender, <3 Heck, I even make a fit if someone tries to eat one of the roos LOL All 20 pet roos
l
So you're telling me, somene out there could be selling beautiful colored silkies for food???
OMG which swap meet is this???!! O.O
Ya should have sold them to me!!! *jumps up and down*
What a jerk for lying though like that
Quote:
Ack! You should have sold me your birds!!!!
Although I'm Asian
I've always wanted a Lavender, <3 Heck, I even make a fit if someone tries to eat one of the roos LOL All 20 pet roos
So you're telling me, somene out there could be selling beautiful colored silkies for food???
OMG which swap meet is this???!! O.O
Ya should have sold them to me!!! *jumps up and down*
What a jerk for lying though like that
Quote:
I seriously hope this guy is on here and reads this. Reselling a bird because you find out that its a lil too high maintenance for you is one thing... Just trying to make a quick buck is another... Misrepresenting the stock, not using your own pics, much less not even the pics of those particular birds is wrong. I know he has a digital camera. How hard is it to go out and take your own pics? Leaving a person negative feedback accomplishes nothing more than them leaving a bunch for you too usually.
I have no issue with Asians. I am friends with quite a few in fact. I do sell to them for butcher birds.... Its birds that I usually deem as PQ and don't want it to go back into anyones breeding flock. That particular rooster I sold them was drop dead gorgeous til his second year. After he molted again, red started apearing in his shoulders. It was also appearing in his offspring from the season before too. When you hatch 400 + per year, you end up with more cockerels than you can house. There are enough good quality ones to be sold for breeding. The sub-par ones don't all need to be reproducing.
I have lavendars popping up out of my splash on a regular occurance. Its not an approved color in the SOP and can only be shown as AOV. I do not choose to work with it and pass those on to friends.
I have lavendars popping up out of my splash on a regular occurance. Its not an approved color in the SOP and can only be shown as AOV. I do not choose to work with it and pass those on to friends.
- Thread starter
- #29
Quote:
I was teasing you lol
Ack! I still would have kept him as a pet!
He could hang out with my other roosters <3 They may be bachelors or have the run with a bunch of mix girlfriends but none of my roos are complaining
Where do you hide all these babies??
I was teasing you lol
Ack! I still would have kept him as a pet!
Where do you hide all these babies??
I did go to the MN Game Breeder's Swap today and met quite a few fellow BYC members. Attendance was unreal... The silkies present were also a good representation between hatchery stock and breeder stock. I did walk around and check out birds too. I saw non-bearded and bearded. I couldn't begin to guess at some of the colors people were trying to pass off as partridge and buff. There is a huge difference between the $50 cockerel that I sold and the people that were struggling to get $15 for pairs.
I brought along 2 pretty nice 10 month old cockerels. I had a white that has been shown and done very well. Its just that I don't need 6 white boys... I had originally saved back 4 and picked up 2 more from Connie about a month ago. I also brought a black boy that was perfect in every way except for a hint of silver in the hackles. He was priced as such... I had people coming by taking pictures and get on a waiting list for chicks. I had people comment if I had them on steroids or what and OMG how do I get them to look like that? Your average swap people don't get to see these kind of birds.
The one guy with his daughter was really nice to talk to. He understood the meaning of getting good stock to begin with. Another guy was sooo proud of his daughter ordering 60 silkies from a hatchery for 4-H. I asked them if they would buy any from this other guy who had a huge pen of them there. He just seemed half offended and gave me a disgusted look like 'are you kidding'? He pointed at mine and stated...'no I'm getting 60 that look like this from such and such a hatchery.' Good luck buddy...
What also gets me is the 4-H kids first looking for chicks now for fair. Their fairs are only 4-5 months away. They should have been getting chicks back in the beginning of January already. Several got on my waiting list and I told them it might be the end of April til I have some available. They seem to think they will be just fine to show them this summer.
I brought along 2 pretty nice 10 month old cockerels. I had a white that has been shown and done very well. Its just that I don't need 6 white boys... I had originally saved back 4 and picked up 2 more from Connie about a month ago. I also brought a black boy that was perfect in every way except for a hint of silver in the hackles. He was priced as such... I had people coming by taking pictures and get on a waiting list for chicks. I had people comment if I had them on steroids or what and OMG how do I get them to look like that? Your average swap people don't get to see these kind of birds.
The one guy with his daughter was really nice to talk to. He understood the meaning of getting good stock to begin with. Another guy was sooo proud of his daughter ordering 60 silkies from a hatchery for 4-H. I asked them if they would buy any from this other guy who had a huge pen of them there. He just seemed half offended and gave me a disgusted look like 'are you kidding'? He pointed at mine and stated...'no I'm getting 60 that look like this from such and such a hatchery.' Good luck buddy...
What also gets me is the 4-H kids first looking for chicks now for fair. Their fairs are only 4-5 months away. They should have been getting chicks back in the beginning of January already. Several got on my waiting list and I told them it might be the end of April til I have some available. They seem to think they will be just fine to show them this summer.
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