Thoughts on Universal healthcare

[AnnesChicks]

I just have to chime in, I've been working with families for 19 years and I think it is important to point out that the majority of people/families without medical coverage are WORKING! I see how this impacts families up close and personal on a daily basis. The majority of jobs no longer provide coverage, or if their employer does offer coverage the premiums are so insanely expensive that families can not afford them.

Think about your own families and friends, I'll bet everyone on this forum knows someone without health coverage, think about your young relatives just starting out in entry level jobs, or your older family members who are retired (or wish they could) but not old enough for medicare. Think about the people you know that have had to file bankruptcy and lose everything because of a medical problem! (this happened to my sister and brother in law, and also my 21 year old niece)

Then there is this crazy rx drug coverage for seniors that is so complicated with so many loopholes people need to be trained to explain it to consumers, and just ask my mom-they keep changing their coverage, so that she ends up paying more and more.

I think it is a national shame that so many of our citizens are at risk, and I believe as a nation we need to pick a course of action and get started - lives literally depend on it.

 

[yotetrapper]

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God bless you! If only half the people in the country had a quarter of the integrity and pride that you do, we wouldnt be even discussing this now!

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Ah, but the plan the new President is proposing says just that. Your doctors will be chosen for you, and also, the gov't would decide if you are too "old" or "unfit" for a treatment that could better be used to help a younger, fitter person. Plus, your medical records would be stored in a central database that any medical professional would have access to.

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Now there IS a good idea. Public schooling is a grand part of the problem. Kids are being brainwashed with socialist propaganda in the schools today, and if I am ever blessed with a child he/she would never set foot in a public school. Teaching grade schoolers songs supporting Obama before he was ever elected? Or how about the school that sent their first graders on a field trip to their lesbian teachers wedding (yes, a lesbian wedding)? No thanks!


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I can't think of a single person in my family without insurance of some sort, and we're all lower middle class...heck, maybe even low class lol. My grandparents have insurance through my grandfather's past employer, as part of his retirement... my mom and stepdad are both disabled and on medicaid (so help is available already for those that can't work), my dad has insurance thru his blue collar factory job, I had insurance thru my kitchen working job until I dropped it to join my husband's thru his matience job, my step-son doesn't have insurance, because he opts not to pay for it, thru his electrician's entry level job but he does carry it for his son.

People make it sound as though health insurance through employers is nearly non-existent? My current job in FAST FOOD even offers insurance once you've been their a year if you work full time. Those that work their that dont work full time ARE elligible for medicaid, and BOY do they use it too LOL. I never seen no one go to the doctor more than one girl their on medicaid.

Here is an example of what ticks me off... the other day I asked a couple of girls at work if they would like some eggs. One of them said sure, and I proceded to tell her I charge $1/doz. She immediately told me she didnt want them then... because she gets foodstamps. Foodstamps! She works 40+ hours a week as a manager, lives with a live in boyfriend who works, and has 2 kids. But even she gets foodstamps. I imagine I would be eligible as well then LOL. I dont need them. Why does she???

 

[ursusarctosana]

Or what about public schools teaching children that Columbus "discovered" America? Gotta love that one!

LOL.

 

[moduckman]

My gosh, no wonder this country is so messed up. Yotetrapper you are so misinformed it is scary that people might believe what you write. Others saying to not fund public education and not provide healthcare and food stamps. There is another blog about not paying taxes. What people fail to realize is while there is a precentage who abuse the offerings, many, many more benefit. Now, in these hard economic times the government needs to assist those additional people in need, not turn their backs on them. If you don't need help, don't take it and don't belittle those the do. I pay my fair share of taxes. We must pay taxes. This is a democratic government of the people, for the people and by the people. Democracy is not free, it is paid for by the citizens - the roads, schools, hospitals, and yes even the politicians we put into office. Universal healthcare is being looked at because the rising costs and the fact that millions cannot afford it. Right or wrong it needs to be looked at. As far as choosing your doctor for you, that is crap. Doctors are in a plan. Most get in plans they have now. My insurance hasd 1000's of dr. Only a few are nhot in it. I think this is fair because if I want one of those doctors, I pay 20-30% not the 10%.

 

[yotetrapper]

What exactly am I misinformed about? I'll repost the article below about the clause hidden in the bill regarding treatment for elderly and the unhealthy. Am I misinformed about what is being taught in public schools? The person who made the post about funding for public schools being taken away was (I think) joking, and while I realize that it's not really feasible at all, I am very upset about how my education tax dollars are being spent. For everyone one person I know who genuinely NEED foodstamps, and public assistance, I know ten others abusing the system. Because the caseworkers want it that way. Couldnt cut out their job security, could they?

I'm not against public assistance, I'm against the way it's done in this country. In Germany as far back as the 70s, their people on public assistance reported to "work" everyday, and work they did, picking up trash on the interstates and doing other cleaning in public areas. Only then did they get their checks.

The first step, IMO, in welfare reform is mandatory drug testing. Once a month YOU go to PICK UP your check (no sense wasting postage mailing them) and at the point submit to a urine test. If you pass, you get your money. If you fail, sorry for your luck. That step alone would cut this country's welfare burden in half.


______________________________________________________

Reposted article...

> We elected the politicians passing these bills. Time to vote some of them
> out of office.
>
> And, folks ~ This is not the only hidden surprise in this 600 page bill.
>
>
>
> _____
>
>
>
> The stimulus pork bill which passed in the House last week and the Senate,
> contains the nationalization of health care, the computerization of
> everybody's health records, and rationing of medical care for seasoned
> citizens. If you're a seasoned citizen and you go to the doctor, you have
> an ailment of some kind, the doctor will do a test. The doctor will then
> consult your medical records. The doctor will then consult federal
> guidelines to find out if you are to be treated. And if the cost of your
> treatment as a seasoned citizen is deemed by the government to be too
> expensive based on how much longer you have to live, then you don't get
> treated. The architect of this is one Tom Daschle from South Dakota , and
> he says much like Governor Dick Lamm of Colorado , (paraphrasing) "Old
> people, you gotta come to grips with your circumstances, you gotta come to
> grips with your diagnosis and understand we're all going to die sometime and
> it's your turn." This is in the Senate stimulus bill. And members of
> Congress are exempt from all this. They have their own health care plan...
> the one Obama promised he wanted for all of us. Well, that's not what we're
> getting.
>
>
> _____
>
>
> Ruin Your Health With the Obama Stimulus Plan: by Betsy McCaughey
>
>
> Feb. 9 (Bloomberg) -- Republican Senators are questioning whether President
> Barack
> <http://search.bloomberg.com/search?q=Barack+Obama&site=wnews&client=wnews&p
> roxystylesheet=wnews&output=xml_no_dtd&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&filter=p&getfields=
> wnnis&sort=date:S:d1> Obama's stimulus bill contains the right mix of tax
> breaks and cash infusions to jump-start the economy.
>
> Tragically, no one from either party is objecting to the health provisions
> slipped in without discussion. These provisions reflect the handiwork of Tom
> <http://search.bloomberg.com/search?q=Tom+Daschle&site=wnews&client=wnews&pr
> oxystylesheet=wnews&output=xml_no_dtd&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&filter=p&getfields=w
> nnis&sort=date:S:d1> Daschle, until recently the nominee to head the
> Health and Human Services Department.
>
> Senators should read these provisions and vote against them because they are
> dangerous to your health. (Page numbers refer to H.R. 1 EH
> <http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/z?c111:H.R.+1:> , pdf version).
>
> The bill's health rules will affect "every individual in the United States "
> (445, 454, 479). Your medical treatments will be tracked electronically by a
> federal system. Having electronic medical records at your fingertips, easily
> transferred to a hospital, is beneficial. It will help avoid duplicate tests
> and errors.
>
> But the bill goes further. One new bureaucracy, the National Coordinator of
> Health Information Technology, will monitor treatments to make sure your
> doctor is doing what the federal government deems appropriate and cost
> effective. The goal is to reduce costs and "guide" your doctor's decisions
> (442, 446). These provisions in the stimulus bill are virtually identical to
> what Daschle prescribed in his 2008 book, "Critical:
> <http://www.amazon.com/Critical-What-About-Health-Care-Crisis/dp/0312383010/
> ref=pd_bbs_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1234118804&sr=8-1> What We Can Do About
> the Health-Care Crisis." According to Daschle, doctors have to give up
> autonomy and "learn to operate less like solo practitioners."
>
> Keeping doctors informed of the newest medical findings is important, but
> enforcing uniformity goes too far.
>
> New Penalties
>
> Hospitals and doctors that are not "meaningful users" of the new system will
> face penalties. "Meaningful user" isn't defined in the bill. That will be
> left to the HHS <http://www.hhs.gov/> secretary, who will be empowered to
> impose "more stringent measures of meaningful use over time" (511, 518,
> 540-541)
>
> What penalties will deter your doctor from going beyond the electronically
> delivered protocols when your condition is atypical or you need an
> experimental treatment? The vagueness is intentional. In his book, Daschle
> proposed an appointed body with vast powers to make the "tough" decisions
> elected politicians won't make.
>
> The stimulus bill does that, and calls it the Federal Coordinating Council
> for Comparative Effectiveness Research (190-192). The goal, Daschle's book
> explained, is to slow the development and use of new medications and
> technologies because they are driving up costs. He praises Europeans for
> being more willing to accept "hopeless diagnoses" and "forgo experimental
> treatments," and he chastises Americans for expecting too much from the
> health-care system.
>
> Elderly Hardest Hit
>
> Daschle says health-care reform "will not be pain free." Seniors should be
> more accepting of the conditions that come with age instead of treating
> them. That means the elderly will bear the brunt.
>
> Medicare <http://www.medicare.gov/> now pays for treatments deemed safe and
> effective. The stimulus bill would change that and apply a cost-
> effectiveness standard set by the Federal Council (464).
>
> The Federal Council is modeled after a U.K. board discussed in Daschle's
> book. This board approves or rejects treatments using a formula that divides
> the cost of the treatment by the number of years the patient is likely to
> benefit. Treatments for younger patients are more often approved than
> treatments for diseases that affect the elderly, such as osteoporosis.
>
> In 2006, a U.K. health board decreed that elderly patients with macular
> degeneration had to wait until they went blind in one eye before they could
> get a costly new drug to save the other eye. It took almost three years of
> public protests before the board reversed its decision.
>
> Hidden Provisions
>
> If the Obama administration's economic stimulus bill passes the Senate
> <http://www.senate.gov/> in its current form, seniors in the U.S. will face
> similar rationing. Defenders of the system say that individuals benefit in
> younger years and sacrifice later.
>
> The stimulus bill will affect every part of health care, from medical and
> nursing education, to how patients are treated and how much hospitals get
> paid. The bill allocates more funding for this bureaucracy than for the
> Army, Navy, Marines, and Air Force combined (90-92, 174-177, 181).
>
> Hiding health legislation in a stimulus bill is intentional. Daschle
> supported the Clinton administration's health-care overhaul in 1994, and
> attributed its failure to debate and delay. A year ago, Daschle wrote that
> the next president should act quickly before critics mount an opposition.
> "If that means attaching a health-care plan to the federal budget, so be
> it," he said. "The issue is too important to be stalled by Senate protocol."
>
>
> More Scrutiny Needed
>
> President Obama called it "inexcusable and irresponsible" for senators to
> delay passing the stimulus bill. In truth, this bill needs more scrutiny.
>
> The health-care industry is the largest employer in the U.S. It produces
> almost 17 percent of the nation's gross domestic product. Yet the bill
> treats health care the way European governments do: as a cost problem
> instead of a growth industry. Imagine limiting growth and innovation in the
> electronics or auto industry during this downturn. This stimulus is
> dangerous to your health and the economy.
>
> (Betsy
> <http://search.bloomberg.com/search?q=Betsy+McCaughey&site=wnews&client=wnew
> s&proxystylesheet=wnews&output=xml_no_dtd&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&filter=p&getfiel
> ds=wnnis&sort=date:S:d1> McCaughey is former lieutenant governor of New
> York and is an adjunct senior fellow at the Hudson Institute. The opinions
> expressed are her own.)
>
> To contact the writer of this column: Betsy McCaughey at [email protected]

 

[geareduplyn]

I've been watching this thread and chiming in every now and then. Admittedly, I am politically somewhere to the right of Atilla the Hun. All you young socialists are the ones who are going to be paying for all of this. I really don't care anymore. I have bucked the odds for a long time and will continue to do so for as long as I last, but I have only a short time left, whereas some of you youngsters have what amounts to all your adult life. I wish you well and hope that some of the utopia that is envisioned is realized.

 

[klf73]

I will agree, they are really pushing the socialist thing is school. I have kids in 3 different schools and they all *know* what it is and how it is *better* for us. We put it into a different perspective for them but using the same analogies the teachers are using.....

 

[Mahonri]

Enrollments at med schools are plummeting because of the news of universal healthcare. They realize they'll never be able to pay off their school loans.

Physicians are retiring in record numbers, they don't want to work for nothing.

Good luck finding a doctor. Welcome to socialism.

 

[klf73]

Quote:
Gary, your post made me laugh....
dh and I always say we were born in the wrong century......unfortunately we still have lots of years left to watch all this

 

[beak]

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Good reason for public funding of higher education. Doctors are in a profession to help people. Amazingly some actually do it for that reason vs making a lot of money. If they didn't have 12 years of student loans to pay back they could help people and still survive. This country is way behind in social issues.