Topic of the Week - Deworming chickens

[casportpony]

I've been using garlic powder in my chicken for a while. I believe it helps with the worms issue

Please don't count on it, and keep in mind that garlic can be toxic to birds and other pets.

• http://bestbirdfoodever.com/home/wp...ng-parrots-never-feed-garlic-onions-or-leeks/
• http://www.birdchannel.com/bird-diet-and-health/bird-nutrition/birds-onions-and-garlic.aspx

-Kathy

 

[Kay Kew]

-Kathy

That looks very like what I was seeing!! Well I feel a mixture of relief and chagrin at this stage! Next time I am wondering about anything to do with my hens, I will come to this site first before going anywhere near the vet!! My thanks to rebrascora and Kathy....thank you both for putting me right on that score. So now I am wondering have my hens had any worm or parasite problems at all!! Any thoughts on what might cause them to apparently 'gape' occasionally (i.e. carry out a clear 'yawning' type of action with head tilted back) and 'sneeze' (in the very slight way I have described earlier) now and again?? Also what is the cause and/function of shedding the intestinal lining in this way?

 

[rebrascora]

I am pleased I was able to help put your mind at rest a little. I don't personally worry about shed intestinal lining and it hasn't resulted in any problems with my birds on the occasions that I have seen it, but I did read on one post here on BYC about shed intestinal lining, when I was looking for images for it (Kathy beat me to posting some), that it can be caused by capillary worms. I don't know if that is correct or not, but I have not experienced problems with capillary worms in my flock and I haven't wormed them in the past 3 years, so I suspect the "CAN" part of that statement might be a bit like saying you can get run over crossing the road.....ie It's a low risk possibility.

As I suggested in my first post on this thread, the thing to do might be to get a faecal sample analysed for worm eggs.
You have to remember that, as outdoor animals, chickens will most likely have worms so don't assume that you have to worm if you get a positive result. There is a balance with all parasites and a healthy chickens should be able to tolerate a low worm burden and it is probably normal for it to do so. However, sometimes for various reasons, the balance is upset and the parasite infestation becomes too great and the chicken starts to show signs of illness and failing to thrive. In my opinion, that is the time to worm them or if you are seeing worms regularly in their poop. I also check the intestines of cockerels that I process or any other bird that dies (I have Marek's disease in my flock), to give me an idea of the worm burden level. I have never found more than one or two so far.

As regards the "gaping" I think many people see this behaviour and assume it is gape worm because of the name. It is more commonly associated with respiratory infection or crop readjustment than gape worm in my opinion. I've certainly seen my chickens do it and again, I have not found gapeworm but I do have a chronic respiratory infection which circulates my flock every once in a while. Respiratory infections are very common in chickens, so again, this is a more likely cause. It also may be that chickens yawn too.... I know horses, dogs and cats do as well as humans and probably many other creatures, so why not chickens

I do not specifically know why chickens shed intestinal lining but I think it may be to do with their system using grit which will have an abrasive effect on their gut even though it is mostly fine particles that pass out of the gizzard and perhaps the intestine is constantly, if very slowly regenerated as a result of this abrasion and the old remnants shed. This is just a guess based on what I know of their digestive system.... I'll be interested to read Kathy's response to that question because I'm pretty confident that if she doesn't already know, she will find the correct answer for us.

I think the problem with vets is that they usually have little or no experience of chickens. As a business. it doesn't really pay to turn patients/customers away. The honest ones will say that they don't treat chickens and that might be quite frustrating as a chicken owner with a sick bird but it is far more annoying to find a vet that will treat chickens, pay them good money and later find that they actually don't know much and you could have got better advice here for free. The beauty of this site is that we can all share our collective experience to help each other and improve our own knowledge. I am indebted to all the people whose posts I have read in order to gain the knowledge I have and hopefully that will continue for many years to come.

Best wishes

Barbara

 

[SunHwaKwon]

Barbara-

When you check the chickens for worms, do you have a specific technique? Cut the intestine open from gizzard to colon with little scissors, maybe?

 

[casportpony]

In my flock intestinal lining is not normal, so when I see it I deworm and/or treat for coccidiosis.

Here are poop piles from one hen In this picture you can see intestinal lining:


In this picture the roundworm:


So while many websites and and posts say it's normal, I think when you are seeing excess amounts it probably is not normal.

-Kathy

 

[Kay Kew]

I am pleased I was able to help put your mind at rest a little. I don't personally worry about shed intestinal lining and it hasn't resulted in any problems with my birds on the occasions that I have seen it, but I did read on one post here on BYC about shed intestinal lining, when I was looking for images for it (Kathy beat me to posting some), that it can be caused by capillary worms. I don't know if that is correct or not, but I have not experienced problems with capillary worms in my flock and I haven't wormed them in the past 3 years, so I suspect the "CAN" part of that statement might be a bit like saying you can get run over crossing the road.....ie It's a low risk possibility.

As I suggested in my first post on this thread, the thing to do might be to get a faecal sample analysed for worm eggs.
You have to remember that, as outdoor animals, chickens will most likely have worms so don't assume that you have to worm if you get a positive result. There is a balance with all parasites and a healthy chickens should be able to tolerate a low worm burden and it is probably normal for it to do so. However, sometimes for various reasons, the balance is upset and the parasite infestation becomes too great and the chicken starts to show signs of illness and failing to thrive. In my opinion, that is the time to worm them or if you are seeing worms regularly in their poop. I also check the intestines of cockerels that I process or any other bird that dies (I have Marek's disease in my flock), to give me an idea of the worm burden level. I have never found more than one or two so far.

As regards the "gaping" I think many people see this behaviour and assume it is gape worm because of the name. It is more commonly associated with respiratory infection or crop readjustment than gape worm in my opinion. I've certainly seen my chickens do it and again, I have not found gapeworm but I do have a chronic respiratory infection which circulates my flock every once in a while. Respiratory infections are very common in chickens, so again, this is a more likely cause. It also may be that chickens yawn too.... I know horses, dogs and cats do as well as humans and probably many other creatures, so why not chickens

I do not specifically know why chickens shed intestinal lining but I think it may be to do with their system using grit which will have an abrasive effect on their gut even though it is mostly fine particles that pass out of the gizzard and perhaps the intestine is constantly, if very slowly regenerated as a result of this abrasion and the old remnants shed. This is just a guess based on what I know of their digestive system.... I'll be interested to read Kathy's response to that question because I'm pretty confident that if she doesn't already know, she will find the correct answer for us.

I think the problem with vets is that they usually have little or no experience of chickens. As a business. it doesn't really pay to turn patients/customers away. The honest ones will say that they don't treat chickens and that might be quite frustrating as a chicken owner with a sick bird but it is far more annoying to find a vet that will treat chickens, pay them good money and later find that they actually don't know much and you could have got better advice here for free. The beauty of this site is that we can all share our collective experience to help each other and improve our own knowledge. I am indebted to all the people whose posts I have read in order to gain the knowledge I have and hopefully that will continue for many years to come.

Best wishes

Barbara

In my flock intestinal lining is not normal, so when I see it I deworm and/or treat for coccidiosis.

Here are poop piles from one hen In this picture you can see intestinal lining:


In this picture the roundworm:


So while many websites and and posts say it's normal, I think when you are seeing excess amounts it probably is not normal.

-Kathy

OK -Thanks Kathy and Barbara -I will now start learning about coccidiosis. Can I just ask, does Panacur clear coccidiosis, or would I need to use something else? I am going to keep a close eye on my hens poop for the next week anyway and on their general behaviour as I will be at home most of the time. One thing that has definitely become clear to me as a novice keeper of poultry - they certainly don't just 'look after themselves'...and I suppose why on earth should anyone expect that they would considering all our other domestic animals need careful monitoring and intervention if we expect them to stay alive and healthy! It's just a matter of knowing what can crop up (pardon the pun), being able to recognise it and know what to do when you see it I suppose. I definitely plan to keep letting my hens free range one way or the other, even if it does expose them to more parasites etc. because I really have no doubt that they are happiest that way.

 

[Kay Kew]

Also meant to ask - what is crop readjustment? I did a quick check to see if there was a thread on that but didn't see one.

 

[Fancychooklady]

​Also meant to ask - what is crop readjustment?  I did a quick check to see if there was a thread on that but didn't see one. 

Birds routinely adjust the crop during and after feeding if they have swallowed something a little on the larger size. Coccocidiosis requires treatment with either an amprolium based product such as Corid or an Albion based product , such as Sulfadimethoxine( Di-methox ) .
Amprolium is a thiamine analog and blocks the thiamine getting to the Eimeria species (cocci protozoan) which in turn prevents essential carbohydrates to be synthesised and starving them .
Kathy has all the dosage information on her profile.
One thing to remember is that the birds can become thiamine deficient during treatment , so it's best to administer a good poultry multi vitamin in the weeks after treatment has ceased.
Yes there is a lot more to keeping chickens, or any other livestock for the matter, but the benefits and rewards far out weigh the pitfalls. Enjoy your birds

 

[Kay Kew]

Birds routinely adjust the crop during and after feeding if they have swallowed something a little on the larger size. Coccocidiosis requires treatment with either an amprolium based product such as Corid or an Albion based product , such as Sulfadimethoxine( Di-methox ) .
Amprolium is a thiamine analog and blocks the thiamine getting to the Eimeria species (cocci protozoan) which in turn prevents essential carbohydrates to be synthesised and starving them .
Kathy has all the dosage information on her profile.
One thing to remember is that the birds can become thiamine deficient during treatment , so it's best to administer a good poultry multi vitamin in the weeks after treatment has ceased.
Yes there is a lot more to keeping chickens, or any other livestock for the matter, but the benefits and rewards far out weigh the pitfalls. Enjoy your birds

Lots of interesting information there - thank you.

 

[chicken4prez]

The chicken that had worms died yesterday afternoon in her sleep. Thanks for your help, everyone