Two Hens - lethargic, green poo, labored breathing

[nhc920]

Hey folks, we've got two hens (both 8 months old, Light Brahma and Buff Rock) that have suddenly fallen ill and I could really use some outside help.

Quick info...They both are very lethargic, breathing heavy, eyes closed, with green watery poo. Symptoms set in 2 days apart. Both had/have mites, first hen showed symptoms before I began treatment, second hen showed signs after treatment. First hen's crop feels "inflated", second hen's crop is normal. First hen acts as if she wants to eat but it hurts to bend over, so I hand feed/water her. Both are inside now.

Long backstory I posted here back in September, our flock has a confirmed case of Marek's - between Aug - Oct, 3 confirmed Marek's deaths & 3 unconfirmed. On 11/26, our smallest "runt" pullet declined rapidly over just half a day and died. As I was taking care of her, I noticed she had a bad case of mites. Really surprised me, as I've scrubbed down & sanitized the coops a dozen times the last 4 months, kept dry dust baths, the feed and treats all laced with garlic, even given her little group special attention because I'd housed an older hen recovering from wry neck with them. (Older hen has recovered 90% thanks to a month of indoor rehab & continued vit. E+B, as I had read on here!)

Immediately cleaned out the coops again, then a second time over with Martin's Pen & Poultry Spray/Prozap Garden & Poultry Dust. Sprayed the chickens at night on the roost, as I'd found mites on a few as well.

The same day the young pullet died, I noticed a tired look in an 8 month old hen. Found that her poop was green & runny, and she had slept in the nesting box recently. (Again, surprised, as I've done body counts at night while closing them up.) Figured it could be the mites, so I paid close attention to her. Read up that deworming was acceptable when treating for mites, so I weighed and dosed her with Safeguard cream. She was sluggish and had dried poop on her, so I brought her in for a soak and kept her inside. Another mite spray after the soak. Gave her vit. E/B combo in plain yogurt/applesauce/tuna among normal feeding. The next day, her breathing became labored. 2nd day, brought in the second hen for the same treatment. Added nutridrench to their water as of last night.

They eat Nutrena All Flock feed, grit and oyster shell supplements to the side, access to fresh water. Treats are a mixture of unsweetened applesauce, plain yogurt, eggs, warm oatmeal, fresh berries/greens, occasionally unsalted nuts and mealworms. They free range 2-6 hrs a day. 2 months ago started giving them Purina Scratch Grains, then tried Flock Party 7 Grain, but about 2 weeks ago my dad offered to swing by and get some, so they've recently had Producer's Pride Scratch Grain.

Feels like I typed out too much info, lol. I'm just at a loss for what this could be. They're both only getting worse. I'd be grateful for any input!

 

[nhc920]

Uploading a few pics.

The two hens (that's boiled yolk on the buff's beak)

And their green, watery poo

Spoiler

 

[Wyorp Rock]

Hey folks, we've got two hens (both 8 months old, Light Brahma and Buff Rock) that have suddenly fallen ill and I could really use some outside help.

They both are very lethargic, breathing heavy, eyes closed, with green watery poo. Symptoms set in 2 days apart. Both had/have mites, first hen showed symptoms before I began treatment, second hen showed signs after treatment. First hen's crop feels "inflated", second hen's crop is normal. First hen acts as if she wants to eat but it hurts to bend over, so I hand feed/water her. Both are inside now.

What did you treat them with for the mites - Permethrin?
Have you looked inside their beaks for signs of canker or yellow cheesy material?

Any access to moldy feed, toxins (fertilizer/weed spray, etc.)?
Think of any changes/additions you have made in the last few days no matter how small - treatment of mites, cleaning with a different product, adding new straw/bedding, closing up the windows/ventilation for winter, additions of new birds, kitchen scraps, etc.

The crop feeling inflated - does she have a foul or sour smell to her breath?

It could be Marek's related since you have been dealing with that, even though there is no cure, addressing symptoms that you see now would be the way to go.

I would get them both drinking. Make sure the mites are gone. Poultry Vitamins that contain B vitamins would be good.
Crop issues can definitely cause lethargy and sometimes difficulty breathing. I think I would start with giving them both some coconut oil. Freeze or refrigerate it, then break it up into small pieces - let them eat it on their own if they will - birds can aspirate on liquids easily. Feel each ones crop. IF there is a sour smell, then don't massage. IF the crops are doughy, then give a gentle massage. I would provide water, but not push food too much - if a crop issue is part of the problem, then adding food when things are not moving doesn't help.

 

[nhc920]

What did you treat them with for the mites - Permethrin?
Have you looked inside their beaks for signs of canker or yellow cheesy material?

Any access to moldy feed, toxins (fertilizer/weed spray, etc.)?
Think of any changes/additions you have made in the last few days no matter how small - treatment of mites, cleaning with a different product, adding new straw/bedding, closing up the windows/ventilation for winter, additions of new birds, kitchen scraps, etc.

The crop feeling inflated - does she have a foul or sour smell to her breath?

It could be Marek's related since you have been dealing with that, even though there is no cure, addressing symptoms that you see now would be the way to go.

I would get them both drinking. Make sure the mites are gone. Poultry Vitamins that contain B vitamins would be good.
Crop issues can definitely cause lethargy and sometimes difficulty breathing. I think I would start with giving them both some coconut oil. Freeze or refrigerate it, then break it up into small pieces - let them eat it on their own if they will - birds can aspirate on liquids easily. Feel each ones crop. IF there is a sour smell, then don't massage. IF the crops are doughy, then give a gentle massage. I would provide water, but not push food too much - if a crop issue is part of the problem, then adding food when things are not moving doesn't help.

Thanks for the quick reply, Wyorp Rock!

Yes, we used .50% permethrin spray on chickens and coops, .25% permethrin dust in coops. They've been given a daily 1/4th of a B Complex tablet & started nutri-drench last night. Looking at the analysis of Rooster Booster Poultry Cell vs. the B complex tablet, the direct 1cc of Poultry Cell has far more B vitamins. Looks like I'm under-dosing for sure.

As far as changes, yes, new straw added, wooden windows closed at night, a change in scratch feed. (7 grain scratch to predominantly corn & shelled sunflower seed scratch.) These two hadn't had any tuna in a month, but they each had some once inside. They both had the green poo before the tuna, and before I felt the unusual crop, but that's the only other "different" food.

I haven't noticed the sour/foul smell from either of them, but I'll continue checking. The first hen's crop has "deflated" but the second hen's crop feels doughy now. I haven't checked inside their beaks for cankers etc but I will now, and try the hard coconut oil out. Thank you again!

 

[nhc920]

An update, checked inside their beaks for anything unusual and saw nothing. Still no breath odor, and I started giving them oil, as suggested. For mites - can see them dead on their body, but both still have some around the heads. Lightly treated them again last night. They've got the same green poo.

The first hen has zero interest in eating or drinking from me, but I've seen her drink when she doesn't think I'm nearby lol. The second hen will drink and eat (applesauce to coat the oil). First hen's crop is soft but not protruding at all, and the second's feels exactly the same - doughy, inflated. I haven't weighed them again yet but the Light Brahma(1st) feels lighter than the Buff Rock(2nd) at this point. Definitely concerned, they had about a pound difference.

No other chickens have their initial behavior or unusual droppings. These two are 2 of 4 that stay glued to their rooster while free ranging, so I've kept an eye on them. As for plants, they could've gotten into wisteria, spirea or a lone gardenia - not much else is green now.

Can't figure out what's going on, this has got me totally stumped.

 

[Wyorp Rock]

Hopefully you can get rid of them mites, those will drag a bird down.
Have you ever wormed your chickens?

 

[nhc920]

Hopefully you can get rid of them mites, those will drag a bird down.
Have you ever wormed your chickens?

The second spray of Martin's Pen & Poultry luckily got rid of any remaining mites, and yep, dewormed their flock before this round of illness.

Unfortunately the second hen, a Buff Rock named May, died Friday(12/6) afternoon. I'd been checking up on them and she had a sort of seizure, loss of balance and her wings spread out, and when I righted her back up, her wings remained drooping. Held on to her and she was gone in about a minute.

She'd shown no signs of paralysis before the seizure, and the sudden drooping wings looked exactly like every other case of Marek's paralysis we've dealt with. She was (very gingerly) eating, drinking, walking around just a few hours before she died, just like our sick pullet who died last week. I'll be taking her in for a necropsy at the state poultry center Monday(12/9). And unless something drastically changes, I think it's best to euthanize the first hen.

I'll update with any info I get, especially if it's verified as Marek's. 1 week with 3 hens from 2 different flocks, near identical symptoms, and just the sequence of symptoms in all were unexpected & new to me.

 

[alexisrambles]

Oh dear. Good luck to you and your flock. I hope your Light Brahma makes it, but if it's Marek's, good luck to you.

 

[Wyorp Rock]

The second spray of Martin's Pen & Poultry luckily got rid of any remaining mites, and yep, dewormed their flock before this round of illness.

Unfortunately the second hen, a Buff Rock named May, died Friday(12/6) afternoon. I'd been checking up on them and she had a sort of seizure, loss of balance and her wings spread out, and when I righted her back up, her wings remained drooping. Held on to her and she was gone in about a minute.

She'd shown no signs of paralysis before the seizure, and the sudden drooping wings looked exactly like every other case of Marek's paralysis we've dealt with. She was (very gingerly) eating, drinking, walking around just a few hours before she died, just like our sick pullet who died last week. I'll be taking her in for a necropsy at the state poultry center Monday(12/9). And unless something drastically changes, I think it's best to euthanize the first hen.

I'll update with any info I get, especially if it's verified as Marek's. 1 week with 3 hens from 2 different flocks, near identical symptoms, and just the sequence of symptoms in all were unexpected & new to me.

I'm sorry for your loss

I'm glad the follow up treatment got rid of the bugs.
Sadly, I tend to agree, the last symptoms does sound like Marek's. Since you have dealt with it before, you probably recognize the signs.
Please keep us posted on the results you get.

 

[nhc920]

Thanks alexisrambles and Wyorp Rock, I appreciate the kindness!

The preliminary results from our Buff Rock came in and they wrote "the abdomen was filled with ascitic fluid and a large number of tumors (apparent estrogen-induced adenosarcomas.)" I knew about Marek's related tumors and had considered that maybe a mass could cause the labored breathing and steps but had hoped it was something curable like sour crop.

I haven't euthanized the first hen, the Light Brahma, because the following day she ate and drank much better, chatted a few times, stretched out in a sun spot, and her poop was still watery but brown. Today it's back to the bad signs, so I'm torn again. (The hen that I helped recover from wry neck had horrible days where she was backflipping, spinning, choking on water, etc.)

Regret not getting a necropsy for the first pullet who died 11/26, with the same symptoms. Honestly it's wild to imagine something so varying like Marek's could develop identically in 3 birds, in 2 weeks.