Undersized Chicks at 18 Weeks

[Eddie33]

I would definitely get the Nutri Drench as suggested above. It is loaded with vitamins that typically assists with issues like the one you currently have. I would also check the date code on any bag of feed you purchase. I have seen several at my local Tractor Supply that were over a year old from date of mill.

 

[thepick4uchicks]

I’m raising my second batch of babies. They’ve been on starter grower...free choice for 18 weeks. I’ve been using Bartlett’s. My chics are nowhere big enough to integrate with the four adults I have left from my first group that I got in 2016. I’ve also supplemented with grass, Swiss chard, earthworms when I find them. There are six chicks in a protected coop yard and I put them up every night because I have concerns that they are still small enough to be a black snake’s meal if one were to get through the chicken wire.
My neighbor has a batch a few weeks (at most) older than mine and hers are as big as full grown. You only know they’re pullets by the absence of wattle and much comb.
She got hers at the local farm store; I had mine shipped from McMurrey Hatchery in Iowa. I gave them electrolytes and probiotics.
Some of mine—the Red Stars—even have a little fuzz still on their heads. I got some leftover starter grower from my neighbor and gave them some as soon as I got home. They seem to like it but they like the Bartlett’s too. What in the world could be wrong? Help!

Okay so now we know that the food the Bartletts was old. Right? Well do you have any records of any kind that show when you bought the chicks or feed to prove the dates of either and like the hatchery and store so that you could also prove that they actually sold you out of date fees at no fault of yours when you did by it back when you did 18 weeks ago? I know that that question was a very long run on sentence/question but I had to word it that way to get it out. No other way around it. Sorry. If you just had receipts to show the hatchery ship date and a receipt on the feed maybe you could get your money back on something at least. I hate that you have tiny chicks at 18 weeks that you have worked so hard with who really should be getting very close to POL very soon - say in about another month or so at least and yet they are really just babies themselves and you cannot even consider them laying themselves. I really do feel sorry and bad for the time and work you have put into them at this time and yet you are not getting a return from them right now and also you have a worry so much about them and they are so small and delicate at this age in their lives. I sure do hope they are able to get bigger and more developed for their ages and have no difficulties or health problems at all. I wish you the very best with them and hope they reach POL at a safe time for them which is healthy and right for their bodies. Good luck!

 

[TARDIS37379]

I would integrate them and see what happens.

 

[ChickenCanoe]

I have two RI Reds and two Barred Rocks.
The starter grower is 20% protein. There isn’t a date on the bag. I may have cut that end off. But I got the 50-lb. bag in April. My feed store lady—who I trust—said it was new for this season. They haven’t quite finished the whole bag, but I give them as much as they want to eat.
I called McMurrey and they’re baffled as well and asked me to send pictures too, which I have. They double checked the order and said they did NOT accidentally ship bantams.
Thanks.

I’m going to give the new feed and see how they do before I go for anything else. I did just look on that bag for a milling date and didn’t see any date but there is a lot and batch number.

Mystery solved, I think... turns out the feed WAS old. I was told it was new but somehow when it was loaded, I got a bag from last year. I’m mostly mad at myself for not double-checking. So now the question is, has there been irreparable harm to the chick’s development?
I have a email in to McMurrayand I hope to hear from them today too.

I just spoke with McMurray and the woman I spoke with said she thought they’d be ok. Hard to believe but I’ll hope for the best. What else can I do, really?

All feed has a mill date on it somewhere. It could be on the guaranteed analysis tag or on the seal strip at one end of the bag or the other.
Sometimes it is in Julian date form or further concealed in some kind of code.

I'm sorry you are going through this and even the most diligent among us can make a mistake or be hoodwinked. I've been doing this all my life and still (albeit rarely) nearly buy something out of date. I too have discovered feed on store shelves that was a year and even two years old. I did force a store to take back a 60# bag of poultry nutri-balanacer that was over two years old. They weren't happy about it and tried to blame the manufacturer but research on both ends showed the feed store had kept it - unsold - for over two years because the manufacturer changed their computer system two years earlier and the new system had no record of this feed store buying any of their product.
The feed store nearest me does not remove old product and leaves it in stock for the unsuspecting. I always ask for the mill date before they even bring it out of the feed shed.
Now when they see me walk in they say, "you don't want to buy it". How unethical!
I shouldn't shop there at all but it is the closest to my house and the only thing I ever buy there is pine shavings. Even their straw is old. The inside of the bales just crumble.
Then I was happy to discover that a hardware store near me carries chicken products, including feed. It turns out their feed is over a year old also.
I must drive to another state (over an hour round trip) to get fresh feed.
I once bought a sack of barley from the aforementioned unethical feed store. I told them it was not for seeding a field but for growing fodder for feeding. They assured me that it was feed grade when they loaded it in my truck. I got it home and the tag listed all sorts of fungicides and insecticides the seed was treated with. They took it back. They don't normally stock barley and said someone ordered it who was making beer. For some reason they couldn't explain, he wouldn't buy it - duh!. I wonder why.

Even if your feed bag was milled this year, buying it in April means it is now old feed and should be discarded. Being from last year, one can't even call it feed. The statement that it was "new for this season" scares me and is a red flag. Feed is not seasonal. It is perishable and should be thought of as a loaf of bread, milk or other perishable food item.
The amino acids and vitamins are most degradable, especially the fat soluble vitamins. The fats added to feed can become rancid.
Whole grains can retain much of their nutritional value for months but once the hull is cracked, nutrients diminish quickly. Feed is mostly ground grains.
They've been eating old ground grains and most of the supplements added to make a complete feed have pretty much disappeared.

One problem as I see it, there is a mill date on feed but no expiration, sell by, best by or similar date. That isn't something required by the FDA as the regulatory agency for animal feed. Let the buyer beware.
I think your beef is with your feed store, not Murry McMurray, not the feed manufacturer. It is the feed store that unscrupulously sells old product to the unsuspecting loyal customers.
Well over 90% of feed store employees are in a category that should never be sought out for advice on anything related to chickens or other livestock. They know nothing of that subject matter.

As for how to proceed, I'm sorry to say that your birds are stunted and likely will never attain their full potential. At over 18 weeks they should be nearly finished growing.
The genetics of all animals including humans dictate that without adequate protein and other nutrients, they will be stunted. They won't reboot their youth at this age. Children that have been malnourished their entire childhood and then given plenty of good food after the age of 15 will grow but the damage is baked in.
I'm not even sure that providing a fresh feed will help a lot. They will be healthier and grow but even their immune systems have been compromised.
You need something more therapeutically supportive to kick start them.
In addition to dosing nutri-drench according to label directions, I would give the freshest starter feed you can find but also add some animal protein several times a week. I recommend some canned mackerel. Forget the cat food or dog food. Most contain too little animal protein and too many other things in it not targeted for feeding chickens. They need fish and meat. Even steak, chicken or turkey will do them wonders.

 

[thepick4uchicks]

All feed has a mill date on it somewhere. It could be on the guaranteed analysis tag or on the seal strip at one end of the bag or the other.

I'm sorry you are going through this and even the most diligent among us can make a mistake or be hoodwinked. I've been doing this all my life and still (albeit rarely) nearly buy something out of date. I too have discovered feed on store shelves that was a year and even two years old. I did force a store to take back a 60# bag of poultry nutri-balanacer that was over two years old. They weren't happy about it and tried to blame the manufacturer but research on both ends showed the feed store had kept it - unsold - for over two years.
The feed store nearest me does not remove old product and leaves it in stock for the unsuspecting. I always ask for the mill date before they even bring it out of the feed shed.
Now when they see me walk in they say, "you don't want to buy it". How unethical!
I shouldn't shop there at all but it is the closest to my house and the only thing I ever buy there is pine shavings. Even their straw is old. The inside of the bales just crumble.
Then I was happy to discover that a hardware store near me carries chicken products, including feed. It turns out their feed is over a year old also.
I must drive to another state (over an hour round trip) to get fresh feed.
I once bought a sack of barley from the aforementioned unethical feed store. I told them it was not for seeding a field but for growing fodder for feeding. They assured me that is was feed grade when they loaded it in my truck. I got it home and the tag listed all sorts of fungicides and insecticides in the seed. They took it back.

Even if your feed bag was milled this year, buying it in April means it is now old feed and should be discarded. Being from last year, one can't even call it feed. The statement that it was "new for this season" scares me and is a red flag. Feed is not seasonal. It is perishable and should be thought of as a loaf of bread, milk or other perishable food item.
The amino acids and vitamins are most degradable, especially the fat soluble vitamins. The fats added to feed can become rancid.
One problem as I see it, there is a mill date on feed but no expiration, sell by, best by or similar date. That isn't something required by the FDA as the regulatory agency for animal feed. Let the buyer beware.
I think your beef is with your feed store, not Murry McMurray, not the feed manufacturer. It is the feed store that unscrupulously sells old product to the unsuspecting.
Well over 90% of feed store employees are in a category that should never be sought out for advice on anything related to chickens or other livestock. They know nothing.

As for how to proceed, I'm sorry to say that your birds are stunted and likely will never attain their full potential. I'm not even sure that providing a fresh feed will do the job.
You need something more therapeutically supportive to kick start them.
In addition to dosing nutri-drench according to label directions, I would give the freshest starter feed you can find but also add some animal protein several times a week. I recommend some canned mackerel. Forget the cat food or dog food. Too many other things in it. They need fish and meat. Even steak, chicken or turkey.

I would definitely get the Nutri Drench

You could order some Dr. Marty’s dog food which is the best there is. It is online only and is all raw diet and protein only. It is the freshest there is and will come freeze dried to you and you add a small amount of water to it. It has blueberries sweet potatoes flaxseed ginger and some probiotics as well as prebiotics that they can also have. Off the top of my head there is also some pea protein and some other proteins safe for chickens but no heavy grains or preservatives of any kind. The main proteins are Turkey organ meat, beef, beef organ meat, some duck organ meat and liver for sure. It is pricey but you won’t need much to go along way among your birds. It will stretch out. It’s all I feed my dogs and it is worth it. No allergies at all. It stops them and anxieties and nervousness as much. I might sound far out but this will be an easier fix and preparation source for you in this situation.

 

[Hidrainja4]

Please let us know how they are doing in a week or so. Can you shop somewhere else? My feed stores are running out and I have to come back on delivery day to get mine before they are all sold out again. Now I know why.

 

[NatJ]

My feed stores are running out and I have to come back on delivery day to get mine before they are all sold out again. Now I know why.

I suppose you're pretty sure of getting fresh feed that way!

I'm thinking the places that sell old feed get in a nasty cycle-- people do not buy it because it is old, so it sits on the shelves and gets older yet

 

[DuckYouMan]

Not to get off topic too much, but I just reared some tomaru chicks and while they are very playful and love being held, they are dumb as rocks. They would not eat feed for anything, so I started giving them eggs which did the trick to get them healthy and even being little fatties. They still would not eat the dang feed. They would peck at it and then just leave it alone.

Luckily, after they got a little bigger, I put them in with my serama and stopped giving eggs all together and they started eating it like normal. They sure gave me a heck of a scare though. I think I know why the breed is rare lol.

 

[PrimroseMom1]

When I have extra eggs from the girls or some dirty ones I don’t feel like cleaning I boil them and feed them crushed with the shells to my chickens they gobble them up and the shells. The shells are good for them and they get lots of protein and vitamins. And, no, that doesn’t make them break and eat their eggs. They have never done that

 

[SmallStep]

The girls have been on viable feed for a week. They’re growing and eating more. Still not up to size but I think/hope they’ll get there in another few weeks. That old food probably didn’t taste very good either!