US Crele and White Sport Legbar Breeders - Alternative Legbar Group, for those not breeding to the P

[KendyF]

The purpose of this thread is for anyone interested breeding, raising, buying or selling the Crele (Gold) crested, blue egg laying Legbar and the solid White Sport. Some have proposed the name 'crele' for the more colorful Legbar. Crele is wild type (E-locus = e+) with barring (B/ on female and B/B on male). There is already divergence if this will work since the OEGB Crele varies from the Cream Legbar's pattern of Crele. We may use a working title of tri-colored. All poultry plumage genetics is made of black and red with white showing the absence of any pigment in the feather. So tri-color would contain the golds (showing up as golds and chestnut), and the black and the white... (gold is red - we can delve in to that or you can read the great article here written by Grant Brereton http://poultrykeeper.com/poultry-breeding/the-other-type-of-gold-red to help keep focus)

PLEASE NOTE: Three varieties of Legbar are recognized in the United Kingdom, their country of origin: Cream, Silver and Gold. In the UK, the breed already known as the Gold Legbar does not have a crest and lays white eggs. For this reason,people are trying to distinguish the gold colored Cream Legbars missing one or both copies of the cream gene, from the lighter, correctly colored UK type of Cream Legbar by using the descriptor - CRELE Legbar. It may be more desirable to use this term.

This thread is not for debating whether or not such a color should be bred, it is being bred, and some would like to see it legitimized. As another group works on putting together a potential draft SOP, I would like to see and hear about those who are breeding the colored birds what you are getting what you are aiming for etc. It is also worth noting, this would be a color variation vs. a breed, so the type of the birds is not up for question the proposed SOP for the Crested Cream Legbars would not change. This is a color discussion.

Let's start with some pictues of your Crele or White Sport birds.

Keep it respectful please.

 

[KendyF]

When I got my first "Cream Legbars" they were the colorful variety with much gold coloring in them. I fell in love with the look of the birds as well as the blue eggs, I did not fall in love with the breeds name. (Creme Legbars) So as the color debate heated up, I was very disappointed to see the move towards the lighter colored cream birds. I felt like my flock was being made "illegitimate", yet I had no interest in the creme colored birds. So, there is now a movement for a more colorful variety within the same breed just as you have Silver Laced Wyandottes, as well as other colors. Many things would have to happen prior to getting this color approved by the APA, probably including the acceptance of the Cream Legbars first. Development of the color standards for the Crele Birds, and people breeding them for several generations. So let's begin where we are.... Let's discuss the colors of our birds...

 

[KendyF]

Pictured above my current Rooster - He was bred by Michael Baker.

My first Rooster, who was colored slightly differently.


Legbar chicks, in a new color variation, we will not want to loose the auto sexing traits.


Notice the Hackles and the Saddle are a different color. There is discussion regarding how the APA doesn't have many if any approved colors with the saddle and hackles being differently colored. I personally like the colors.

Okay Folks that is the conversation starter.. Let's see where it goes.

 

[flyingmonkeypoop]

I get in many discussions on color of legbars. I have always prefered the colored legbars over the cream and currently have no cream birds in my flock. I may keep a cream or two but my main focus has always been on the non-cream. For color/pattern wise, I feel that they should be inbetween OEG crele and cream legbar. The black and red isn't as distinct and bold like traditional old English games but the hackle/saddle/wingbars are more colored than cream. If we ever get to an agreement on pushing these for acceptance, finding a way to mesh the terms right is important. I would say the pattern terms could be used from the cream birds but mainly the sexfeather regions would be used and tweaked from OEG crele. Something else that just came to mind which I will look into more is terminology differences in clubs. APA has crele OEG in bantam and large; I am sure they have same wording for both but I wonder if the ABA differs any

 

[kjbizy1]

The draw for me to this breed was crest and egg color foremost. After learning more about the color genetics and seeing the Gold Crele colored birds, it was a no brainer for me personally. One I find the additional richness in color a preference, and two, with the creme gene being recessive, the gold is just soo much easier to breed for. I just don't find the creme as attractive, although pretty, just not colorful enough for me.

 

[flyingmonkeypoop]

I know many folks prefer the non-cream because they use the legbars as free ranging egg layers. The crele birds blend in best while the cream birds stand out to predators.

 

[KendyF]

I would love to see people post pictures of your best birds, so we can see if there is a lot of color variation between them. For me, my roosters are coming out close to the same, but my hens can look quite a bit different. I am breeding towards.. Size, Egg Size and type vs. color, but I have no interest in the Creme colored birds.

 

[sol2go]

It seems like the appearance of the roosters benefit the most from the crele or tricolor effort. Here are two examples of young cockerels (about 6 months old) from different CL breeding programs. Neither one is considered "cream", or double for cream.

While the first one is very light, he shows gold on the wing triangle and would be considered incorrect for the Cream SOP. His hackle and saddle feathers are more closely matched than most gold examples. He is actually sort of washed out all over and lacks sufficient chest barring.


The second cockerel has very saturated colors everywhere, distinctly mismatched hackle and saddle feathers, and a boldly patterned chest; not a good candidate for the Cream SOP. Never mind that he is rumpless, that is an entirely different issue =) He won't be in any of my breeding programs, but he is looking for a nice home. Now over a year old, I wish I had photos handy to show what a big boy he is. (that is his sister in the background).


Just for the record, I am breeding to the Cream SOP, but would like to keep a colorful Crele flock as well. While the Crele may have a camouflage advantage with predators as stated by FMP, they seem to catch the eye of visitors before any of the other roosters do.

 

[KendyF]

Agreed, Visitors to my backyard always notice my Crele Legbar Sunny. Not only is his coloring stunning, but his hackles nearly look "crimped" it is an optical illusion created by the barring. He is a pretty good type, with some flaws, very small crest, bad leg color... a bit more.

 

[KendyF]

The draw for me to this breed was crest and egg color foremost. After learning more about the color genetics and seeing the Gold Crele colored birds, it was a no brainer for me personally. One I find the additional richness in color a preference, and two, with the creme gene being recessive, the gold is just soo much easier to breed for. I just don't find the creme as attractive, although pretty, just not colorful enough for me.

Thank you for you comment and welcome to Backyardchickens.com - It is hard to imagine a topic which isn't being covered here somehow!