Vote - to cull or not to cull

[triciayoung]

Which isn't a factor in factory farming. If they don't have a Z chromosome, they're killed as chicks right off the bat

The analogy, which is probably not a good one - but still, it was what I was thinking...is that there are rules that make a rooster live or die.

 

[Mamalana]

I appreciate all your feedback and concern for our children.

I was hoping that perhaps since Moonlight is a teenager, that would justify his behavior and that he would essentially grow out of it. I have been planning on breeding him, however I think the White Face Spanish in him makes him more aggressive. We had his brother too, who was an Amerucauna / White Face Spanish mix that was more aggressive and the two of them would surround hens and mount them while they protested and fought them. They would also trap the children and go after them too.

We also have an American Game Cock that came with the land, who is very respectful of us and keeps a distance only focusing on his girls. Although, that breed is more aggressive due to their fighting history, the previous owners culled roosters that were aggressive (we have found evidence of past roosters in trees and among garden supplies). So, I know breed isn't everything.

Ultimately, we don't have the chickens for pets, we have them as a sustainable food source for our family. Same with our goats. ( We use a spray bottle to control the Billy's behavior while he is in rut. ) So, if there is little hope that Moonlight will grow out of this behavior before his spurs grow in, we won't hesitate to eat him. We still have many Favorelle roosters that I have been watching and one particular one that is quite the gentleman. I also don't want them to learn bad behavior from Moonlight. They already gang raped a poor hen that lost her babies because she left them in the rain.

Chickens are intense.

The big lesson here for the children is that when they chase chicks, those same chicks can grow up to be dangerous, and as much as they may love them, they will loose them.

Lastly, dogs are far more loyal that chickens. We have big dogs who would never hurt our children, even as they age. The only time a dog attacked a child was when my parents rescued a feral sled dog from the mountains. She was quite traumatized having been a work dog that was abandoned and her babies eaten by a mountain lion. I trust my children with our dogs 100%. Roosters on the other hand, not so much. Our dogs don't try to climb the social ladder and fully understand that humans are the alphas whether they are grown or a child.

 

[Mamalana]

The analogy, which is probably not a good one - but still, it was what I was thinking...is that there are rules that make a rooster live or die.

There are rules that make us humans live or die too. In certain states if you kill another person you could get the death penalty. I understand your advocating for roosters to be seen as valuable and I am really grateful for that. I agree and I am open to working with the Moonlight, however I don't want my children or community members to be afraid of him.

We don't have a place to confine him that is human and that defeats the purpose of him learning to be a grown up rooster with his little flock of hens. All our chickens free range the farm, all except Moonlight leave people alone. He comes out of caring for his girls when the children are around. He seeks them out. Not me, who feeds him, the children. I love this bird, we have a good thing going. If it was just me, I wouldn't even consider culling. Its to a point now when our dogs are beginning to go after chickens because they want to protect us. Our dogs have never gone after chickens and they have been around them their whole lives. When they see their people attacked, however, it teaches them that chickens are a threat.

I'm concerned also that Moonlight is teaching bad behaviors to the younger cockerels that are in his flock (there are 6 more roos to be). We have 36 laying hens and 6 pullets and want some roosters for them. As of now, the Gamecock is the oy one breeding (not my preference, but he is a great rooster). I want at least 2 more from my cockerels for the hens and have a couple gentleman that I have my eye on. I was really hoping Moonlight would have made the cut, but I am heavily, heavily leaning toward chick soup for dinner tonight.

 

[NatJ]

Which isn't a factor in factory farming. If they don't have a Z chromosome, they're killed as chicks right off the bat

Except that you've got the letters backward Roosters have chromosomes ZZ, hens have ZW. So they are getting culled because they do not have a W chromosome.

 

[Coops Dad]

Don't think of it as a cull- call it a "partnership". Partner him with carrots, peas, potatoes and dumplings.

Life's too short and roosters are too plentiful to mess with an aggressive one.

 

[McChooky]

I should have been more specific - my reference to factory farming was specific to that a roosters gets to live or die based on the age of the children in the household.

Its a home owners responsibility to protect all occupants of the home and to prevent injuries and lawsuits. People get sued everyday for keeping aggressive animals

 

[JacinLarkwell]

Except that you've got the letters backward Roosters have chromosomes ZZ, hens have ZW. So they are getting culled because they do not have a W chromosome.

Ah rats, you're right. I hadn't had my coffee yet when I posted. Thought it was 2 Ws for hens

 

[McChooky]

I think often people posting with questions on should they cull or not already know what they want to do but feel a little bad or unsure about doing it and just want help/justification in making the decision. Nothing wrong with that. I grew up on a farm with a lot of chickens and cattle. As a kid you learn pretty quickly to be careful and how to protect yourself cause farm animals can be dangerous. My grandpa never gave a second guess to culling a rooster that wasn't doing his job with the hens but he never gave much consideration to how the rooster acted towards people because the reason he had them was to service his hens, not as pets. He would not put up with one he couldn't put in its place though. If it attacked him it was supper. I'm not advocating that anyone let their kids learn the hard way and possibly risk injury. Looking back it's surprising to me that I made it out of childhood without any serious injuries. My point is that roosters often don't make good pets (though there can be some exceptions). I think generally it's unrealistic to expect them to go against their natures and act sweet and cuddly all the time.

I grew up around chickens that free ranged and lived near a real farm .We visited it daily and played with one of their kids when he wasn't doing chores.Sometimes we helped doing those too but they didn't really like us feeding them because they were dangerous.We got chased by bulls and bit by by geese but they had barns full of layers and sold eggs but they didn't have a single rooster on the place lol

 

[Geena]

Every animal is unpredictable. They cant talk to us, so we don't know what their triggers are.

I actually find most animals to have very predictable behavior once I've had the time to observe and understand them. They're much more predictable than us humans who can pull a 180 on you at the drop of a hat.

Animals that truly attack out of the blue are exceedingly rare. They've most often been throwing off signals for weeks, months or years that are just not being picked up on. Aggression, anxiety and fear are very easy to detect in animals if you know what to look for and how to read their body language.

I don't mind keeping a semi-aggressive rooster as long as we can figure out a decent working relationship, but I would never have one around small children, it's just not worth the risk.

 

[Mamalana]

So out of 21 people (if I am correct) we have 20 for culling and 1 for not culling.

Its sad, but perhaps not worth the risk.
I could see trying to work with him if there weren't small children around, but I can't imagine them being able to do what the article referenced for training suggested. They could hold him down or show dominance with our help, but then what about when we aren't around or if they are playing. We don't have the infrastructure at the moment to keep him confined. What a waste, he is such a beautiful bird.