what is wrong with people-----selling puppies....

[cariboujaguar]

our shelter has the same illogical ideals! They chewed me out when our intct male BC went missing, we went to all the shelters in 100 miles including calling the Canadian ones and I was dissappointed to see how polite and logical the Canadians were VS my fellow Americans. We finally found him on CL 180 miles away and I called, confirmed, looked at pics etc and we RUSHED to go get him, brought his papers, our IDs etc and they still 'hmed and hawed' as if they weren't sure we were the owners of the dog. I was so frustrated I finally leaned over the counter and said "Look lady, we've been tirelessly searching for this dog for eight days straight, we've spent hundreds in gas, long distance phone charges and advertisement trying to find him. He did not 'get loose' he was stolen right off our property by a nasty neighbor we have (hense his being picked up 2 houses down from her daughters home 180 miles south of us) we have his papers, records, pictures of him on our cell and hard copy photo album pictures, our ID's, the money, your manager has spoken to our vet what the heck else do you want from us???" and she just stared at me... GRRR

Our Great Pyr took off, was picked up right in front of our driveway (NOT saying he should have been there, but couldn't they have just read his tag and brought him to the door?) his first offense it cost us $249 to get him out. He was A) in tact B) Unlicensed and C) over 100 lbs. I couldn't beleive how the people chewed me out. I told them I had the money they wanted and if they didn't shot the heck up I would come follow them home with BOTH my pyrs. (like my dogs would do anything LOL) I complained about the cost and they said "Well I guess you'll be in more of a hurry to fix your dogs then." I laughed and said "We just used the money we'd been saving for nutering him... now we'll have to have a litter to recoup the cost of your stupid fee's, so I guess you're just shooting yourself in the foot." they didn't like that reply much at all. I hate the HS!!!

 

[Widget]

People who buy 'designer' dogs and pay more than $100 deserve what they get. I say $100 because even a mutt puppy costs money at the vet to get vaccinated and wormed before they go to new homes. Of course it isn't fair to the dogs to end up in shelters and then get euthanized because their owners are ignorant morons. But mutts aren't the only dogs that end up in shelters.
I currently have five dogs. Four purebreds. Of the five three are rescues. Two of the rescues came from the shelter. One was born in the Bahamas and is definitely a mutt. The locals call them Potcakes. Other than her desire to kill chickens she is a great dog. The other shelter dog is a Norwegian Elkhound. He is 'defective' since he is red and not the accepted grey color. He was turned in because he had too much energy for the kids in the house. He does have some issues but is a good dog most of the time.
The last three I went through breeders to get. My collie comes from a working background and has done well in the obedience ring and in herding. The breeder and I chose not to show him in conformation. We did wait to neuter him just in case she had a need for him in her breeding program. She always had a waiting list for puppies and only bred when she wanted something.
My other two are Great Pyrenees. Again they came from a breeder who stands behind her dogs. I was on a waiting list and had to wait several months to get a puppy. I could have gone through local ads to get one but wanted a quality puppy from a quality breeder. I ended up adopting the full sister to my pyr this past February. She was a show dog but became fearful in the ring for some reason. The breeder worked for a year to see if she could work the dog through it. In the end she decided it would be better for the dog if she went to a pet home. So I took her. Now I have two great dogs from a responsible breeder.
So for me I would rather have a purebred from a responsible breeder and pay a bit extra for what I want. Or another non-chicken killing Potcake since they aren't a 'designer' breed but a mutt that developed on it's own on the fringes of civilization.

 

[scbatz33]

Quote:
I would have just lied to them lol

She told me that they do "home inspections". I told her I would have told them to "go fly a kite". I have two abandoned kitties in my home(rescued and happy! And yes, they go outside.). There are plenty of animals looking for homes that you don't have to "jump through hoops" to give a loving home to without having to justify my existence to a perfect stranger to judge and deem me worthy.

Oops, that sentence is redundant in itself, but I'm not changing it cause that's how mad I get thinking about this topic. My husband says I talk in circles. I guess I do!!

 

[debilorrah]

We have 3 available Shepows!!!! LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Shepard Chow mixes. These name crack me up. Anyhow they will be free to a good home.

 

[redhen]

I really cant stand dog snots, Thats what i call them anyways...

If you breed pure bred dogs..you have NO say about others breeding mixed breeds. Because they BOTH add to the dog population problem. Yours arent so special...

sorry folks..its the truth..and ya know it.

 

[LoupGarou]

Quote:
I respectfully disagree. If you breed purebred dogs for a purpose (show, work, or performance) and you make sure that every puppy has a home before breeding your dogs, and if you breed to eradicate the diseases that are prevalent in *all* dogs, not just in purebred dogs, I'm not sure how that's being part of the dog population problem. As I stated in a previous post, the people who are determined to buy my purebred Toy Fox Terriers, who might wait year on a waiting list, are not going to give in and just get whatever shows up in a shelter.

The "dog population problem" is not what most people believe it to be and, contrary to popular opinion, shelters are sometimes forced to import *unvaccinated* puppies from other countries in order to meet the demand for small dogs (rather than, you know, sending to the "enemy" known as "breeders). Fewer than 10% of all dogs in shelters are purebred and a tiny percentage of that (perhaps 1%) of all purebred dogs in shelters come from hobby/show breeders. An amazing 70% of all pet dogs are spayed or neutered, according to the American Pet Products Manufacturers Association--the percentage of pet cats spayed or neutered is closing in on 90%.

There are few complaints of roaming packs of dogs in our cities--and do you know why? Because non-mandatory spay/neuter laws are working. The figures that certain groups with anti-pet/anti-dog agendas toss around are usually cooked and inflated. Do you honestly believe that one unspayed dog or cat is responsible for up to 144,000 descendants in 10 year, the way that the popular organization propaganda states? Let's examine that for a moment:

Let's say that we have a feral cat. The average feral cat has four kittens, on an average of 3 times/year (2 months pregnant, 2 months nursing). That's 12 kittens/year. Fewer than half of those kittens survive to have kittens of their own. And, since approximately 50% of those kittens are male, they won't be producing litters (although they might sire litters). So, figure that every cat will have six surviving offspring each year for 10 years (60 kittens). Each year, three of those kittens will also produce six kittens, but in that ten year period not all of the kittens will be producing kittens for 10 years.

Year 1: 6 kittens
Year 2: 6 kittens + (3 cats * 6 kittens) = 24 [30]
Year 3: 6 kittens + 2(3 cats * 6 kittens) = 42 [72]
Year 4: 6 kittens + 3(3 cats * 6 kittens) = 60 [132]
Year 5: 6 kittens + 4(3 cats * 6 kittens) = 78 [210]
Year 6: 6 kittens + 5(3 cats * 6 kittens) = 96 [306]
Year 7: 6 kittens + 6(3 cats * 6 kittens) = 114 [420]
Year 8: 6 kittens + 7(3 cats * 6 kittens) = 132 [552]
Year 9: 6 kittens + 8(3 cats * 6 kittens) = 150 [702]
Year 10: 6 kittens + 9(3 cats * 6 kittens) = 168 [870]

I'm pretty sure that I have my math right--but even if you have to triple that number to get it right, the total is a far cry from the 144,000 claimed by the AR people. PLUS, the fact is that the average feral cat lives only about 3 years--so you can figure out how inflated the organization figures are.

Now, let's say that the feral cat is actually a small dog that produces the same number of puppies as the cat did kittens. HOWEVER, a dog only has two seasons a year. You can figure out that the total will be less than that for the cat. Even if you figure a large dog with an average of 10 puppies/litter, the total will *still* fall far short of that claimed by the organization. In addition, the people who gather the propaganda figures lump all animals, healthy, sick, and terminal, into one group if they are euthanized. However, according to the organization, all of those animals are "adoptable," which simply isn't the case.

If they are lying about the figures that they base their agenda on, what does that say about the rest of their "facts?"

What does this all have to do with purebred vs. mixed breed? Well, nothing really. However, the average hobby/work/performance breeder with purebred dogs will breed a female dog no more than once a year, sometimes once every other year. The female dog will be bred no more than 2 or 3 times in a lifetime. Compare that with people who breed for profit and produce two litters/year each and every year from each and every female dog that they have. Compare having a waiting list with producing "whatever the market will bear" and dumping the rest on the street, on the farm, or on the shelter door step.

*If* purebred hobby/work/performance breeders are part of the problem (and certainly they are a tiny part of it), I think that there's a big difference in what they do and what the people who breed for a profit or what the average feral dog or cat does.

All I ask is that you think about it the next time your state legislature proposes anti-pet/anti-dog/anti-breeder legislation.

 

[RachelFromTheBlackLagoon]

Shelters import dogs from other countries? For about 25 different reasons, I can't imagine there is any truth to that...





Edited because I can't spell.

 

[LoupGarou]

Quote:
Here are just a few links to sources. If you Google "import animals shelters" without the quotation marks, you can find plenty of information about the problem. Some states have actually passed laws to prevent animal imports from other countries except for personal or professional use because the problem is so severe. The biggest problem associated with this kind of process, except for the inflation of shelter numbers, comes from the lack of biosecurity.

http://www.naiatrust.org/resources/foreign_strays.htm

http://www.naiaonline.org/articles/archives/humane_insane.htm


http://caveat.blogware.com/blog/_archives/2008/4/27/3662442.html


http://ravenwyn.com/2009/03/oregon-shelters-import-animals/


http://www.cfainc.org/articles/legislative/responsible-breeders.html


http://www.wmassimc.org/massachuset...-rescues-importing-dogs-so-they-can-stay-open


http://www.spanieljournal.com/33lbaughan.html

 

[okiron]

Quote:
How? A responsible breeder will take back their dogs so the dogs will never end up in a shelter. They will speuter the dog and either keep the dog or rehome the dog themselves. How is that adding to the problem?

 

[RachelFromTheBlackLagoon]

Did you mean other COUNTIES? I didn't look at all the links but I don't see how it would be possible to import thousands of dogs from country to country without vaccination papers, quarantines, etc.

My shelter has pulled a lot of dogs from high kill shelters, both in and outside of CT. But it's preposterous to say that shelters do this to "stay open" or profit, as those articles state. It's not to fill a demand, either! We do it to find forever homes for animals that are slated for death! We've saved so many pregnant dogs, entire litters of pups, tons of purebreds, and lots of mutts, too. If you knew the blood, sweat and tears involved in those rescues, you wouldn't refer to them that way. Two of my own dogs came from these situations. One from Georgia and one from Arkansas. Hands down, best dogs ever! Also, a lot of times when puppy mills are shut down, there are too many dogs for a particular organization to handle. They'll send out a notice to shelters in surrounding areas and those who have room to help will take 5 or 20 dogs. It's not like we all send out lists of orders that need to be filled, "I need 4 beagles, 7 chihuahuas and 1 labrador." But if there are dogs in need who won't be given a chance to find forever homes, heck yeah we'll help if we have the room! All the shelter and rescue people I know that do this do it for the same reasons. We want to see these animals in great homes instead of in a gas chamber. There's no sneaky dog trafficking operations going on. You're very right about the biosecurity issues, though. We rarely do these rescues anymore, if at all, because we ended up with a couple litters of pups with parvo, giardia,and a few other things. One of those articles states that there is no pet overpopulation problem in America! That's crazy talk!! Hartford, CT pound euthanizes their dogs after 10 days. If a dog is picked up roaming in CT, the owner has 7 days to claim it. That leaves Hartford's dogs 3 days to be adopted if they are not claimed by an owner. They euthanize several dogs every week and there is never a day they are not full. These dogs are just roamers, abandons, cruelty cases... Could you imagine if they took surrenders?I just used Hartford as an example but there are a ton of towns that operate the same way. CT is a small state. I can only imagine how many animals are euthanized in large states. Is there an insane pet overpopulation problem in the US? Absolutely. But I don't think it has much, if anything, to do with the legitimate, responsible breeders that you're referring to. It has everything to do with puppy mills, BYBs and irresponsible owners.