When you ride...

[welsummerchicks]

The ring is too small to canter in? Maybe that's why the horse is fresh, if he doesn't get a good canter now and again. And if I read right there are trails to ride on? Trails could be a good place to canter. Is there a riding arena or a level area near the barn that could be used as an area to work the horse?

I don't think if someone has a problem with their horse one time, that it means they don't have a partnership or aren't working as a team overall. Horses change from day to day and one day are too frisky to be obedient and the next day are fine. They are like people, they have moods and sometimes are just difficult.

 

[theoldchick]

When ever I get around my horses I'm teaching them something. All horse owners are keenly aware of this. I'm so old and stiff, I make my horses stand still while mounting, wait for my cue to go walk gait, canter. Walk carefully down the ravine. Walk up the ravine. Cross all water thoughtfully and gently. Pause after a giant spook in place to allow me to settle in place, gather my wits, and tell them what to do.

On the other hand, some days my horses have a job to do. They move cattle, drag logs, help me repair fences. If we have a discussion about a certain chore I go back to the basics and make sure the horse understand what I expect. I don't get angry if he/she makes a mistakes, I simply break up the lesson in smaller steps until we have success. I always make sure the horse is physically capable of doing the job I'm asking him to do. I don't expect a 29 year old horse to move cattle all day or do I expect a three year old to work all day. These things take time. And all superb horse owners know to take the time it takes for each individual horse.

Bigshot, my QH rescue, learns things quickly but is on the lazy side and sometimes needs a firm hand. On the other end of the spectrum is Dink, my KMSH. Bred for the show ring, Dink never expected to live on a farm. He's a spook-o-matic, loves dressage, hates the trails, but likes to have a job. His active mind hates trail work. Too boring for him. He thinks of things to do. So, while he never needs a firm hand, he does have to be busy. Although too small to move cattle, he can get the job done. I know his limitations and work him with the calves. He's purty good at herding rabbits which we do for fun because he forgets to spook at one when he knows he's supposed to chase it! He's too nervous to drag logs but will drag dead cows if needed. I'm working on his fear of being eaten by dead plants following him. He's coming along, and he trusts me not to let the horse-eating log get him, but this particular chore will take a long time for him. He tries but his self-preservation is deeply rooted and I respect his nature.

Since I no longer show, I don't drill my horses. I expect them to do the basics, respect me, and keep me safe. In return I respect them for who they are, what they can do, and do my best to keep them safe and healthy. And that is my nature.

 

[jettgirl24]

I always have a goal when I ride unless we're getting out of the arena. On my way to the barn I usually think about a plan and about how I want to accomplish it. For example last time I headed out to the barn I wanted to work on collection in the canter, half passes in all three gaits, and improving his left to right flying changes. Sometimes the ride goes as planned, sometimes you have to make small changes, other days you end up scrapping the plan altogether and refocusing on another area that needs the work that day. Lately my horse has really gotten a block when it comes to his flying changes from left to right so I expected to spend quite a bit of time working on that last time I was out. When we got to that he ended up giving me two or three great honest tries so I left it at that. He tends to get upset and worried when he doesn't do things correctly so it was more beneficial to our long term goals to praise him for his efforts and move on. We ended up spending the bulk of our time working on half passes and other lateral work where we made some very nice progress. I think the key is flexibility and being able to differentiate when your horse just needs to work on something else that day and when he's just misbehaving to test you. When they're testing you the challenge is to find a method of pushing them through it without getting into a fight. The more exercises you have in your back pocket the better, which is where a great trainer comes in... Nothing has helped me progress as a rider better than having a skilled trainer. She has given me the tools to be successful no matter what my horse throws at me and the knowledge to know when to try another method, when to push for more and when to switch gears completely.

 

[michickenwrangler]

Quote:
Mounted police units and Nationa Forest Parks service employees use geldings exclusively. Most ranches use all or mostly geldings.

 

[welsummerchicks]

I know various groups say they prefer geldings, I'm not saying they don't.

But I've also learned that every group has their 'belief'. For example in Arabia traditionally mares were regarded as a far, far superior war horse, braver, tougher, more reliable under fire. No self respecting man would ride a stalllion or gelding. In some of the Spanish speaking countries few would ride anything OTHER than a stallion. In other words, groups believe different things depending on tradition. I think it's all about attitude, and becomes a self fulfilling prophecy because the animals are managed and treated based on people's beliefs.

In the sport horse world, there is a very different attitude, and stallions and mares work side by side. Less of that 'mares are weak and can't perform because they are female' philosophy.

Having a great many female professional riders, I'm sure is not a small part of the 'mares can do it too' attitude. So while I do recognize that some groups prefer geldings or complain about stallions and mares, I think it's that way due to tradition and habit, not some fixed actual biological trait.

How a person keeps a mare or stallion makes a big difference in how they behave. If a stallion is kept cooped up and not punished for acting like an idiot when he's young, he's going to act pretty bad around other horses. If a mare spends most of her life in a broodmare herd of course she's not used to being around geldings and stallions and will act stupid. Too, often large mare bands don't get much handling, as one breeder told me, he just did not have time to train each and every mare. They were baby machines, that's it. If you treat animals that way that's how they behave.

So I wouldn't pretend that any group doesn't have their prejudices and their traditions. But I do feel that how animals act has a lot to do with how they are selected, handled and culled (or not culled!) out of the breeding herd.

So I feel it's more about attitudes and tradition than about what a mare, gelding or stallion is. It's also about culling - I know breeders who have stood at stud, stallions that had very severe problems, and stallions that have problems beget mares (and geldings!) who have problems. And others who insist their stallions have to have good temperament, if they don't, they are gelded and not allowed to pass on those genes.

 

[patandchickens]

Quote:
I spent the first half of my life boarding my horses. Pastures were usually 25-50 acres with 15-20 head. That is where I rode. With the loose horses. It's actually good for you both.

It is good for you both *right up to* the point where one of the loose horses kicks at your horse and breaks your leg; or tries to play-mount your horse and knocks you out of the saddle (not as rare as you might think); or such.

So it really REALLY depends on a) the experience of the rider, and b) the particular horses involved. I think if a person is not comfortable doing it, they shouldn't.

I do totally understand where RoPo is coming from -- sometimes it is so hard to find a boarding facility with adequate care (especially if a budget is involved) that you HAVE to compromise on things like trail access. It is definitely, definitely not ideal (especially if it is trails, specifically, you're going without -- I am a big 'train on the trail' type person) but sometimes life is just like that for a year or two. During that time there are at least OTHER things you can do, like work more on groundwork skills and trail-obstacle/bombproofing type skills. And eventually life WILL change and you can find a better place to board, where care is adequate but so are facilities

Pat

 

[Rusty Hills Farm]

It is good for you both *right up to* the point where one of the loose horses kicks at your horse and breaks your leg; or tries to play-mount your horse and knocks you out of the saddle (not as rare as you might think); or such.

Okay, I grant you that legitimate concerns can be very different for a woman than for a man. You do have different (though certainly not less valid!) concerns than we do. My personal experiences have always been that the pastured horses tend to graze the pasture as a herd, so when they were in the north end, I was in the south end, etc. Perhaps because I rode those pastures regularly, the horses in those pastures--all either well-broke riding horses or broodmares--never seem to pay us any mind. No, I would not be doing that in a pasture of yearlings! but otherwise, I have never had problems sharing pastures. (LOLOL Foals even tend to follow along--like maybe they are taking notes or something!) Of course, most of my companions were QHs with an occasional paint or appy--working breeds, not dressage horses or hunters, and maybe that made some difference. I don't have any experience with the European breeds either--are they very different in temperament? QHs tend to be fairly genial.

But I DO agree with your last point: If you are not comfortable doing a thing then absolutely do NOT do it! This is just a solution that works nicely for me that I thought might be helpful. It is really HARD to find facilities that do have enough actual usable SPACE to give a horse the exercise he needs. Unless you are raising a pasture ornament, ANY horse needs enough rideable land available so that he can get out there and MOVE. And for that you need more than 3-4 acres!

Rusty​

 

[welsummerchicks]

I agree a person should not feel pressured to do things they're scared of. I was at one barn where the manager/owner was constantly getting into people's business and telling them how to ride. For example a gal complained that his staff was literally tearing around the parking lot in the farm vehicles and that it was spooking her horse every time she rode by the arena door.

He proceeded to tell her that's where she should work her horse, right in front of that door while the bulldozer screamed past causing gravel to hit the metal building. 'No', she said, 'it is not your job to tell me how to ride or train my horse until I pay you to train me, and I am not about to do that - it's YOUR job to manage the barn and your staff, and not look overly negligent when someone takes you to court after your bulldozer runs into their horse'. BINGO! He didn't make his staff slow down, but she was in the right.

I wouldn't recommend riding in a field with pastured horses at most boarding barns. On a private farm the horses are all used to each other and are in more of a set routine, and it might be different. Too, holdings at boarding barns are typically minscule (there is no 'north and south end' on a half acre pen) and over stocked with animals, and there is plenty of fighting and kicking going on all the time. The standard joke we always used when we saw a horse with bare spots and all covered with teeth and kick marks was, 'Board much?' LOL. One place I worked at turned out about 21 horses in a 70X160 foot pen with two hay feeders. There was a ton of fighting, and it carried over even when they were turned out in the larger fields.

Besides, most boarding barns have rules that people aren't allowed to do a great many things - that's usually one of them. Management always tries to distance themselves from anything a court might point to as 'negligent'.

Part of the problem is people of different riding styles winding up at 'the wrong kind of barn'. A tiny little indoor is often typical of certain groups of Western riders - a dressage, hunter or jumper rider would say it's too small. At many saddle seat barns they still work the horse up and down the barn aisle - and horses in a tail set and built up shoes don't get turned out. Anothe type of rider lands in that sort of barn and he's not going to be happy. What suits one person and his horse will definitely not suit another.

When a person boards their horse they really are pretty much at the mercy of the managers and what ever the facility has (or doesn't have). I've boared at places where they was 1. No turnout 2. No indoor (or it was a tiny little dark hole full of ruts) 3. No outdoor areas to ride in at all - no fields, no arena, etc.

Around here, you have to pay about 800 dollars a month or more to get a place with reliable care, grass paddocks for turnout(or dirt if your horse can't eat fresh grass), a good size, well maintained indoor arena, and any sort of place to ride outside. Everyone else is making do!

I boarded at one place where the ceiling was so low I had to pull horse's head down to get him in the barn ('low ceilings are good, they keep horses quiet!') where there were holes in the outdoor arena that would give way suddenly (a horse fell to his knees while WALKING when part of the arena gave way under his feet!) and an indoor arena where you could go over a jog, it was so slippery, and NO ONE could ride in it for 2 days after they watered it! One place was even 'all of the above'!

 

[patandchickens]

Quote:
Sorry, I don't think it has anything much to do with male/female -- in fact the person I know who got a ruined knee and permanent limp outta being kicked by loose horses when riding in a paddock was a man.

most of my companions were QHs with an occasional paint or appy--working breeds, not dressage horses or hunters, and maybe that made some difference. I don't have any experience with the European breeds either--are they very different in temperament?

Aforementioned guy got whomped by a grumpy QH mare, while riding a stock-breed type horse. Not sure breed makes a lot of difference.

My personal experiences have always been that the pastured horses tend to graze the pasture as a herd, so when they were in the north end, I was in the south end, etc. Perhaps because I rode those pastures regularly, the horses in those pastures--all either well-broke riding horses or broodmares--never seem to pay us any mind.

I think THAT is the big thing. YOu are doing it regularly, with (I gather) horses you know and whose reactions you can predict, in areas large enough that everybody is likely to mostly ignore each other.

In contrast, somewhere without enough land for a full-sized ring or trails, and with only two or so horses per "pasture", sounds like it has only small paddocks, and probably fairly grazed-down. That's pretty different than being in huge fields. (Although the two people I've known who were riding horses while a loose horse tried to mount the horse they were riding, that was in huge fields. Only one of those two involved a mare in season, either)

I've ridden a fair amount in with loose horses, and only once had a potentially-problem interaction in a large field (and even that, really it was only a couple acres probably - not like *large* as in a hundred acres or more). Whereas although nothing definitively bad has ever happened to me personally in a smaller area, like an acre or less, with loose horses, I am much much less fond of it and have had many mroe times when the loose horses want to come kibbitz/poke/play/assault. Don't care for that, and it doesn't make for a real constructive ride. And I've seen more than enough people injured or just 'real scared' under those circumstances.

Again, it is totally different if it is random boarding-barn horses versus your OWN horses.

JME,

Pat​

 

[Rusty Hills Farm]

Too, holdings at boarding barns are typically minscule (there is no 'north and south end' on a half acre pen) and over stocked with animals, and there is plenty of fighting and kicking going on all the time. The standard joke we always used when we saw a horse with bare spots and all covered with teeth and kick marks was, 'Board much?' LOL. One place I worked at turned out about 21 horses in a 70X160 foot pen with two hay feeders. There was a ton of fighting, and it carried over even when they were turned out in the larger fields.....
I boarded at one place where the ceiling was so low I had to pull horse's head down to get him in the barn ('low ceilings are good, they keep horses quiet!') where there were holes in the outdoor arena that would give way suddenly (a horse fell to his knees while WALKING when part of the arena gave way under his feet!) and an indoor arena where you could go over a jog, it was so slippery, and NO ONE could ride in it for 2 days after they watered it! One place was even 'all of the above'!

Good grief! Do you folks live up North or something?!? You actually PAY somebody to torture your horses like that!?! My experiences are all in the Southern tier of the country. I have boarded in California, Texas, Louisiana, and Florida. The smallest place was in Louisiana--so we rode up on the levee. But other than that place, I have always managed to find farms--REAL ones--that had a few hundred acres or so! I had NO idea people were trying to keep horses in facilities of the sorts you describe. I personally would give up my horses before I'd torture them the way you are describing here! That is NO way to keep a horse. It is--IMHO--no different than forcing a big, active breed of dog to live in a walk-up studio apartment in some huge city. It's inhumane. True horsemen do NOT keep an animal this way, not even temporarily. You ALWAYS do what is best for the horse. And the conditions you describe are certainly not what is best for the horse.

Now I will shut up and butt out because I clearly do NOT belong in this discussion.

Respectfully,


Rusty

(I came back and added this quote for clarity so folks could understand what I was responding to!)​