Winter Feed Cost and Growing Fodder

[U_Stormcrow]

I found that the articles say that growing fodder is economical.

They lied.

No, really, THEY LIED.

Not only is fodder imbalanced - you can no more nutritiously feed your birds mass quantities of corn than you can wheetgrass/catgrass, actual cereal wheat, oats, barley, sorghum, etc than you can bags of scratch, boss, etc, - that's why a carefully selected mix of ingredients fill the commercial feed. And you can't begin to make it economical unless you have lots of land, the equipment to till it, and buy your seedstock in bulk. Even then, do you honestly think you can compete at the scale of the commercial farms supplying the commercial mills providing the commercial feeds?

Sprouting trays, etc are great for enrichment (activities), and when carefully sellected, minor dietary adjustments (I like growing fenugreek, for instance, because of its relatively high methionine percentages for a green growing thing), but at the volume of feed a moderate flock of birds eats daily, its likely beyond the available space and time commitments of the typical backyard grower.

Best to treat it as treats, not more than 10% of the daily diet, by weight.

Even then, the math doesn't work. I can make a 20% protein feed for my birds (by mixing commercial bags) for around $0.28/lb right now. If I want to save labor, I can buy 18% protein at about $0.276/lb right now. With, lets pretend, 60 birds (my flock is in the sig, below), feeding 15# per day on average, to replace 3 months of feed at 10% substitution would be 1.5# per day times 92+/- days. About 150# of feed. Or $45.

Once you've bought the trays, built the frames, obtained your seed (economically, Amazon Prime, 50# bags), obtained soil, done the labor, raised the greens (and keep in mind, they are full of water, not near so nutrient dense as a commercial feed AND prone to freeze damage), are you really under $45 invested?

I feed, actually, between between 10# and 13# per day to my flock, seasonally dependent. How??? I've invested a few $Hundred$ into building a biodiverse polyculture of plants coming into season at differeng times of year which are a mix of forbs, legumes, herbs, grasses, grains, and even fruits. "My Acres of Weeds". and I happen to be in one of the most forgiving growing zones in the US. What works for me likely won't work well for you.

/edit and, fwiw, I'm likely throwing another $100 or so worth of seed into the pasture this spring, in hopes of adding still more diversity. How I'm going to keep my birds from eating it before it sprouts is a complete mystery to me. Likely trying "Cereal" Rye (not rye grass, seasonal or perennial), Buckwheat, and Sorghum (I have a small amount of native sorghum already growing, but its being edged out by other plants). If it saves me 6% on my feed costs over the course of the year, I break even. If the birds eat all the seeds, or we have another weird rainfall month, and nothing sprouts, then it cost me the equivalnt of almost 300# of feed, essentially a months worth.

 

[Sally PB]

I like growing fenugreek, for instance, because of its relatively high methionine percentages for a green growing thing

Thank you for reminding me about the fenugreek seeds I bought last summer! I'm going to start a fodder tray of them this weekend.

For me, growing fodder for my chickens is 90% a boredom buster/enrichment/treat thing. They get greens (scarce this time of year), and they get to "play with their food," by tearing it apart, and then running around like they have the ball and are taking it to the house.

I get to have something green growing inside, and then get to watch their hilarity.

 

[PioneerChicks]

Remember guys, there are a lot of different chicken keeping opinions. We can still get along though!


I ferment feed. In the winter I keep it inside the garage or house. I feed it to them once or twice a day (depending on the weather) and they eat most of it at mealtimes, before it freezes. Then they snack on what's left before the next meal time.

I grow fodder for them, just a container every week or so. I green it in the sun (in a window in winter, not a lot ton of sun but it's something) to so that it has extra vitamins. Fresh greens in winter are really good for them!

I've started growing mealworms. They are easy and take almost no space. But it takes a while to build a sizable colony up.

I have a bag of Wild Garden Seed's "chicken lettuce/critter mix" that I plan to try soon. Basically, it's a lettuce seed mix that you can grow in a small space for animals. Haven't tested it yet but I have high hopes!

But the number #1 thing that cuts down on feed costs for me is SCRAPS! Kitchens scraps. Old leftovers and stuff. (Garden scraps in summer) You'd be amazed how well this works! Just make sure to check what foods to avoid in the Chicken Treats Chart article on BYC. I can't pull up the exact link right now, but it's called something like that.

 

[saysfaa]

The solution to having no eggs in New York in January, assuming you have hens, is to wait for the days to get long enough for the breeds/ages/individuals you have. It doesn't have much to do with feed unless, maybe, your feed is really unbalanced.

It is far more likely to be really unbalanced if you feed a lot of high water content feeds like fodder. Or high fat, high fiber content like BOSS.

I don't think it will save money, either. The least expensive place I know of to get whole grain seeds suitable for feeding horses or other animals or for planting fields is the local feed co op. A year ago, I bought unhulled oats suitable for feeding horses or planting in a field (so should be suitable for sprouting and fodder, too). The hulls are about half the weight of the oats. The oats cost $6 for 25 pounds vs the $11 for 25 pounds of chick feed or layer feed I paid three days ago at the same place. So, the chicken feed costs less per pound than oat groats even if prices haven't gone up since last year. Wheat is more expensive than oats.

Even assuming the fodder has at least similar nutrition than chicken feed. It doesn't.

I think fresh green food has some things other food doesn't (phytochemical type things), so it is beneficial to feed some of it regularly. But that it is not beneficial enough to feed at the expense of a good balance of the macronutrients or the trace nutrients.

Back to the problem of no eggs. You might consider the amount of light in your coop - especially early in the morning or late in the day. If all the windows are on the west side, it may take a little longer for days to be long enough than it would if you have windows on both the east and west sides.

 

[TOPChickens14]

They lied.

No, really, THEY LIED.

Not only is fodder imbalanced - you can no more nutritiously feed your birds mass quantities of corn than you can wheetgrass/catgrass, actual cereal wheat, oats, barley, sorghum, etc than you can bags of scratch, boss, etc, - that's why a carefully selected mix of ingredients fill the commercial feed. And you can't begin to make it economical unless you have lots of land, the equipment to till it, and buy your seedstock in bulk. Even then, do you honestly think you can compete at the scale of the commercial farms supplying the commercial mills providing the commercial feeds?

Sprouting trays, etc are great for enrichment (activities), and when carefully sellected, minor dietary adjustments (I like growing fenugreek, for instance, because of its relatively high methionine percentages for a green growing thing), but at the volume of feed a moderate flock of birds eats daily, its likely beyond the available space and time commitments of the typical backyard grower.

Best to treat it as treats, not more than 10% of the daily diet, by weight.

Even then, the math doesn't work. I can make a 20% protein feed for my birds (by mixing commercial bags) for around $0.28/lb right now. If I want to save labor, I can buy 18% protein at about $0.276/lb right now. With, lets pretend, 60 birds (my flock is in the sig, below), feeding 15# per day on average, to replace 3 months of feed at 10% substitution would be 1.5# per day times 92+/- days. About 150# of feed. Or $45.

Once you've bought the trays, built the frames, obtained your seed (economically, Amazon Prime, 50# bags), obtained soil, done the labor, raised the greens (and keep in mind, they are full of water, not near so nutrient dense as a commercial feed AND prone to freeze damage), are you really under $45 invested?

I feed, actually, between between 10# and 13# per day to my flock, seasonally dependent. How??? I've invested a few $Hundred$ into building a biodiverse polyculture of plants coming into season at differeng times of year which are a mix of forbs, legumes, herbs, grasses, grains, and even fruits. "My Acres of Weeds". and I happen to be in one of the most forgiving growing zones in the US. What works for me likely won't work well for you.

/edit and, fwiw, I'm likely throwing another $100 or so worth of seed into the pasture this spring, in hopes of adding still more diversity. How I'm going to keep my birds from eating it before it sprouts is a complete mystery to me. Likely trying "Cereal" Rye (not rye grass, seasonal or perennial), Buckwheat, and Sorghum (I have a small amount of native sorghum already growing, but its being edged out by other plants). If it saves me 6% on my feed costs over the course of the year, I break even. If the birds eat all the seeds, or we have another weird rainfall month, and nothing sprouts, then it cost me the equivalnt of almost 300# of feed, essentially a months worth.

I don't think I did a good enough job of explaining my situation. I want to grow fodder as a treat and to give my chickens some fresh food because it is winter. I'm not planning to use it as a substitute for their pellet feed.

 

[TOPChickens14]

Remember guys, there are a lot of different chicken keeping opinions. We can still get along though!


I ferment feed. In the winter I keep it inside the garage or house. I feed it to them once or twice a day (depending on the weather) and they eat most of it at mealtimes, before it freezes. Then they snack on what's left before the next meal time.

I grow fodder for them, just a container every week or so. I green it in the sun (in a window in winter, not a lot ton of sun but it's something) to so that it has extra vitamins. Fresh greens in winter are really good for them!

I've started growing mealworms. They are easy and take almost no space. But it takes a while to build a sizable colony up.

I have a bag of Wild Garden Seed's "chicken lettuce/critter mix" that I plan to try soon. Basically, it's a lettuce seed mix that you can grow in a small space for animals. Haven't tested it yet but I have high hopes!

But the number #1 thing that cuts down on feed costs for me is SCRAPS! Kitchens scraps. Old leftovers and stuff. (Garden scraps in summer) You'd be amazed how well this works! Just make sure to check what foods to avoid in the Chicken Treats Chart article on BYC. I can't pull up the exact link right now, but it's called something like that.

I give my chickens all of the appropriate kitchen scraps and it really does help save feed.

 

[TOPChickens14]

The solution to having no eggs in New York in January, assuming you have hens, is to wait for the days to get long enough for the breeds/ages/individuals you have. It doesn't have much to do with feed unless, maybe, your feed is really unbalanced.

It is far more likely to be really unbalanced if you feed a lot of high water content feeds like fodder. Or high fat, high fiber content like BOSS.

I don't think it will save money, either. The least expensive place I know of to get whole grain seeds suitable for feeding horses or other animals or for planting fields is the local feed co op. A year ago, I bought unhulled oats suitable for feeding horses or planting in a field (so should be suitable for sprouting and fodder, too). The hulls are about half the weight of the oats. The oats cost $6 for 25 pounds vs the $11 for 25 pounds of chick feed or layer feed I paid three days ago at the same place. So, the chicken feed costs less per pound than oat groats even if prices haven't gone up since last year. Wheat is more expensive than oats.

Even assuming the fodder has at least similar nutrition than chicken feed. It doesn't.

I think fresh green food has some things other food doesn't (phytochemical type things), so it is beneficial to feed some of it regularly. But that it is not beneficial enough to feed at the expense of a good balance of the macronutrients or the trace nutrients.

Back to the problem of no eggs. You might consider the amount of light in your coop - especially early in the morning or late in the day. If all the windows are on the west side, it may take a little longer for days to be long enough than it would if you have windows on both the east and west sides.

I hadn't learned the trick of using a light to increase the egg-laying until last week. From what I had read, you're supposed to increase the light by an hour each week until you have sixteen hours a day. So that's why they haven't laid much yet. Before the winter they were laying a ton of eggs and I was selling them. But now in the winter, they are barely laying eggs so I don't have enough to sell and they are going through more food. When I was selling their eggs, the money I was making went to buying their food.

 

[U_Stormcrow]

I don't think I did a good enough job of explaining my situation. I want to grow fodder as a treat and to give my chickens some fresh food because it is winter. I'm not planning to use it as a substitute for their pellet feed.

Oh, then by all means, do it!!! I focused on your mention of cost. As long as you understand that it's treats/entertainment, sprouted grains can be grown in disposable aluminum trays for food service, supported by a stronger base, like a commercial sheet pan. Doesn't take much soil, and can be done inside, then moved out to your birds.

In low quantities, look to Anthony's- buy their bulk non-GMO cooking ingredients for sprouting. Not because they are non-GMO, but because I've had good experience sprouting them. You might also try sprouting mung beans. Relatively cheap, available at the grocery, can be done in nothing but water. Makes bean sprouts in a out 4-5 days.

 

[TOPChickens14]

Thanks for understanding. Is Anthony's a website or a store? If it's a website could you give me a link?

 

[U_Stormcrow]

Anthony's is a brand, like Bob's Red Mill. You may find it at high end or specialty groceries. I'm "remote", so I get it from Amazon.

Anthony's (obviously, some of these products aren't suited to planting, great cooking ingredients though.) Sorry, I'm on my cell phone, this may be better link.