You Can Sex a Chicken Egg?

[Fred's Hens]

In reference to "all the big commercial hatcheries would be using that method" please see the patent link above. Your argument comes up over and over again.

That people have pulled a patent for machinery that can intelligently and mechanically determine round vs pointed, is the express nature of the patent. The granting of the patent does nothing to grant validity to the underlying supposition or hypothesis that the shape is important at all. The patent is merely for an idea and equipment and intellectual property of the system. That is all.

There is nothing in the patent request itself that provides a stitch of evidence as to the validity of the "shape cues sex" supposition. There have been millions of patents pulled for ideas and products that never had any practical application, let alone commercial success.

As an aside, the MotherEarth article provides nothing but one person's undocumented, unsubstantiated opinion as well.
I'm still waiting to see one link to a poultry science study which lends credence to "shapes cues sex". Surely, there must be one, two or a three such journal articles published somewhere which lends support to this idea.

 

[bestpractice]

Just a very quick search lead me to a couple of articles. Here is a study I found.
http://www.mendeley.com/research/ge...-chicken-eggs-infrared-spectroscopic-imaging/

I don't think they would have researched to such a degree for determining the sex of a chicken in the egg if the shape would have ever been an indicator.

Here is another scientific approach, but you have to pay for the information
http://journals.cambridge.org/action/displayAbstract?fromPage=online&aid=2176640

Interesting topic.

Thank you for sharing this. Excellent information. Chickens (world food supplies) are big business and there is a "wealth" of scientific information. This is a very interesting topic and your information is very good.

 

[Fred's Hens]

Just a very quick search lead me to a couple of articles. Here is a study I found.
http://www.mendeley.com/research/ge...-chicken-eggs-infrared-spectroscopic-imaging/

I don't think they would have researched to such a degree for determining the sex of a chicken in the egg if the shape would have ever been an indicator.

Here is another scientific approach, but you have to pay for the information
http://journals.cambridge.org/action/displayAbstract?fromPage=online&aid=2176640

Interesting topic.

I provided the same link and applied the same logic in a concurrent thread discussing this matter. Why is the industry researching attempts to sort the eggs using highly sophisticated equipment? What are they doing spending millions to pierce and extract amniotic fluid or use laser read outs to determine the sex of a fertile egg?

 

[bestpractice]

That people have pulled a patent for machinery that can intelligently and mechanically determine round vs pointed, is the express nature of the patent. The granting of the patent does nothing to grant validity to the underlying supposition or hypothesis that the shape is important at all. The patent is merely for an idea and equipment and intellectual property of the system. That is all.

There is nothing in the patent request itself that provides a stitch of evidence as to the validity of the "shape cues sex" supposition. There have been millions of patents pulled for ideas and products that never had any practical application, let alone commercial success.

As an aside, the MotherEarth article provides nothing but one person's undocumented, unsubstantiated opinion as well.
I'm still waiting to see one link to a poultry science study which lends credence to "shapes cues sex". Surely, there must be one, two or a three such journal articles published somewhere which lends support to this idea.

True, that's why I referenced the article as a "case study" and didn't reference the dozens of other case studies I came across. Also true that "surely must be... journal articles". However, I respectfully disagree with your opinion in general, but I appreciate that you took the time to share it.

 

[yinepu]

i tried this when the subject was brought up once before.. out of 31 eggs it worked 100%..

now having said that, do I believe it would work all the time?.. nope.. not unless it could be repeated by hundreds of people over hundreds or thousands of hatches (and each hatch consisting of hundreds of eggs to give the widest amount of data possible) ..
For the record.. I think mine was a fluke, pure coincidence or whatever you wish to call it... but it was fun none the less

For those who insist that all hens always lay the same shaped egg every single time... well.. maybe theirs do.. but mine don't

I have some hens separated into their own enclosures from the main flock.. so there is no mistaking who laid which egg.. their eggs vary in shape over the course of a week... some are pointed.. some are round and some are oval.. maybe my birds are just weird ... but I have been taking note of egg shape ever since I saw the first discussion on this subject

 

[bestpractice]

The proof of your concept is in the results.

Show, don't tell.

I only have to posit the question and provide reasonable assumptions for scientific inquiry. The information that results from the inquiry provides the proof.

 

[Fred's Hens]

Hope everyone has a very nice day. See you 'round the forum.

 

[bestpractice]

i tried this when the subject was brought up once before.. out of 31 eggs it worked 100%..

now having said that, do I believe it would work all the time?.. nope.. not unless it could be repeated by hundreds of people over hundreds or thousands of hatches (and each hatch consisting of hundreds of eggs to give the widest amount of data possible) ..
For the record.. I think mine was a fluke, pure coincidence or whatever you wish to call it... but it was fun none the less

For those who insist that all hens always lay the same shaped egg every single time... well.. maybe theirs do.. but mine don't

I have some hens separated into their own enclosures from the main flock.. so there is no mistaking who laid which egg.. their eggs vary in shape over the course of a week... some are pointed.. some are round and some are oval.. maybe my birds are just weird ... but I have been taking note of egg shape ever since I saw the first discussion on this subject

That a number of case studies provide similar results as yours warrants some discussion. I agree, not all hens will produce eggs that can be sexed. However, not all hens carry genes that make it possible to feather sex, or a variety of other characteristics. The biggest reason I'm thanking God for genetic diversity is the horrible things we do to produce meat chickens -- that is ugly -- a freak of nature we have capitalized on. Can you imagine what the hens laying those meat birds go through? A different discussion for a different day...

 

[bestpractice]

Hope everyone has a very nice day. See you 'round the forum.

Bye, thanks for sharing.

 

[yinepu]

That a number of case studies have provide similar results warrants some attention. I agree, not all hens will produce eggs that can be sexed. However, not all hens carry genes that make it possible to feather sex, or a variety of other characteristics. The biggest reason I'm thanking God for genetic diversity is the horrible things we do to produce meat chickens -- that is ugly -- a freak of nature we have capitalized on. Can you imagine what the hens laying those meat birds go through? A different discussion for a different day...

I do have to admit that when I was sexing those chicks I was laughing when they sexed true to egg shape.. but I am a die hard disbeliever until I know something can be repeated over and over.. just cause it worked for me the one time I tried it doesn't make it a world wide fact.. just that it worked for me that one time that I tried it.. which is why I made a point of stating it would take much more data to make me a believer

do I think it's possible?.. sure.. darn near anything is possible under the correct circumstances.. but I don't have the time, money, or room to hatch out the hundreds of thousands of eggs it would take to make it a fact
do I think it's probable?.. no clue.. I'll leave that for greater minds than my own.. lol
However I am always open to new ideas... so it will be interesting to see if science ever proves or disproves it

being genetic is also an interesting point (which we brought up in the other thread).. it's quite possible that it worked for me simply because my birds have the genes for it... and it's also quite possible that it was only a fluke as I tend to believe
I will keep an eye on any future eggs I hatch out.. and make a point to only set pointed eggs when we want DP meat birds... it would be great if I could hatch out all cockerels... but if not then the pullets are also tasty.. we just prefer the boys since ours tend to fill out a bit better than our girls do. lol