10 Cornish X eggs in the incubator!

[duluthralphie]

I have to ask why does everyone say you do not get a true CX from breeding a CX to another CX?

If the parents to both parents were say a White Rock and a Jersey Giant the chicks would be half white rock and half Jersey Giant. When you breed them to each other the chicks resulting would still be half White rock and half Jersey giant.


I have no idea what the real CX is made up of, but whatever it is should carry through to the chick. It is not like you are looking for a specific gene like color or feathered feet. It is the total package of genes in the original chickens that when crossed (hybred) makes the CX's. Cx's...

Again to re-explain my position, If you have a bourbon turkey and you cross it with a Slate you get a half slate half Bourbon, If you cross this turkey with another of the same 50/50 mix you get a offspring that is again 50/50.

 

[Luvmybob]

Quote:
My thoughts exactly... I just think some people are a wee more picky than I am. I mean when you go to the florida keys the chickens down there are protected and are EVERYWHERE, parking lots, on cars, in the schools yard, they are not to be harmed, those are "true" free wild chickens...but the breed? Who knows, who CARES?! I just want a little more meat on my bird, that is my ultimate goal here. I wanna feed my family. Hope I didn't upset anyone, Dana My thoughts... Cornish X x Cornish X= Cornish X..... Cornish X x RIR= CornishX x RIR... I never was very good at math...chicken math

 

[CrazyTalk]

Quote:

You can't think of a bird as half something, because that's not how genetics work.

Lets say we're talking two birds, with one trait, we'll say 'C' for big chested, 'c' for the natural type. Each bird has two copies of any given gene, and we'll assume they're heterozygous for the traits, IE:

Parent A - CC
Parent B - cc

They breed, and all their offspring (the cross) will be Cc.

But if you take two of the Cc offspring bird and breed them, what you get is this:

1 CC
1 cC
1 Cc
1 cc

Cornish Cross are complicated hybrids - their parentage is arranged back a couple of generations - there are specific traits that are only present in 1 grandparent - it's very highly controlled to get a specific genetic makeup. Think of the example above being done across dozens of selected traits at a time - where in some cases the CC is fatal, or leads to deformity, etc.


Basically, you breed two Cornish Cross together, you might get something very much like a Cornish Cross, you might get something like one of the parents. you might get something somewhere in between.

There's basically a closely guarded recipe to produce these birds that leads to a confluence of many traits (some of which have to be heterozygous (Xx) in order for the birds to survive), that leads to huge size, rapid growth, and large thighs and breasts. Breeding two Cornish Cross together isn't going to get you that same confluence of traits.

 

[CrazyTalk]

As a follow up - the offspring of two cornish cross will probably get you some very good meat birds - they'll probably grow a little slower than Cornish X, not get quite as big, and not convert food to meat quite as well - they probably also won't be as prone to eating themselves to death, etc.

 

[duluthralphie]

Crazytalk, I respectfully disagree with you.

A chicken has 39 haploid chromosomes, As the name implies that is 78 pairs. Meaning each parent contributes 39 chromosomes to the newly hatched chicken.

IMHO to think of it as one gene contributes to breast size and one to thigh thickness or whatever is over simplification. We all know numerous genes are attached to the DNA in each Chromosome. Now If you take a bird that has one half of its haploids from a mother who is CX and you take the other half from the father who is CX you end up with a bird that is a CX.

Now if you are talking about losing some of the hybred vigor with subsequent generations, I may buy that if there is a study showing that. Otherwise I will stand by my original hypothesis that a CX breeding to a CX gives me a CX.

I surely am not going to take the genes of CX cross them with a CX and get a silkie or a chipmunk? The genes have to come from somewhere, in the case of a CX cross to a CX the genes come from the grandparents ( Whatever the hatchery used to make the CX in the first place.


I would really like to read a study on this and not anecdotal folklore.

Thanks Much

 

[LindaB220]

Quote:

You've got it in one. Everybody has a little different take on the perspective. I'd like to raise the breast size by crossing a heritage White Rock cockerel and a CX pullet. Will it work? Why not? A little more meat than a full white rock and it's sustainable. If it's not as good as you wanted then go back to raising CX's. IMO

 

[duluthralphie]

You've got it in one. Everybody has a little different take on the perspective. I'd like to raise the breast size by crossing a heritage White Rock cockerel and a CX pullet. Will it work? Why not? I little more meat than a full white rock and it's sustainable. If it's not as good as you wanted then go back to raising CX's. IMO

I agree, As much as we like our CX's I would really have a little less white meat and more dark meat. We are not huge breast eaters here, however we do keep the wings, thighs and legs and give our kids the breasts.

I wish I could make a chicken with no breast, or small breasts and huge wings, legs and thighs....Hmmmm

 

[LindaB220]

I agree, As much as we like our CX's I would really have a little less white meat and more dark meat. We are not huge breast eaters here, however we do keep the wings, thighs and legs and give our kids the breasts.

I wish I could make a chicken with no breast, or small breasts and huge wings, legs and thighs....Hmmmm

Marans so I hear.

 

[duluthralphie]

Marans so I hear.

Interesting, I may need to find some..

I did more research on the hybred CX...

In reality a CX is not a hybrid/hybred ( When I was in school it was spelled hybred, somewhere along the line it changed and I did not,,,)

To be a hybred it would have to be a cross between a chicken and a goose or cow or pig. Whatever the parentage of a CX it is two chickens. Now the chickens were of different breeds, but not species. The CX is an amazing bird, it is bred to grow fast and have huge breasts with a good feed conversion rate.

I wonder if it is possible a "myth" as been spread upon us that crossing to CX's will not yield in another CX chick. After all If I was a hatchery that spent 10-15 years developing a chicken that grows as fast and as well as a CX does, I surely would not want people to think they could simply hatch an egg from the mating of two of these and get baby CX's...

Just a thought.


Now I saw no articles on chickens per se, I found studies on dogs, wolves and corn which were applicable.

 

[LindaB220]

Interesting, I may need to find some..

I did more research on the hybred CX...

In reality a CX is not a hybrid/hybred ( When I was in school it was spelled hybred, somewhere along the line it changed and I did not,,,)

To be a hybred it would have to be a cross between a chicken and a goose or cow or pig. Whatever the parentage of a CX it is two chickens. Now the chickens were of different breeds, but not species. The CX is an amazing bird, it is bred to grow fast and have huge breasts with a good feed conversion rate.

I wonder if it is possible a "myth" as been spread upon us that crossing to CX's will not yield in another CX chick. After all If I was a hatchery that spent 10-15 years developing a chicken that grows as fast and as well as a CX does, I surely would not want people to think they could simply hatch an egg from the mating of two of these and get baby CX's...

Just a thought.


Now I saw no articles on chickens per se, I found studies on dogs, wolves and corn which were applicable.

Yes, definitely a mixture of some kind. Traits of the parents or grandparents will come out. Longer legs, less breast meat, etc. But that doesn't mean that they won't be a good meat chicken.