2 YR Black Orp mostly eating worms - hardly drinking - 6 days - now sour crop

[turdus]

Hi there!

I noticed my girl wasn't hitting the scratch one day with the rest of the hens. I didn't think much of it at first but by the 3rd day I knew something was wrong. I separated her shortly thereafter so I could watch closely. I don't think it is contagious as no other hen seems sick. She was with them while "off" a good 5 days probably. Since isolating her she has gone from green watery diarrhea to more solid white and black sticky poop which I assume is bc she refuses to eat much more than garden worms. She has picked at grits soaked in buttermilk and her regular food made into a mash - but not much. I have used an herbal wormer and some herbal vitamins. I have treated her water with a probiotic and did do some force watering but I hardly got any in her. She seemed to be improving then went downhill. I added a mirror in her space and she came around again for a couple days. This morning she ate a ton of worms and I thought she was on the mend. Now tonight she has sour crop. My guess is that she either has an overload of bad bacteria from drinking out of puddles in the goat enclosure where all the chickens range OR she has something stuck further down in her system past her crop. Is that even possible? Has anyone had a hen with similar symptoms. Any ideas?

Thanks!

 

[Wyorp Rock]

Hi there!

I noticed my girl wasn't hitting the scratch one day with the rest of the hens. I didn't think much of it at first but by the 3rd day I knew something was wrong. I separated her shortly thereafter so I could watch closely. I don't think it is contagious as no other hen seems sick. She was with them while "off" a good 5 days probably. Since isolating her she has gone from green watery diarrhea to more solid white and black sticky poop which I assume is bc she refuses to eat much more than garden worms. She has picked at grits soaked in buttermilk and her regular food made into a mash - but not much. I have used an herbal wormer and some herbal vitamins. I have treated her water with a probiotic and did do some force watering but I hardly got any in her. She seemed to be improving then went downhill. I added a mirror in her space and she came around again for a couple days. This morning she ate a ton of worms and I thought she was on the mend. Now tonight she has sour crop. My guess is that she either has an overload of bad bacteria from drinking out of puddles in the goat enclosure where all the chickens range OR she has something stuck further down in her system past her crop. Is that even possible? Has anyone had a hen with similar symptoms. Any ideas?

Thanks!

Hi and Welcome To BCY

Does her breath smell sour?
Is her crop emptying overnight or staying hard, soft , squishy, etc.?
How old is she - if she is old enough to lay eggs, when was the last time she laid an egg - was it normal?
Any bloat, swelling, or feeling of fluid in the abdomen?

Crop issues usually are a symptom of an underlying condition. Worms, Cocci and internal laying/reproductive orders are a few that come to mind.

If you have a vet that can perform a fecal float test on a poop sample that would be good - have them test for worms, cocci and bacteria. Otherwise, treating for both would be the next step to take IMHO, since she has been eating earthworms (a carrier of internal parasites) and the source of water is questionable.

She needs plenty of water, a source of grit and only feed her wet poultry feed. You can give her a small amount of chopped hard boiled egg with yogurt if you like - but make the wet poultry feed the main course. This is AFTER she has been properly hydrated.

Antifungal medication may need to be used to help combat the fungus in her sour crop. A vet can prescribe something like Nystatin. Others recommend using OTC anti-fungal like Clotrimazole which is found in yeast infection medication (Monistat). You need to do some reading/research to make your decision on what treatment is right for you.

I understand that you may want to treat naturally and with alternative methods. That's great and I'm all for it. To be honest, if your hen has an overload of worms, then you will need to treat with a "commercial" de-wormer.

For de-worming you can use Valbazen 1/2 ml orally and then repeated in 10 days for each chicken or Fenbendazole (Safeguard, Panacur) at 1/4 ml per pound for 5 days in a row.

Cocci is treated with Corid - this is a Cocciodistat- not an antibiotic. This can be found at your local feed store. It is considered a mild and safe medication to use.

Corid dosage for Cocci is 1 1/2 teaspoons Corid powder per gallon or 2 teaspoons of 9.6% Corid liquid per gallon.
Give for 5-7 days - make sure this is the ONLY water available during that time period. Mix a fresh batch at least once a day.
AFTER you finish treatment with Corid (5-7days) give her a good poultry vitamin like Poultry Nutri-Drench and Poultry Cell.

Just my thoughts.
Keep us posted on her progress.

Worms in chickens - includes information about natural deworming:
http://www.the-chicken-chick.com/2015/11/control-treatment-of-worms-in-chickens.html

Overview of worms:
http://www.merckvetmanual.com/poultry/helminthiasis/overview-of-helminthiasis-in-poultry

Treatment of crop issues - well worth reading the entire article:
https://www.backyardchickens.com/a/impacted-slow-and-sour-crops-prevention-and-treatments

Another take on treating crop issues - note even though Tilly's Nest is an advocate of treating most things with natural/alternative methods, she still recommends to the use of anti-fungal (prescription) medication to treat.
http://www.tillysnest.com/2012/01/crop-issues-html/

 

[turdus]

Hi - thank you for replying!

First to answer you questions:

-2 years old
-breath sour last night fine this AM
-don't think she has laid in a while - she is 1 of 11 we adopted from my husband's
manager who was shutting down back in October so unfort I do not know her habits very well yet - I did glove up and check for egg but nothing
-her crop seems soft and normal I don't feel anything strange in her abdomen but this is my first sick chicken so.....

Every now and then I find an egg in a weird place in the coop that the girls have chowed. It always seems to be when I get out there later than usual to let them out for the day. It made me wonder if they were trying to tell me something!

I gave her a strong GI soothing herbal last night and she moved her crop contents - no more sour! But, she dropped a huge watery diarrhea which I have not seen in days. She was at least solid but hopefully this one was just due to the brief crop backup.

I filled in the big puddles in the goat yard. I have a watering station out there with fresh water but I guess puddles are just so enticing.... argh!

After watching some YouTube videos of sick chickens she is very spirited by comparison - fights me hard on anything I put in/on her beak to eat or drink. It is hard for me to hold her for food and water in her beak with syringe. She is perching and the stinker has jumped over the barrier I have set up in our guest room and left me some presents here and there. I made her a diaper and she has hung out with me in the kitchen and with my girls in their playroom. Very curious and alert still.

I am going to hit her harder with some N.O.M.S. and herbal cocci treatment today and if she does not turn a corner and start eating better and drinking I will try the big guns. I have Fenbendazole for my goats and can grab Corid in town. Thanks for the dosages - so wonderful of you to provide that - helps so much!

Should I not let her eat worms right now? Do you think it would be safe to let her be with the flock for a few hours today or is that too risky since I don't know exactly what is going on with her? I just thought it might help and give her the opportunity to self medicate. I noticed her eating fir needles yesterday. Still no signs in any other chickens of illness.

There are 2 vets in the area that see chickens. I plan to take her in for sure if she can't shake this soon.

Thanks again!
Robin

 

[Wyorp Rock]

Hi - thank you for replying!

First to answer you questions:

-2 years old
-breath sour last night fine this AM
-don't think she has laid in a while - she is 1 of 11 we adopted from my husband's
manager who was shutting down back in October so unfort I do not know her habits very well yet - I did glove up and check for egg but nothing
-her crop seems soft and normal I don't feel anything strange in her abdomen but this is my first sick chicken so.....

Every now and then I find an egg in a weird place in the coop that the girls have chowed. It always seems to be when I get out there later than usual to let them out for the day. It made me wonder if they were trying to tell me something!

I gave her a strong GI soothing herbal last night and she moved her crop contents - no more sour! But, she dropped a huge watery diarrhea which I have not seen in days. She was at least solid but hopefully this one was just due to the brief crop backup.

I filled in the big puddles in the goat yard. I have a watering station out there with fresh water but I guess puddles are just so enticing.... argh!

After watching some YouTube videos of sick chickens she is very spirited by comparison - fights me hard on anything I put in/on her beak to eat or drink. It is hard for me to hold her for food and water in her beak with syringe. She is perching and the stinker has jumped over the barrier I have set up in our guest room and left me some presents here and there. I made her a diaper and she has hung out with me in the kitchen and with my girls in their playroom. Very curious and alert still.

I am going to hit her harder with some N.O.M.S. and herbal cocci treatment today and if she does not turn a corner and start eating better and drinking I will try the big guns. I have Fenbendazole for my goats and can grab Corid in town. Thanks for the dosages - so wonderful of you to provide that - helps so much!

Should I not let her eat worms right now? Do you think it would be safe to let her be with the flock for a few hours today or is that too risky since I don't know exactly what is going on with her? I just thought it might help and give her the opportunity to self medicate. I noticed her eating fir needles yesterday. Still no signs in any other chickens of illness.

There are 2 vets in the area that see chickens. I plan to take her in for sure if she can't shake this soon.

Thanks again!
Robin

Puddles are always more attractive than fresh clean water

I'm glad it seems the crop has gone down and you detect no sour smell. Going out with the flock may lift her spirits - sunshine, friends- if she is able let her out for a while to see how she does, but you may want to bring her in one more night to monitor her crop and take a look at her poop. Feel the crop at bedtime, it should be full, then first thing in the morning - it should be empty or flattened (no obvious large bits of food in the crop).

Will she eat/drink on her own? If she won't and you are having to syringe/force feed her, then she needs to stay put until she can eat/drink by herself.

For the time being, until you know for sure her crop issue has been resolved, it would be best to give just wet poultry feed and some egg with yogurt - think easy to digest foods. No seeds, hard grains, corn, etc.

I do hope the treatment(s) you are using work for you. I prefer using more natural methods - some information is slowly being gathered here and there, but it's hard to weed out the hype from truth sometimes. It's good to try these methods first, but be open to using the "big guns" when all else fails

Keep us posted.

 

[turdus]

Yes puddles are soooo much fun! The goatyard ponds in areas maybe once or twice a year during really heavy rain and we have a little seasonal stream thru it. We are in the PNW so it is incredibly hard to keep my chickens from drinking out of them. I saw some hens sipping out of the stream yesterday and was having a fit. I decided to take princess sicky out for just a little while to see her flock sisters and the first thing she did was drink from the stream! UGH! But, at least she was drinking. Something I have not actually seen her do in her guest room setup.

She did not eat anything but worms again outside. I just let her stay out for a little while and brought her back in. She did ok last night - little bit of sour smell but seems she clear it again by this AM. Poops are fairly solid but on the smaller side. She is still eating worms and picked at the scrambled egg. I am going to try hard boiled and see if she likes that better.

We have all the equipment here to do sub-q fluids and probably even injection. I saw the amount to do somewhere here on BYC. I am wondering if hydration is the hurdle she just can't get over for recovery. She is in this weird holding pattern of not getting better but not getting worse. She has lost some weight but is not a skeleton.

hmmmm.

Thanks again for all your help. Taking a sample in to vet tmrw for fecal float so I can at least see if I need the big guns.

=)

 

[Wyorp Rock]

Yes puddles are soooo much fun! The goatyard ponds in areas maybe once or twice a year during really heavy rain and we have a little seasonal stream thru it. We are in the PNW so it is incredibly hard to keep my chickens from drinking out of them. I saw some hens sipping out of the stream yesterday and was having a fit. I decided to take princess sicky out for just a little while to see her flock sisters and the first thing she did was drink from the stream! UGH! But, at least she was drinking. Something I have not actually seen her do in her guest room setup.

She did not eat anything but worms again outside. I just let her stay out for a little while and brought her back in. She did ok last night - little bit of sour smell but seems she clear it again by this AM. Poops are fairly solid but on the smaller side. She is still eating worms and picked at the scrambled egg. I am going to try hard boiled and see if she likes that better.

We have all the equipment here to do sub-q fluids and probably even injection. I saw the amount to do somewhere here on BYC. I am wondering if hydration is the hurdle she just can't get over for recovery. She is in this weird holding pattern of not getting better but not getting worse. She has lost some weight but is not a skeleton.

hmmmm.

Thanks again for all your help. Taking a sample in to vet tmrw for fecal float so I can at least see if I need the big guns.

=)

I'm glad she was able to get outside for a while.

Hydration is key, so if she is not drinking, then tubing fluids into her or giving subcutaneous may be in order. It's interesting that she will drink outside, but not inside. Chickens are weird, so try a different water dish/ container inside. Some people bring another hen inside to stay with the sick one - it seems to boost moral - chickens eat/drink together, so if the buddy drinks/eats, then she might too.

I hope she improves soon.

SUBCUTANEOUS FLUIDS
https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/...ntains-pictures-of-a-deceased-plucked-chicken
https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/845005/need-immediate-help-to-save-juvenile-roo/80 POST#90