Anyone non-religious here? Please be nice!

[HippieChickens]

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[deb1]

In my mind, bashing would be saying that religious believes are stupid or dumb, for example. No one is doing that. In order to speak about how some of us lost are faith, we have to discuss the religion that we were brought up with. For most of us our childhood faith was Christianity so that is what we discuss. I am sure that if we had a former Buddhist or Muslim they would be discussing what they found wrong with their faith.

I don't think that anyone believes that most religions are made up of mainly bad people or that there aren't beautiful portions in all types of holy books, including the bible.

Also, I am trying to be careful with how I word my posts so that I can express my feelings and be respectful of other's faiths. Because I think highly of many of the people on this board, I don't want to hurt the Christian members.

 

[redux]

That is how I see it, Deb. I don't want to see anyone criticizing Christians or people of any religion. This thread is about respect for their beliefs and the whole gamut of beliefs from atheism to devout religiousity. That being said, people have much to say about the WHYS of their beliefs, and that can come across as "bashing" of one religion or another. The way I see it is more of a history; this is what I experienced, this is how I reacted, this is how I feel now.

 

[thaiturkey]

Quote:
I remember several passages in Genesis about the people outside of Eden. Somewhere around the time Cain was tossed out and again when Adam and Eve were tossed out. Can't remember exactly but it's there, no in depth explanation on who put them there though. At 8 years old I was asking the teachers how they got there and who created them.... resulted in a parent/teacher conference

Quote:
Exactly, it was written my MEN, MEN are human, humans have an extraordinary brain that tends to lead to a fabulous imagination. Plus opiates in various forms were commonly used during the time many of the accepted and unaccepted books were written

Not as 'drugs' but as part of the culture like cigarettes are today.

Not knocking what was written but it was written by men, much of it was adjusted to suit the early 'churches', most of it was written after the time of christ, in many cases centuries. There is no way there aren't mistakes, evolved oral histories, etc. Not to mention the mistakes in translation.... Like the Red Sea Moses parted.... should have been translated as reed sea from the ancient hebrew text.
Then there was the decision on what books to include in the cannon, decisions made by men, men who may not have liked all the books and what oral history they represented. So much was left out, there are several references in the KJV to books that have not been a part of the cannon in 1500 years. Asking why landed another parent/teacher conference for me

There has been several books discovered recently and the History channel special on them was fascinating. I so want them to translate more of the scrolls quickly.

I love this thread, totally awesome!

The bible used by Christians, taken as a whole, was written by primitive people for other primitive people about events for which there is little corroborative evidence. Much of the Old Testament stuff is, perhaps, merely historical but hardly sets standards for modern life (killing offspring and so on). The writings have been misinterpreted, edited, added to and parts have been omitted over the centuries. It takes a huge leap of blind faith to believe in a benevolent, protective god and find a creed for life today from the bible but good luck the those who need it and find it.

A problem with organised churches that put me off was the reluctance to deal honestly with questions about what I was being taught. Many examples similar to mine have already been quoted so I won't add more. It's a pity that organised religions can't be less defensive and consider people's questions and doubts. They might have more members. Pretending that a book or church has all the answers is a nonsense.

Today on the BBC World News was a story from England that provides another illustration of how church officials can let down their god. I can't find a website version of the story but this is how it went. A group of retired people rented time regularly in a church meeting hall. They practiced Tai Chi, an ancient Chinese form of gentle exercise that relaxes mind and body. The vicar found out and the old folk were banned from using the hall. He said that Tai Chi had Asian spiritual origins and so was not in keeping with his church's views. What a load of tosh! Below is a link to Wikipedia that explains the true origins. In any case, why is a group of old folk using gentle exercises for pleasure and relaxation so in a church hall so anti Christian? The vicar's church was formed by a king for his own selfish purposes and based on beliefs and some horrible events from the Middle East so where is the logic for banning Tai Chi?

Narrow minded control freaks are turning away people who want to learn about religion and some who really do need a set of beliefs in order to cope with life. If there is a god, they will have to explain their actions one day!


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tai_chi_chuan

 

[BigBadCryBaby]

Great thread!

I believe in a Higher Power, but I can't define it, except to say it is the source of all Love and Goodness.

A friend once said to me:

Religion is for people who want to avoid Hell. Spirituality is for those of us who have already been there.

 

[KDbeads]

Quote:
I am still here. I think the bashing is the result of people answering Deb1's question about how they came to diverge from their former faith.

I think people are keeping it respectful; they are criticizing ideas, not Christians.

Exactly.

Goodness no! I would never intentionally 'bash' any religious person or what they believe. It is their right to be as they are, to believe what they wish. I applaud the truly religious that educate themselves and read all of what they believe.

I just don't like the ideas that we are all evil until we are 'saved' and that this religion is right and that religion is wrong. Or the fact that so many things just don't add up for me.

In all fairness, at lot of us have been well and truly bashed for our beliefs or lack thereof as well on this board but I don't see this thread as an attack on anyone. Attacks on ideas yes but on those who believe, no.

 

[deb1]

Quote:
No, it was me. I asked a question and that started people explaining why they pulled away from religion. I don't think that religion is being bashed but I don't want the thread closed either. The moderators are usually very quick to act if we go to far.

 

[thaiturkey]

Quote:
I too am sorry that you feel that way. People are writing honestly about their experiences and beliefs. If a religion or church can't stand some questioning and criticism it isn't very strong. This thread is a very positive thing and a rare opportunity for people to communicate about a very sensitive subject. There has been no flaming or trolling and I don't agree that there has been any bashing.

Please reconsider your decision and stay with this.

 

[mom'sfolly]

What I've also seen is people deliberately not mentioning any particular church or organization. I certainly didn't mention the one that started the harassment campaign on my family. If I was trying to incite people I certainly would have. It was however, one of many precipitating steps in my questioning of faith. I think we have said that for many of us skeptiscim or a questioning nature was discouraged, which for many was followed by more questions rather than fewer.

 

[debilorrah]

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I see your point and understand it, however, as a Christian I am not offended by everyone's position. In my eyes, everyone has a right to believe what they believe. I believe Thomas was crazy and therefore his ramblings were later removed from the Bible. I also believe that the bible was written by men, inspired by God, written of miracles, written of commands, written to help people, not hurt them.

Honestly? I haven't seen one post from anyone telling me I am wrong because I believe Jesus died on the cross. Everyone is entitled to their opinion.

One thing that is different about me than most others, though. I was not raised in any church, or with any faith at all. I came across that in my adult life, lived the church life for a while. Then came the "OMG DEBI!!!! He is gay! What are you doing?" Yeah. MY Jesus told me to love others as I love myself. MY God told me that he is the final judge and judge not lest you be judged. It is the simple things in the Bible that I try to live by, not subscribed to what others in my faith think is "right".