Article on government crackdown on raw milk

[Farmerboy16]

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[chickened]

I agree with inspections as I worked on a dairy in high school and have seen the effects of bad milk. The only problem I have with the issue is the consumer has no opportunity of recourse against the very agency that approves them only against the farmers even when the farmers comply 100%.
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How about close to 100 years of successful milk quality regulation that has almost eliminated a major source of food-bourne disease outbreaks? Every time a major outbreak occurs people start demanding stricter food quality regulations. This is not about "them" (the government) versus "us". This is America, the people govern. The populace demands these sort of regulations to protect public health and laws are passed. Last year during the salmonella-tainted egg scare, there were folks standing in front of a congressional sub-committee declaring that the government should have protected them and that something needs to be done; more regulation, more inspection, more compliance. So generally, the regulations on milk are out of concern for the well-being of you and your family.

The reason our governor vetoed the raw milk bill in Wisconsin last year was due to concerns by the dairy industry. It wasn't necessarily due to concerns about competition, but due to fears about what a possible outbreak would do to our state dairy industry. Once again, look to last year's egg scare. A few farms were implicated, but it turned the entire egg industry upside-down, nationwide sales were down for months and it took quite a long time before consumer trust was regained and egg sales returned to normal levels, and the repercussions are still being felt. Dairy farmers live by extremely thin profit margins already, upsets like that can break many farmers. I don't remember the timing of how things went down last year, but it is quite possible that the egg scare directly influenced the result of the governor's vote on our raw milk bill in Wisconsin.

 

[chocolate m'scovy]

If I want to buy food, I should be allowed to buy it. The people we get our raw milk from also drink the milk with their families. They have an ulterior motive to make sure they have safe milk.

Some sellers of raw milk might ask you to sign a "CARE" agreement in which you basically promise not to sue the farmer for any raw milk-related product. Sure, outbreaks may happen...but I don't want the government intruding anyway. Don't we hear of recalls on store-bought spinach, eggs, ground meat, etc. too? I don't expect perfection.... conscientiousness and basic clean practices are enough for me. If a raw milk seller has been in business for years and still has happy customers coming back....count me in!

Now please excuse me while I go eat mulberry crisp with raw cream.

 

[chickened]

Oregon just recently passed a law that allows people to process chickens with out recourse or inspection. I will see if I can find some info on it.

I see no reason they cannot do it for milk.

 

[Amyable]

Quote:
How about close to 100 years of successful milk quality regulation that has almost eliminated a major source of food-bourne disease outbreaks? Every time a major outbreak occurs people start demanding stricter food quality regulations. This is not about "them" (the government) versus "us". This is America, the people govern. The populace demands these sort of regulations to protect public health and laws are passed. Last year during the salmonella-tainted egg scare, there were folks standing in front of a congressional sub-committee declaring that the government should have protected them and that something needs to be done; more regulation, more inspection, more compliance. So generally, the regulations on milk are out of concern for the well-being of you and your family.

The reason our governor vetoed the raw milk bill in Wisconsin last year was due to concerns by the dairy industry. It wasn't necessarily due to concerns about competition, but due to fears about what a possible outbreak would do to our state dairy industry. Once again, look to last year's egg scare. A few farms were implicated, but it turned the entire egg industry upside-down, nationwide sales were down for months and it took quite a long time before consumer trust was regained and egg sales returned to normal levels, and the repercussions are still being felt. Dairy farmers live by extremely thin profit margins already, upsets like that can break many farmers. I don't remember the timing of how things went down last year, but it is quite possible that the egg scare directly influenced the result of the governor's vote on our raw milk bill in Wisconsin.

Have you heard of the book, "The Untold Story of Milk" by Ron Schild? It is a fascinating, extremely well-researched book. Milk related diseases were common because of 'distillery dairies', city dairies that fed alcohol grain byproducts to cows in filthy conditions. Of course milk from confined, malnourished animals is unsafe, but the laws make no distinction between that and milk from clean, grassfed dairies. They are not the same product.

I see a big problem with people standing in front of congress and demanding protection from everything. The gov't cannot do that job, it is just too big and personal, especially in a country founded on the love of individual liberty. I take responsibility for my health, which includes taking great care in choosing my diet, and that diet includes raw milk. Our gov't does not have the authority to ban foods they disapprove of, though that hasn't stopped them. My backyard eggs are not FDA-inspected but that does not make them unsafe; and lots of FDA-sanctioned food is dangerous to consume.

I consider the article in the first post idiotic because the author believes no one should have raw milk as a choice. Everything pasteurized, everything sanitized. Aside from the fact that extreme sanitation is detrimental to human immune systems, I have the right to decide what to eat.

 

[rebel-rousing-at-night]

Well I personally would like to have the freedom to buy raw milk.

 

[foweler]

Quote:
How about close to 100 years of successful milk quality regulation that has almost eliminated a major source of food-bourne disease outbreaks? Every time a major outbreak occurs people start demanding stricter food quality regulations. This is not about "them" (the government) versus "us". This is America, the people govern. The populace demands these sort of regulations to protect public health and laws are passed. Last year during the salmonella-tainted egg scare, there were folks standing in front of a congressional sub-committee declaring that the government should have protected them and that something needs to be done; more regulation, more inspection, more compliance. So generally, the regulations on milk are out of concern for the well-being of you and your family.

The reason our governor vetoed the raw milk bill in Wisconsin last year was due to concerns by the dairy industry. It wasn't necessarily due to concerns about competition, but due to fears about what a possible outbreak would do to our state dairy industry. Once again, look to last year's egg scare. A few farms were implicated, but it turned the entire egg industry upside-down, nationwide sales were down for months and it took quite a long time before consumer trust was regained and egg sales returned to normal levels, and the repercussions are still being felt. Dairy farmers live by extremely thin profit margins already, upsets like that can break many farmers. I don't remember the timing of how things went down last year, but it is quite possible that the egg scare directly influenced the result of the governor's vote on our raw milk bill in Wisconsin.

But is it any of the governments business to be involved in that? Isn't it up to the producers to maintain a good reputation? Wouldn't that be more effective?
When an outbreak occurs, as it stands now, it happens on the government's watch. Their rules did nothing to prevent it. They couldn't unless they assigned an agent to watch every chicken or cow (on your dime and at the cost of all of our liberty).
What thier rules did do was dull people's own sense of buyer beware. The reason the whole sector is damaged when these things occur is because people haven't been keeping tabs for themselves on individual producer's reputations, they see the industry as homogeneus which obviously it isn't. Without the govt intervention people would quickly find out who the bad actors were and shift their demand to better producers. Bad producers would shape up....if they survived.
Govt intervetion in food (and just about anything else) = moral hazard.

 

[Mac in Wisco]

I do agree with most of your arguments. They are all valid points, save for the government conspiracy of "controlling the people". Do you really think our politicians meet in back rooms, tenting their fingers, plotting evil schemes?

Yet, I also look at it from the government standpoint of "what is best for everybody as a whole". You can't tell me that there should be no food safety laws whatsoever and that it should only be "buyer beware". Our food safety laws are necessary, and yes, there may be areas where our laws may possibly be overreaching. I also don't think that this an issue of telling you what you may or may not eat or drink. You are free to milk away. Perhaps it is overreaching to demand that raw milk be made available to you, by others? (I know that's a poor argument, but I really couldn't help myself).

All in all, I may not agree with government decisions, but I do have faith in our system. The bottom line with a democracy is that you can't please all of the people all of the time. While I did not provide comments to officials on our state raw milk bill, I have been fairly vocal about animal welfare standards, the National Organic plan, and on Farm Bill issues. I have personally met with National Organic Standard Board members and shared my viewpoints and submitted written comments on proposed rules. I have personally met with my state congressman on Farm Bill issues. I have had phone conversations with FDA officials about the new egg safety regulations and possible impacts on organic production. I've attended regional egg producer meetings and helped to organize producers' thoughts on animal welfare standards to be forwarded as comments on proposed laws. I show up to cast a ballot on every election, on every referendum, every time the polls are open.

I do not buy into conspiracy theories, nor do I think every politician is crooked. It's rather on the contrary. I think that most of our politicians are dedicated public servants who try to make a difference and do what is best for the whole, yet are many times bound by an inefficient and confounding bureaucracy. There is also that one huge factor that I stated earlier, that they can't please all of the people all of the time. The best they can do is to make decisions for the common good, whether we agree or not.

 

[greyhorsewoman]

My daughter was a customer of the Amish farmer that recently got busted for selling raw milk. She lives in a large city over an hour & half from his farm (in another state). He did weekly deliveries to set locations in certain neighborhoods. As well as raw milk, he sold eggs, cheese, and processed chickens. The deliveries were left at the set location in large coolers. For a short while, my daughter was one of those locations. After the delivery, the folks who had ordered whatever stopped by and picked up their items. The idea was that everything would be picked up in the same day as delivered, but sometimes things happen and somebody wouldn't get there till the next day or so, so the individual at the location drop would find themselves responsible for taking care of the product till picked up.

The folks that support this want better food. They are in a position to PAY MORE for the privilege. The prices were not exorbitant, but high by most of our standards (doz eggs $4+ per dozen, etc). That is why is was attractive to the Amish farmer. Even with the added travel costs, he was getting so much more than he could get locally for the same produce. While it was assumed most everything came from his farm, there is no way to confirm that. My daughter said one individual in her circle had visited the farm once, but did they have any idea of what to look for ?

She and I discussed this at one point. I understood her desire to feed more natural foods to her family. (She was afterall raised to appreciate all this, but now lives on a small plot in a heavy urban area.) She really liked the raw milk, but was concerned, too, if she was putting her family in any risk. As mentioned above, it is one thing to go to a farm with your own containers and get milk (we used to do that too) and quite another to have it delivered from several hours and miles away to a location where it will sit till you pick it up. I worry that some of the participants aren't really aware of all the repercussions of not handling things properly.

It is a complicated issue. Also, something that hasn't been mentioned yet is that many dairy farmers have to sign contracts with their milk company to NOT sell to anyone else. This makes it difficult for some farmers to supply raw milk to local residents.

 

[Dunkopf]

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That's a good point. I think we would then have a lot more people coming around inspecting and such.

We have 3 milk goats now and get about 2 gallons a day from them. I know a few people that would gladly buy some. I'm a little concerned about someone getting sick from something I supplied though. I worry about liability as well as friendship issues.

Eggs I don't worry about except that we have our 14 year old collect them and there's the possibility she might grab one that's been hiding for a while.

That would be embarrassing too.