Barnevelder breeders lets work together and improve the breed

[ElitePoultry]

This pic was shared by Dr Bjorn Netland via the Dutch Barnevelder club. It shows a hen with the light shafting and poor inner lace. Peppering is when there is black specks in the red/gold base color. The goal is lacing with clean inner and outer lacing, no light shafting, and no peppering in the ground color. Shafting usually shows up the most in the breast. Peppering can show up anywhere but I usually see it show up in the saddle area. Lacing can also change as a hen ages and with each moult. I have one hen that had exceptional lacing clear though her tail feathers as pullet. Now that she has had 2 complete fall moults she has some peppering showing up in her saddle and tail feathers. Trisha

Thanks for that lesson! I'm learning soo much already!

 

[Dr Bjorn Netland]

One picture can't tell the whole story. I believe I see some white at the base of the tail...if that's correct, that is a difficult fault to get rid of. Also, I don't see any copper coloring in his hackles, which he really should have. Nor do I see much red/copper on his wing. Lastly, his tail set is too low. Is he the only one you have?

Hey everybody, I was hoping to get some opinions/critique on my Bantam Barnevelder soon to be cock. Type? Color? Thank you

 

[LittleMissPurdy]

This pic was shared by Dr Bjorn Netland via the Dutch Barnevelder club. It shows a hen with the light shafting and poor inner lace. Peppering is when there is black specks in the red/gold base color. The goal is lacing with clean inner and outer lacing, no light shafting, and no peppering in the ground color. Shafting usually shows up the most in the breast. Peppering can show up anywhere but I usually see it show up in the saddle area.




Lacing can also change as a hen ages and with each moult. I have one hen that had exceptional lacing clear though her tail feathers as pullet. Now that she has had 2 complete fall moults she has some peppering showing up in her saddle and tail feathers.

Trisha

Obviously I'm a novice here, but what do you do with her now? Do you still breed her because she started well or ?...could she molt to perfect again? thank you for your patients

 

[hendrixcoop]

Does anyone know if there are any breeders in South Carolina? I am a novice and getting my feet wet with some mutts but I have fixated on getting some quality Barnevelders to help maintain a great breed. Thanks for any info.

 

[tls_ranch]

Quote: Well, it is really up to each breeder to decide which birds to use. My hen is still very well laced in compared to most others despite the peppering showing up. So I will use her. I have heard that it is recommended that you choose hens after their first full moult to fully evaluate their lacing. It comes down to knowing your own bird's strengths and weaknesses. Once you learn what needs improvement...try your best to breed and select the best birds to move forward with.

My barnies have very nice lacing in compared to most, but I am still working on my blues. With blues, a hens color can also change after moult maybe even more so. I have some that had drastic changes in lacing (good and bad) and even changed shades to darker blue. They are still a work in progress

Trisha

 

[BlueCamas]

One picture can't tell the whole story. I believe I see some white at the base of the tail...if that's correct, that is a difficult fault to get rid of. Also, I don't see any copper coloring in his hackles, which he really should have. Nor do I see much red/copper on his wing. Lastly, his tail set is too low. Is he the only one you have?

Thank you for your reply! He is very dark in color, but I wasn't sure if that was a good or bad thing. I've shown him three times, once in a class of 5 he was BB against cockerels that were the lighter "phase". The second time he was DQ due to a "side sprig". The other time in a class of 4, he was last in his class and lost to a light "phase" cockerel. When I say light "phase" I am referring to a cockerel with a lot of copper or mahogany in his hackles and saddle. I know that every judge has their own preferences, but I honestly don't know what to think after all of these show results! He is my only breeding male as of now, but I recently hatched out 13 of his chicks and it looks like I will have many cockerels to choose from!

Here is another pic of him, he doesn't usually have any "white-fluff" showing.

This not a recent picture, but this is the pullet I have him paired with. She has a lot of copper on her neck, do you think that some of their cockerels might have more copper on them?


Thank you so much, this breed is relatively new to me so I appreciate anything you have to say.

 

[LittleMissPurdy]

Well, it is really up to each breeder to decide which birds to use. My hen is still very well laced in compared to most others despite the peppering showing up. So I will use her. I have heard that it is recommended that you choose hens after their first full moult to fully evaluate their lacing. It comes down to knowing your own bird's strengths and weaknesses. Once you learn what needs improvement...try your best to breed and select the best birds to move forward with.

My barnies have very nice lacing in compared to most, but I am still working on my blues. With blues, a hens color can also change after moult maybe even more so. I have some that had drastic changes in lacing (good and bad) and even changed shades to darker blue. They are still a work in progress

Trisha

Thank you for sharing. You have answered quite abit for me here. I was wondering how you would even know what you have to work with if you would "get-rid-of" your hens too early. I think waiting until they would mature alittle would make more sense, have heard some remove birds at a very young age, guess it does take some time to get to that stage of knowledge, but as I said before-just a novice. Thank you again

 

[tls_ranch]

Quote: One more thing...Sometimes breeding good birds may not be just breeding the best to the best. It may be necessary to breed two birds together that will complement each other or fix "extremes". High tail set...to low. Great lacing, but small, to a big but not so well laced bird. Etc, Etc. Not all show quality birds come from pairing SQ birds. And pairing up SQ birds does not always equal SQ either.

Egg color is also a factor. You may want to keep a hen with shafting and peppering....if she lays a darker egg. If you cull her and only keep the "pretty" ones...you may loose those dark egg genes. Just evaluate each bird's strengths and weaknesses individually. Eventually you'll end up with what you want your birds to be. Sometimes it's 2 steps forward...one step back

Trisha

 

[Dr Bjorn Netland]

There are Barnie breeders here who by now have much, much more experience than do I as regards breeding programs. As for your cockerel, I would be just as concerned about the white that is not showing as what is showing, because there will be a lot more white after his second adult molt (a trait most non-white birds share if white is a problem). What also would concern me very much is the side sprig because comb defects are notoriously difficult to breed out, especially side sprigs).
As for the pullets you have mated him with, I note they have pretty good lacing.
Here is another pic of him, he doesn't usually have any "white-fluff" showing.

This not a recent picture, but this is the pullet I have him paired with. She has a lot of copper on her neck, do you think that some of their cockerels might have more copper on them?


Thank you so much, this breed is relatively new to me so I appreciate anything you have to say.

Side sprigs are very bad as they are notoriously difficult to breed out, along with stubs between toes and on shanks. White in the wing or at the base of the tail is a problem with many non-white birds, even the white that is not apparent to the eye unless one examines the bird closely. The white normally shows up a lot more after the second adult molt, and increased with each year thereafter. Those incredible shows in Germany ("yearling" birds) have many impressive birds on display, and I don't think anybody can beat the Germans when it comes to breeding birds in the colored spectrum; however, many of those stunning birds might be disqualified for defects related to the white were they to be exhibited as two-year-olds.
As regards the pullet, I think she has decent lacing and a wonderful "shine" but the ground color seems a bit light to me (this may also simply be a matter of inexact color rendition in the photo), a bit like what one often sees in the British double laced Barnies. I am also a bit puzzled by the amount of "copper" in her hackles, which should appear almost totally black except around the head. To me (but many of you breeders have much more experience with these things than I could ever hope to have), this is the opposite of the color issue of the cockerel. A good mating? I don't know. Had it been up to me, I'd look around for other birds to breed from--especially the cock bird. Good luck, and I commend you for wanting to work with this very challenging but beautiful breed.

 

[AyaBlodgett]

Thank you for all that good info. I will store it in the Barnie folder for future reference.
Trisha, those girls are so pretty. But I don't understand what shafting is. Could you explain to this novice? Thanks, Aya