Barnevelder breeders lets work together and improve the breed

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We are off to Holland in August this year.....would love to visit a barnevelder breeder or two while we are there. Any suggestions? I know I need to email or otherwise contact and ask if it is possible so want to start early,
 
Hi Redcap

Thanks for that reference to the paper. Its an interesting research and I can't imagine the hours of field work that went into gathering all those data from a wild population of birds. One thing the authors separate is the heredity of ground color from heredity of pattern on the eggs. This paper is about pattern and it is the pattern inheritance that they conclude is sex linked. So I expect if we are to transfer this to chickens it could be speckles are sex linked on a W gene. In the wild birds they found a strong correlation in pattern inherited from the maternal side and little or no inheritance of the pattern from the paternal side even from the grandmother on the paternal side. This paper makes no claim of heritability of ground color however.
This paper was concerned with breeding chickens with less speckles. Since there was a positive correlation with darker brown and speckles it seems that selecting for darker brown and selecting for speckles one may be able to breed for more speckles. That is how I look at the results anyway, and I am not a geneticist, so please correct me if I am interpreting the results incorrectly.


The other paper from Hyline shows that there is an interaction and positive correlation with darker ground color and the incidence of speckles. It also shows Another paper I found showed that the loss of color with time of laying varied with different populations and in the populations in the study a RIR population showed reduction in egg color later in the season of lay and a plymouth rock population showed no change or loss of color. So I found that interesting. http://www.lohmann-information.com/content/l_i_47_artikel12.pdf
This could explain why the colors drop off for one bird or one line and not another.

Andy
 
Hi Redcap

Sorry for the mixed up post, I have edited it to put sentences in proper order,

Thanks for that reference to the paper. Its an interesting research and I can't imagine the hours of field work that went into gathering all those data from a wild population of birds. One thing the authors separate is the heredity of ground color from heredity of pattern on the eggs. This paper is about pattern and it is the pattern inheritance that they conclude is sex linked. So I expect if we are to transfer this to chickens it could be speckles are sex linked on a W gene. In the wild birds they found a strong correlation in pattern inherited from the maternal side and little or no inheritance of the pattern from the paternal side even from the grandmother on the paternal side. This paper makes no claim of heritability of ground color however.

The other paper from Hyline shows that there is an interaction and positive correlation with darker ground color and the incidence of speckles.
This paper was concerned with breeding chickens with less speckles. Since there was a positive correlation with darker brown and speckles it seems that selecting for darker brown and selecting for speckles one may be able to breed for more speckles. That is how I look at the results anyway, and I am not a geneticist, so please correct me if I am interpreting the results incorrectly.

Another paper I found showed that the loss of color with time of laying varied with different populations and in the populations in the study a RIR population showed reduction in egg color later in the season of lay and a plymouth rock population showed no change or loss of color. So I found that interesting. http://www.lohmann-information.com/content/l_i_47_artikel12.pdf
This could explain why the colors drop off for one bird or one line and not another.

Andy
 
mountainvieworchards said:
That was a good article Piet. I appreciate the experience and research both you and Chris have brought to this Barnevelder Thread. I like the information and the polite way you disagree with each other when you do. I noticed in the article the writer said that spots on eggs should be selected against and also the spherical eggs. I can see the argument for the spherical eggs if you are setting in an incubator, though I can usually right an egg by about day 5 by looking at the air cell. But why the predjudice against speckles and spotted eggs, I find them to be my favorite and the kids that I sell eggs to choose them when given a choice.

Andy
Click to expand...
Hi Andy,
To answer your question on speckles. This is something of preference. They hold egg shows also and judge on egg size, shape, color, gloss, egg shell quality etc. So the Barnevelder lays that very even colored glossy dark brown egg without speckles and the specialty clubs like to adhere to this. The Welsummers do have speckles and the more the better, large spots and small spots, we love speckled eggs and they belong to a Welsummer. I breed Welsummers also btw. When I talked to a (long time) Welsummer breeder in Montana, he was surprised when I explained to him that speckles on Welsummer eggs are kinda trademark. He had selected away from speckles as his preference goes out to evenly smooth colored eggs. Not that it really is a big deal, but this is why I find it helpful and important to explain how they look at these things in country of origin. Not saying that that is how it should be, but at least then there is less guessing as to what and why.
It makes for more conversation, but we are all free in doing things the way we want.
As Poultch also explained, but I will word it differently: There are several ways that lead to Rome.
Piet
 
scopechick said:
We are off to Holland in August this year.....would love to visit a barnevelder breeder or two while we are there. Any suggestions? I know I need to email or otherwise contact and ask if it is possible so want to start early,
Click to expand...

How fantastic! Enjoy your trip! I'm in the US, so I have no idea who you should meet with.
 
scopechick said:
We are off to Holland in August this year.....would love to visit a barnevelder breeder or two while we are there. Any suggestions? I know I need to email or otherwise contact and ask if it is possible so want to start early,
Click to expand...

Do You want to pick up hatching eggs, or meet just for fun?
 

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