Being a Feminist (And Teaching People to Not Cringe When You Say "I'm a Feminist")

[3goodeggs]

The best job I ever had has been being my son's mom. I gave up going on to graduate school to be a full time mom. absolutely no regrets. It has been the best part of my life.
That does not mean that I deserve less respect than anyone else, It takes a lot of skill to be a good mom.
Our children's education is what we have to give them. Education is never wasted on a woman, because we are educating our children one moment at a time.
My own mother felt that sending me to college would be a waste of money. But she is one of the biggest chauvinists that I have ever known.

My mother felt that having my brother bully me was good training for when I got married and had to 'learn how to take it'. For those of you who have never had to endure such negative, soul crushing, demeaning behavior... lucky you. But it goes on every where, everyday, every minute. If we do not teach our girls that they have value, like your parents taught you, it will continue to go on.

I like men who like me. I like men who may not like me but who will at least have the manners to be polite and respectful to me. I do not want more than anyone else, I just want to be treated like a person- not a man but a hu-man.
I do not want to be dismissed to the kitchen when 'guys' are around. My husband would remove himself and come spend time with us ladies in the kitchen because he likes me.

We laugh a lot. We get each other. I guess the rest of the world just baffles us.

 

[Happy Chooks]

I have never had any woman question me about being a stay at home mom...I however would not recommend it for any woman who wishes to return to the workforce. I have stayed out too long for my skills to be current, and marketable. While I have enjoyed my time with my kids, 16 years has dated me. But that is me. I recognize that I made a choice, and I am grateful that choice was available to me. Many families literally cannot afford to have one parent stay out of the work force.

I agree with this, though I wouldn't change it for the world. I've been out of the workforce for 14 years, and have homeschooled my oldest son for the past 3 years.

However, there is the perception that a stay at home mom sits around all day eating bon bon's. (I guess we can thank Married With Children for that

) Being a stay at home mom is not what most people (male or female) thinks it is. I work hard, I just don't get paid to do it.

Could I get a job back in the workforce? Yup. Would I be making good money like I was before? Nope, I'd be starting over.

My husband earns the money, maintenance/repairs of the house and takes care of the cars. I take care of the kids, schooling, bees, garden, chickens, orchard (including pruning) and household cleaning. We didn't come up with these lists based on our gender, but our qualifications (and time available) for doing it. He built our house, therefore, he is more qualified for repairing it. He did teach me how to build by having me build my 2nd chicken coop. He told me that I'd need to be able to build if something ever happened to him.

 

[punk-a-doodle]

I think sometimes sexism is viewed as a purely female problem (...how many posters to this thread are female?), and that this view fuels dismissal/invalidation and anger/hurt/fear/blame. In reality, stereotypes drag everyone down. The assumption that women are physically weak is accompanied by the idea that men must be physically strong. When women are called weepy and emotional, that is often paired with the idea that males must not cry or show certain emotions. When women are said to be "asking for it", men are excused as simple beasts incapable of controlling their desires and impulses. These things are insulting to and hurtful for both genders.


Mom'sfolly said: A well pointed out example of the exact same behavior receiving an unequal reception based on gender. As a female, I sometimes catch myself viewing forceful males in an acceptable light and forceful females in an unacceptable light. It is one example of a case where my cultural wiring goes against my personal belief and desire that people should be treated fairly and equally (culture can be sneaky, sneaky stuff), and also an example of how sexism is much more complex than men vs. women.


Happy Chooks, your split of duties makes for a handy discussion point. The way the Happy Chook family's duties and responsibilities are divided may very well be a matter of self-aware and educated personal choice and ability. The issue is when things like who does the tool wielding falls very heavily to one side on a larger societal level, either due to obvious social pressure or the sneaky and subtle cultural norms that we don't even think about or question. It is an issue when someone's abilities are the way they are because of cultural upbringing and limitations rather than genuine personal interest/disinterest. It is important to discuss such divides at the cultural level, but also important not to fall into the trap of maligning individuals for personal situations/choices such as working or staying at home while parenting.

 

[Happy Chooks]

Happy Chooks, your split of duties makes for a handy discussion point. The way the Happy Chook family's duties and responsibilities are divided may very well be a matter of self-aware and educated personal choice and ability. The issue is when things like who does the tool wielding falls very heavily to one side on a larger societal level, either due to obvious social pressure or the sneaky and subtle cultural norms that we don't even think about or question. It is an issue when someone's abilities are the way they are because of cultural upbringing and limitations rather than genuine personal interest/disinterest. It is important to discuss such divides at the cultural level, but also important not to fall into the trap of maligning individuals for personal situations/choices such as working or staying at home while parenting.

Good point. My mom and step dad think I do things I shouldn't, but that is just the era in which they were raised.

We chose me to stay home because 1) my DH has NO patience and 2) he made more money than I did. (not because of my gender, but different lines of work, his line of work pays more than mine whether male or female) But I do know and have known men that stayed home to raise the kids while their wife worked. Men who stay home get a lot of stereotypes too - like they are lazy because they send their wife off to work, they are not a man, etc. My DH just says they are smart.

I have zero, zip, nada interest in working on cars - never have, never will. It has never interested me, but that doesn't stop me from going to the garage and asking him questions every now and again. My husband restored his own car when he was 16, so it's something that interests him. He likes to take things apart and figure out how they work. Why have me do something I don't enjoy when he does enjoy it? Chickens don't interest my DH at all, but they are my hobby - so I take care of them. Can I do everything that he does? Most things, yes - physical strength would be my disadvantage to doing something. But do I want to do everything he does? Nope, and he doesn't want to do everything I do.

We do hard labor stuff together. We both split wood, I do what I can physically manage, and he handles what I can't manage. I typically stack it, because I'm better at it than he is and I don't want the darn stack falling on me. (kids help with this too) I have used a chainsaw, though his larger chainsaw is pretty dang heavy for me, so I use the smaller one - definitely don't want to be unsafe with a chainsaw. All of us (kids too) clear brush and do other yard work together - on 5 acres, there is always something to do.

I don't refuse to do what is commonly referred to as "women's work", though I do tease my DH that I should have married a man that cooks.

At the end of the day it all has to be done.

What angers both of us is when a woman is put into a position she's not qualified for because she is a woman. My DH's line of work is predominantly male, and HR will push for managers to hire a woman (or minority), even when they are not qualified for the position.

 

[LBejaran]

Everyone has personal experiences that shape attitudes and views. I've never been the recipient of negative, judgmental attitudes by males. -have received some interesting comments by a few feminist (as they identified themselves) females. They shared similar attitudes that I was bizarre for choosing to exit the workforce, stay home with my children, and care for the home/family (and yes - that includes the husband). I chose my path and am fulfilled. -and the above women (I personally referenced) just do not get that. It's as if I've rolled back years of progress. -don't concern myself with their decisions, and have been amused that they concern themselves with mine.

I have never had any woman question me about being a stay at home mom...I however would not recommend it for any woman who wishes to return to the workforce. I have stayed out too long for my skills to be current, and marketable. While I have enjoyed my time with my kids, 16 years has dated me. But that is me. I recognize that I made a choice, and I am grateful that choice was available to me. Many families literally cannot afford to have one parent stay out of the work force.

When my kids were little, I simply couldn't justify the daycare situation where I would be paying a minimum wage worker, with little education, to raise my children. I think, as a society, we undervalue those who work with and care for children. While a parent pays a great deal for childcare, the worker usually is a minimum wage employee. In my opinion, teachers are generally underpaid as well. But back to the "feminist" issues, childcare and teaching tend to be "pink collar" jobs, and have historically be underpaid.

The best job I ever had has been being my son's mom. I gave up going on to graduate school to be a full time mom. absolutely no regrets. It has been the best part of my life.
That does not mean that I deserve less respect than anyone else, It takes a lot of skill to be a good mom.
Our children's education is what we have to give them. Education is never wasted on a woman, because we are educating our children one moment at a time.
My own mother felt that sending me to college would be a waste of money. But she is one of the biggest chauvinists that I have ever known.

My mother felt that having my brother bully me was good training for when I got married and had to 'learn how to take it'. For those of you who have never had to endure such negative, soul crushing, demeaning behavior... lucky you. But it goes on every where, everyday, every minute. If we do not teach our girls that they have value, like your parents taught you, it will continue to go on.

I like men who like me. I like men who may not like me but who will at least have the manners to be polite and respectful to me. I do not want more than anyone else, I just want to be treated like a person- not a man but a hu-man.
I do not want to be dismissed to the kitchen when 'guys' are around. My husband would remove himself and come spend time with us ladies in the kitchen because he likes me.

We laugh a lot. We get each other. I guess the rest of the world just baffles us.

I agree with this, though I wouldn't change it for the world. I've been out of the workforce for 14 years, and have homeschooled my oldest son for the past 3 years.

However, there is the perception that a stay at home mom sits around all day eating bon bon's. (I guess we can thank Married With Children for that

) Being a stay at home mom is not what most people (male or female) thinks it is. I work hard, I just don't get paid to do it.

Could I get a job back in the workforce? Yup. Would I be making good money like I was before? Nope, I'd be starting over.

My husband earns the money, maintenance/repairs of the house and takes care of the cars. I take care of the kids, schooling, bees, garden, chickens, orchard (including pruning) and household cleaning. We didn't come up with these lists based on our gender, but our qualifications (and time available) for doing it. He built our house, therefore, he is more qualified for repairing it. He did teach me how to build by having me build my 2nd chicken coop. He told me that I'd need to be able to build if something ever happened to him.

I've got to say that I commend you all for being stay-at-home mothers. I think it needs to be realized that one of the hardest jobs is maintaining a household and raising children. Any parent who stays home and cares for their children/home full-time is a real trooper. I think what some people don't get across properly is that it shouldn't be expected of women to stay at home. But you all made your choice and I'm so happy that it's been rewarding! I'd never try and shame a woman (or man) who decided to not pursue a career because they would prefer to raise their children full-time. Sometimes, this is the best option for families and other times, it's not.

For some mothers, it's expected of them to stay home and raise children, no matter her own wishes. It was something that nearly happened to my own mother. Mom was about to go get her Master's degree in English and Spanish when something happened. It was expected of her to have children and, unfortunately, she doubted herself and never got her Master's. She's still a teacher and has been for 25 years, but she tells me today that she wishes she had still pursued her degree after she had kids. We are looking for ways to pay for her to get it so she can continue teaching elsewhere after she retires from being a middle school teacher. If she gets her Master's, she can teach night classes and will make enough to live a very comfortable life.

I also thought it might be a good time to mention a song that I heard by Macklemore ft. Ryan Lewis. I know, I know, you've all probably heard Thrift Shop, haha! But this song is called Stay-At-Home Dad and I think it's a great song talking about creating a bit of equality. Just...don't listen around kids. It's been awhile since I've listened to it and I'm pretty sure this is not the "clean" version of the song. Just in case.

Stay At Home Dad by Macklemore ft. Ryan Lewis

Edit: Just a small fact that I came across the other day, but forgot to mention:

Did you know that if all the stay at home mothers were paid for the work they put in to raising their kids, the nation would go bankrupt? Just a little something to tell the unappreciative people who dare say what you do isn't important or "feminist" enough. This feminist thinks you all are probably the strongest women ever.

 

[sourland]

I don't refuse to do what is commonly referred to as "women's work", though I do tease my DH that I should have married a man that cooks.

I cook. The Princess cooked the first 25 years. This last almost 25 have been mine - started as a result of work schedules, and I discovered that I really like cooking. I open doors for her, help her with her coat, and help her to be seated when we eat out. Does that diminish either her or me? We think not. She has always been free spirited, assertive and sure of herself. This can be threatening both to other women and to men. I love it, and we have raised a strong minded/willed daughter. How you allow people to treat you is how you will be treated - male or female. Stereotypes no longer apply.

 

[LBejaran]

I don't refuse to do what is commonly referred to as "women's work", though I do tease my DH that I should have married a man that cooks.

At the end of the day it all has to be done.

What angers both of us is when a woman is put into a position she's not qualified for because she is a woman. My DH's line of work is predominantly male, and HR will push for managers to hire a woman (or minority), even when they are not qualified for the position.

You are very right! An unqualified woman should not be paid for a position that she isn't qualified for. It's all about equality, not pushing down another person's qualifications in favor of making everyone else believe that a business is an equal-opportunity employer. I told another employer once that if they wanted me to do something I wasn't as qualified for (video-editing is not my forte yet, though I am working on it), I'd rather they pay someone else to do the job than me. They were great employers and wanted to pay me for more work because I always completed projects promptly and I loved working for them, but I'd never expect them to pay me for work I couldn't do.

 

[LBejaran]

I cook. The Princess cooked the first 25 years. This last almost 25 have been mine - started as a result of work schedules, and I discovered that I really like cooking. I open doors for her, help her with her coat, and help her to be seated when we eat out. Does that diminish either her or me? We think not. She has always been free spirited, assertive and sure of herself. This can be threatening both to other women and to men. I love it, and we have raised a strong minded/willed daughter. How you allow people to treat you is how you will be treated - male or female. Stereotypes no longer apply.

Personally, I think chivalry doesn't diminish anyone. It's just being polite. Some people will say that it diminishes a woman's value because she's not being allowed to do these things herself, but I cannot concur. What does diminish a woman's value is being told she has to do something because it's expected of her because she's a woman.

Mom can't cook. She knows how to make a few things (gorditas, excellent spanish rice, fideo, perfect over-easy eggs), but she doesn't make meals because she's not very good at it. Dad used to complain a lot and tell her things that were demeaning because she couldn't cook. It was one of those things that really angered me. Mom didn't fight back but she knew that if she needed to, she had a way to if she felt so inclined. Mom is the greatest woman, I think, because she knows that she can fight back but she chooses not to. Sinking to that level just to hurt another person is below her. Instead, she knows her value and is very aware that she doesn't have to prove herself to anyone. The only ones who matters are her children and the big guy in the sky.

 

[mom'sfolly]

Sometimes in a house hold division of labor is done by who hates the job less, or has less tolerance for X. Both my brother and sister work full time, as do their spouses. Both siblings do virtually all of the cleaning, because they can't tolerate the same level of mess, dirt and disorder as their spouses. I do most of the cleaning because I don't work outside the home (except for 15-20 volunteer hours a week). I don't love it, and I don't love having a dirty house, but I do have a higher tolerance level than either of my siblings, and lower than my family members.

In my home, I do most of the outdoor work, and most of the larger projects. This is because I enjoy it more than my husband does, and I am cheap. He does toilets, window screens, the dishwasher and lawn work. I cook, and I enjoy it. I also enjoy good food, so I fix more elaborate meals than my husband would. He deals with computer and electronic issues. I have neither the patience nor interest in them. I can dabble all day with my pond or garden but thirty seconds of not being able to get the computer to do what I want turns me into a screaming maniac.

As for courtesy, Sourland, it is never wasted. It is all about being a decent person. While it can be condensing to assume that someone needs help, offering is always polite. And being polite is the grease that makes society run more smoothly. Far too often, being nice in underrated.

Just for fun, here is an interesting exercise that I did with friends a long time ago...try to find a derogatory remark/name for a man that doesn't have some underlying sexual or scatalogical origin. Even the mildest "jerk" or "putz" is sexual in origin. Playing the same game with epithets for women gets you terms that refer to loose morals (usually prostitution) and emotionality. Shrew and skank come to mind.

This is shows some of the cultural weight we put on both men and women. Some of the other cultural issues show up everywhere from classrooms to car dealerships. The underlying assumptions that girls aren't good at math and science and boys are relucant readers, or the "sit down and be quiet" standards of a class room that gets far more boys than girls put on ADD meds are a coople of examples.

 

[Happy Chooks]

Sourland - I appreciate anyone that opens a door for me. It's just polite. And I've held doors open to men or those older than me. Common courtesy goes a long way IMO.