Best Way to Get Wheaten Brahmas?

[Alia]

I'm interested in starting a project to create wheaten Brahmas, even if someone has already done it. I was thinking of using either Buff Orpingtons or Black Sex Links, since both carry the wheaten gene... Supposedly.

Orpington Cons:

Too many genes to deal with, wouldn't see the plumage I want until F2s, no dark shanks (which I find I want)

Sex Link Cons:

Smaller bird, half of the F1 offspring will just be plain black, not broody (doesn't matter much since I'll be using an incubator anyway but I would still like to keep the potential)

Orpington Pros:

More largeness for the offspring, more variety of genes, Orp is supposedly broody too which hopefully wouldn't destroy the broodiness of the Brahma

Sex Link Pros:

Plumage I want as early as F1, more eggs, I kind of want to try raising Black Sex Links

I'm going to be using the Dark Brahma so I don't have to deal with the columbian gene erasing the wheaten pattern, which I will have to deal with anyway through the other parent bird.

Depending on what exactly Buff is (and no one seems to know; there is a lot of debate on it) I could get a huge array of colours from the Orpington, maybe more than would be expected, and maybe even including dun-type chocolates. I'm torn. I don't want to get sidetracked and yet I do.

I was also thinking of using Easter Eggers, if I can get a hold of a wheaten one. They're tiny little chickens, but importing the blue-egg genes to my project is probably worth the extra breeding back for type. I know they wouldn't be standard, but I wouldn't mind the dark shanks. I like the shank and beak colour of the Sex Link as well, but I doubt you can have a black beak on a wheaten bird.

 

[BGMatt]

Why not a Wheaten Marans? They're a little smaller but would only have to use them once or twice. Pea comb is dominant so no worries there. Color is already there. Feather legs are already there. Body feathering is not terribly off. Leg color is the issue (not sure why you'd want a dark leg, Brahmas have yellow legs/skin so this advice applies for proper leg color), but Yellow is recessive to other leg colors, so you'd be able to select for it rather easily, yellow to yellow should produce yellow.

 

[Alia]

It's true I would only have to use them once, since the wheaten would be dominant. I could get as much as half wheaten in F1s, then never use a pure Maran again.

The trouble is that there isn't much access to them and some of the reviews say they're mean. I managed to find Dark Brahmas being offered for sale at a (well sort of nearby) feed store and if I possibly can, using other things I can find easily. I just looked and found Wheaten Marans for sale for $12 apiece. The egg colour is intriguing, though. I wonder how much it would dilute in the F1s and I wonder how easy it would be to add just that one extra priority and breed for it. I might actually shell out the $50 to get five of them.

 

[Alia]

Maybe I need to use Sex Links after all. I just fell in absolute love with the leaky heterozygous E-Black on a Brahma. (At least I THINK that is what this is.)

This is the result of my partridge hen with an apparently experimental gold-laced cock (didn´t quite have the pattern), because they produced nearly all blacks and a few buffs. She´s a lovely placid bird, in fact they all are.

Can you imagine if it leaked silver and she had that beautiful burnished face, only it looked pewter instead of bronzy?

 

[BGMatt]

That's closer to a Brown Red than a Wheaten...so a crow wing pattern. Sex links are a mess because they don't breed true. I'd never use them on a color project. I'm not experienced enough color genetics wise to advise you on how to introduce that pattern to a brahma. Look up BYC user Big medicine, he's done more color work with brahmas than anyone I know.

 

[livininbrazil]

Maybe I need to use Sex Links after all. I just fell in absolute love with the leaky heterozygous E-Black on a Brahma. (At least I THINK that is what this is.)


Can you imagine if it leaked silver and she had that beautiful burnished face, only it looked pewter instead of bronzy?

Hi alia. Just to say, she´s not a sex-link. Both males and females are this colouring, and sometimes I´ll get buffs, both sexes.
I have a light cockerel that I´ve just bought that I´ll pu with her and her identical sister, and I´ll see what happens...maybe sex-link, but maybe have some interesting colours.
I´m limited on my understanding of these things, beyond the basics.

That's closer to a Brown Red than a Wheaten...so a crow wing pattern. Sex links are a mess because they don't breed true. I'd never use them on a color project. I'm not experienced enough color genetics wise to advise you on how to introduce that pattern to a brahma. Look up BYC user Big medicine, he's done more color work with brahmas than anyone I know.

I agree she´s not like a wheaten, and I don´t understand what a brown-red is. To me, she´s black with red leakage. But then I´m not doing any colour projects, just like to see the pretty colours that are produced sometimes, like this young cockerel:

And here´s a male version of her, just a baby yet.

 

[MNKris]

Wheaten Marans are definitely not normally mean. I have had them for 15+ years and they are annoyingly friendly and nice pets for kids. There are some Black Copper roosters that can get a little rank, but mean wheaten roosters are far and few between.

 

[Alia]

Hi alia. Just to say, she´s not a sex-link. Both males and females are this colouring, and sometimes I´ll get buffs, both sexes.

I agree she couldn't possibly be a sex-link. It just looks to me that she's het for all-black, which is what gives female sex-links their head colour and black bodies. Black with red leakage, as you said. At least, that is my understanding about being het for all-black; that it does that. I ultimately want wheatens but using a sex-link should give me something like her as an intermediate, and hey, intermediates are half the fun.

I'm still torn though, especially seeing the kind of eggs Marans produce. And getting all wheatens in the F1s is definitely a draw. Only question is how much I'm willing to pay for one.

 

[livininbrazil]

I agree she couldn't possibly be a sex-link. It just looks to me that she's het for all-black, which is what gives female sex-links their head colour and black bodies. Black with red leakage, as you said. At least, that is my understanding about being het for all-black; that it does that. I ultimately want wheatens but using a sex-link should give me something like her as an intermediate, and hey, intermediates are half the fun.

I'm still torn though, especially seeing the kind of eggs Marans produce. And getting all wheatens in the F1s is definitely a draw. Only question is how much I'm willing to pay for one.

I needed to introduce new blood to my Brahmas, but so many so-called Brahmas around here are crossed, and I thought for months about buying a decent one, but they´re so expensive. Well, I bought one, the light that I said about. I´ve no idea what´ll come out of this, now, but it´ll be fun...Like buying a maran!

 

[nicalandia]

Quote:
Wheaten is not completely Dominant over eb(brown, which is waht dark brahmas are, also Wyandottes are eb brown its co-dominant, meaning it will show some of the back/head Stripes you see on normal eb chicks, but much Diluted, the rest of the body will be of a cream color, they will Definitely look different than pure Wheaten and pure eb/eb chicks.. so you will be able to pic them appart from those two e alleles(eWh/eWh or eb/eb) Dominant wheaten was name that way not because it was dominant over e+ or eb but because there was already a recessive wheaten being studied, which is described as ey/ey and its recessive to any and all e allels,... "Dominant" Wheate(eWh) is co dominant and sometimes recessive to e+ and eb, its recessive to Extended Black E and Most of the time ER/ER birchen, Tim Adkerson has shown pics of ER/eWh chicks that looks as intermediate between the two alleles, and Dr. Ron Okimoto has said that on some genetic backgrounds ER can even act as recessive to it... But ist very unlikely to happen to 99% of people.. so Wheaten Marans is your best Bet, all of the F1s will eWh/eb and all of the Males will be S/s+ and depending on the cross you make(Dark B Male over Wheaten maran Female, OR Wheaten maran Males over Dark B females) your females will vary, from gold pullets(if whaten maran is used) to Silver Pullets(if Dark Brahma male is used) Do you want to create Gold Wheaten birds(like Wheaten marans) or do you want to create Silver Wheaten birds? the Females will look almost the same but the silver wheaten females will have a Salmon color to it as in "Salmon" Faverolle pullets, the males will look the same as dark brahmas with less stippling