Best way to introduce buff color into a flock? (New chicken breed)

[Alicia Manolas]

I went back outside to take a picture of the rest of the "wild type" flock. I know that their genetics are probably all over the place as the flock they came from had all the long tails, (Yokos, Phoenix, Cubalaya and sumatras), together with some amerucanas.

Here's a photo of the 4 chicks that hatched from the blue eggs. The 4 on the left.

And a photo of what the others look like now

The blue male has some leakage coming out.

I'm all ears for any suggestions btw

The earlier photo of the Dark legged Partridge colouration hen with the willow green legs, (Ive circled her in blue) is definitely your strongest, judging colour wise, show quality colour. You can create a Dark legged Partridge male by pairing her with the light legged cock and playing the numbers game, you will get more dark legs than light, then breed dark male legged offspring back to her, and to dark legged offspring next gen, to get your foundation line of Dark leggeds going.

To get your Light Legged Partridges AND your Black Breasted Reds and Wheatens lines both going, take the Light Legged Partridge Hen with the not as high quality coat colour but fantastic legs (circled in purple), and put her in with the yellow leg - Light Legged Black Red, cock.

Half the chicks will be a good foundation line start of Light Legged Partridges and the other half, depending on the roosters genetic purity, should come out Blackred cocks & Black Tail Wheaten hens.

As to Blues, if you are having trouble with breeding blue, ANYTHING blue together, of the same breed, will keep the genes going, even if it's a Self Blue paired with a Blue Red, you can always split them up later.

With regards to blue eggs, having a pet project with them myself, creating a breed, I wish I'd had your American option of just paying $25 bucks and getting immediate answers from a good laboratory! I'd not breed out nearly so many generations if I could have used science and $25 to save ten times that in feed, time, effort, energy, cagespace... the usual blood, sweat and tears!

Long tails and Sumatrans are still so exceedingly rare and expensive here in Australia, sigh.

Question... why the white rooster?

 

[Enigmatic Gale]

That a lot of great information, thank you for your insight

The white rooster and hen are Schijndelaar's, which to my knowledge is the onñy recognized long tailed blue/green egg layers. The were developed from Sumatras and there was a local breeder selling them at the beginning of the project. I'm still on the fence about using them because of the head crest and the colors that can "hide" under white. Although it should be dominat white as they were developed from leghorns. I'll include the article, you'll have to translate it though.

https://www.levendehave.nl/dierenwikis/algemeen/schijndelaar

 

[Alicia Manolas]

Thank you! What language is that do you know? My Google-translate isnt picking it up and wants me to manual input the Translate From language, lol!

That a lot of great information, thank you for your insight

The white rooster and hen are Schijndelaar's, which to my knowledge is the onñy recognized long tailed blue/green egg layers. The were developed from Sumatras and there was a local breeder selling them at the beginning of the project. I'm still on the fence about using them because of the head crest and the colors that can "hide" under white. Although it should be dominat white as they were developed from leghorns. I'll include the article, you'll have to translate it though.

https://www.levendehave.nl/dierenwikis/algemeen/schijndelaar

 

[Alicia Manolas]

Thank you! What language is that do you know? My Google-translate isnt picking it up and wants me to manual input the Translate From language, lol!

Dutch! Found it!!

 

[Alicia Manolas]

(Translation of Article mentioned above...)

SCHIJNDELAAR

The Schijndelaar received official recognition in 2001 from the then NHDB and is therefore the newest Dutch chicken breed and also the only recognized Dutch chicken breed, which lays green eggs.
Breed characteristics
The Schijndelaar was developed in the Netherlands from the Auracana, Sumatra, Brabants Boerenhoen and Leghorn among others. It is a graceful medium-sized pheasant-like fowl that lays blue to olive green eggs.
The animal has a fairly long body, a small head with a red face and a slightly rounded upper head. The small, irregular pea comb, is low on the head and fine in texture. The crest is rather small, without a skull lump.
The beak is firm, slightly curved, rather short and light yellow to yellow in color. The chin lobes are small and red, the ear lobes are small, red, rather short and fine in tissue. The eyes are large, lively and yellow in color.
The neck is medium length. The back medium length, slightly sloping and broad between the shoulders. The chest is rounded and carried somewhat high. Wings are powerful, and carried well connected. The shoulders are broad and rounded. The tail is richly feathered and carried approximately horizontally. The abdomen is moderately developed, the thighs are quite powerful, ample in length and tightly feathered. Treadbones and toes are straight, medium length and finely built with four strong, well-spread toes and light yellow to yellow in color. The soles of the feet are also light yellow to yellow. The feathering is full, smooth to the touch and white in color. Except for secondary sexual characteristics, there are no significant differences between rooster and hen.
Serious faults are very large chin lobes; distinct white ear lobes; egg laying, without green precipitation in the shell.
Establishment of the Schijndelaar
The idea to develop a new breed of chicken originated in the late 70s at the Eerste Schijndelse Kleindieren Vereniging (ESKV). Veterinarian Ruud Kaasenbrood tried to make clear to colleague breeders not only how the genetics could be used to perfect their breeds, but especially that it should be possible to breed a whole new breed. A number of breed characteristics were drawn up. For example, the animal was to have a rather small crest with few head ornaments, the long tail was to carry them approximately horizontally, the eggs were to be green. Kaasenbrood started breeding a Schijndelaar a few years later.
For the green egg he bought a trio of Auracanas at the Intershow. This consisted of a blue partridge cock and two wheat-colored hens. All three had a bulbous tail and the characteristic ear exercises.
The hens never laid fertilized eggs, even when they were partnered with a rooster with a normal tail. The cockerel on the other hand did an excellent job on the Sumatra hens that were already present.
For the crest, a pair of Brabant farmyard hens sourced from Ger van de Oetelaar were used. To get some more size in the hens, the crossbreeds were lent to Toon de Graaf and his Australian cock for a few weeks. The fertilized green eggs were hatched. From this hatchling, Kaasenbrood then worked for years towards a final product by crossbreeding among themselves. He paired the gracefulness of the Sumatra with the utility of the barnyard rooster and the hardiness and green egg of the Auracana.
The use of a bulbous tailed Auracana cock to breed in the predisposition for green eggs leads to an overall predisposition for a short bulbous tail within the breed. For generations this will show its influence within the breed with a long full tail.
The traits of the Sumatra are very dominantly embedded in the breed. Kaasenbrood noticed this from the beginning of the crossbreeding. Partly because of this, crossbreeding with this Sumatra quite quickly produced some chickens that already somewhat resembled the final target chicken. Nevertheless, the breeder selected very strictly from the beginning. In the first years, of the hundred chicks raised, only four or five were suitable to continue. After a few years of breeding, Kaasenbrood considered the results sufficient to show the first specimens with their green eggs at a club show. From then on enthusiasm grew among several ESKV members and the breeding of the Schijndelaar was continued by several breeders.
Kaasenbrood mentions Harrie van de Oetelaar who bred Schijndelaars from the beginning until 2000. It was Van den Oetelaar who in the early nineties some leghorns inbreeding to increase egg production. This was also the reason for the emergence of dominant white Schijndelaars. In the beginning the Schijndelaar was only bred in the colors black and blue.
Green eggs
The green egg is a characteristic that can only be observed in animals that lay. So hens. To determine the predisposition for green eggs in roosters, the desired characteristics had to be anchored and the breeding process had to be adjusted.


(There is a little bit more in the article but I hit the translation size limit.)

 

[Enigmatic Gale]

(Translation of Article mentioned above...)

SCHIJNDELAAR

The Schijndelaar received official recognition in 2001 from the then NHDB and is therefore the newest Dutch chicken breed and also the only recognized Dutch chicken breed, which lays green eggs.
Breed characteristics
The Schijndelaar was developed in the Netherlands from the Auracana, Sumatra, Brabants Boerenhoen and Leghorn among others. It is a graceful medium-sized pheasant-like fowl that lays blue to olive green eggs.
The animal has a fairly long body, a small head with a red face and a slightly rounded upper head. The small, irregular pea comb, is low on the head and fine in texture. The crest is rather small, without a skull lump.
The beak is firm, slightly curved, rather short and light yellow to yellow in color. The chin lobes are small and red, the ear lobes are small, red, rather short and fine in tissue. The eyes are large, lively and yellow in color.
The neck is medium length. The back medium length, slightly sloping and broad between the shoulders. The chest is rounded and carried somewhat high. Wings are powerful, and carried well connected. The shoulders are broad and rounded. The tail is richly feathered and carried approximately horizontally. The abdomen is moderately developed, the thighs are quite powerful, ample in length and tightly feathered. Treadbones and toes are straight, medium length and finely built with four strong, well-spread toes and light yellow to yellow in color. The soles of the feet are also light yellow to yellow. The feathering is full, smooth to the touch and white in color. Except for secondary sexual characteristics, there are no significant differences between rooster and hen.
Serious faults are very large chin lobes; distinct white ear lobes; egg laying, without green precipitation in the shell.
Establishment of the Schijndelaar
The idea to develop a new breed of chicken originated in the late 70s at the Eerste Schijndelse Kleindieren Vereniging (ESKV). Veterinarian Ruud Kaasenbrood tried to make clear to colleague breeders not only how the genetics could be used to perfect their breeds, but especially that it should be possible to breed a whole new breed. A number of breed characteristics were drawn up. For example, the animal was to have a rather small crest with few head ornaments, the long tail was to carry them approximately horizontally, the eggs were to be green. Kaasenbrood started breeding a Schijndelaar a few years later.
For the green egg he bought a trio of Auracanas at the Intershow. This consisted of a blue partridge cock and two wheat-colored hens. All three had a bulbous tail and the characteristic ear exercises.
The hens never laid fertilized eggs, even when they were partnered with a rooster with a normal tail. The cockerel on the other hand did an excellent job on the Sumatra hens that were already present.
For the crest, a pair of Brabant farmyard hens sourced from Ger van de Oetelaar were used. To get some more size in the hens, the crossbreeds were lent to Toon de Graaf and his Australian cock for a few weeks. The fertilized green eggs were hatched. From this hatchling, Kaasenbrood then worked for years towards a final product by crossbreeding among themselves. He paired the gracefulness of the Sumatra with the utility of the barnyard rooster and the hardiness and green egg of the Auracana.
The use of a bulbous tailed Auracana cock to breed in the predisposition for green eggs leads to an overall predisposition for a short bulbous tail within the breed. For generations this will show its influence within the breed with a long full tail.
The traits of the Sumatra are very dominantly embedded in the breed. Kaasenbrood noticed this from the beginning of the crossbreeding. Partly because of this, crossbreeding with this Sumatra quite quickly produced some chickens that already somewhat resembled the final target chicken. Nevertheless, the breeder selected very strictly from the beginning. In the first years, of the hundred chicks raised, only four or five were suitable to continue. After a few years of breeding, Kaasenbrood considered the results sufficient to show the first specimens with their green eggs at a club show. From then on enthusiasm grew among several ESKV members and the breeding of the Schijndelaar was continued by several breeders.
Kaasenbrood mentions Harrie van de Oetelaar who bred Schijndelaars from the beginning until 2000. It was Van den Oetelaar who in the early nineties some leghorns inbreeding to increase egg production. This was also the reason for the emergence of dominant white Schijndelaars. In the beginning the Schijndelaar was only bred in the colors black and blue.
Green eggs
The green egg is a characteristic that can only be observed in animals that lay. So hens. To determine the predisposition for green eggs in roosters, the desired characteristics had to be anchored and the breeding process had to be adjusted.


(There is a little bit more in the article but I hit the translation size limit.)

The traits that stood out were the increase egg production, longish tail and the blue egg gene.

I thought it might be a good fit for the project, I just wish they didn't have the crest lol

 

[Enigmatic Gale]

There is a genetic test available for the blue egg gene (it's relatively new.)

It's not particularly cheap, but for a rooster it might be cheaper to test him than to raise a bunch of his daughters to see what color eggs they lay.

https://orders.iqbirdtesting.com/product/blue-egg-gene-with-feathers-sample/

NatJ, I must thank you a million times over! You have saved us from wasting time/money/effort/space on a bird that would not have produced a line of blue egg laying birds.

We went ahead and did the blue egg gene test on Shinji and the wheaten long tail, which we called Cornilius, and here are the results...

 

[NatJ]

NatJ, I must thank you a million times over! You have saved us from wasting time/money/effort/space on a bird that would not have produced a line of blue egg laying birds.

We went ahead and did the blue egg gene test on Shinji and the wheaten long tail, which we called Cornilius, and here are the results...

I'm glad it was helpful

Yes, knowing that one is homozygous for blue egg, and the other is homzygous for NOT blue egg, can definitely make a difference to your breeding program!

Those are fast results, too-- less than a week since I mentioned it, and you've already got your answer. I wonder if they are always that fast, or if they have busy seasons and slow seasons?

 

[Enigmatic Gale]

I'm glad it was helpful

Yes, knowing that one is homozygous for blue egg, and the other is homzygous for NOT blue egg, can definitely make a difference to your breeding program!

Those are fast results, too-- less than a week since I mentioned it, and you've already got your answer. I wonder if they are always that fast, or if they have busy seasons and slow seasons?

It was incredibly fast! I sent in the samples on mid day Tuesday, got a confirmation email on Thursday and had the results yesterday afternoon. I didn’t pay expedited shipping or anything. They give you the option on buying their envelope or shipping it to them yourself, which is free. Their envelope cost $11 I believe.

The test in itself is an excellent value, $25 flat

 

[Enigmatic Gale]

My wife and I came across this photo on Instagram and we were wondering how we’d achieve this color?

Notice how the tail remains blackish, I thought that dominate white was responsible for such a light color. Also has some penciling? Dilute and cream genes?

Either way, amazing bird!