Breda Fowl thread

[Jon-o]

Probably a stupid question but what’s a breda

 

[Sylvester017]

THANK YOU for all the great info. I definitely prefer to visit and pick up in person, so as long as I am ok with mottled (which I am) sounds like RFR still tops my list of places to contact. Thanks again!

I really hope RFR still raises the Mottleds. I know they have limited breeds of chickens they work with and seems like they change out one of their project breeds every couple years. Let us know if you get some RFR Breda. Late winter/very early Spring is the best time to put in orders for chicks.

It's a sad reality but be prepared for chick mortality. I got 3 Dominique chicks last summer to allow for chick mortality (I really wanted only one chick) and the little buggers ALL survived! But that's ok -- it just means I'll have to delay a year or so before I can add a Breda. I stagger the ages of my hens so that the whole flock doesn't get old all at the same time so I will always have some laying girls left each year. My oldest hen is 7 yrs old and hasn't layed an egg for 2 yrs but she's useful as a top hen teaching the younger pullets the ropes about backyard free-ranging. The Cooper's Hawk visits our backyard a couple times a week and last time he banged himself up flying into the dog kennel cage wall where the girls took shelter.

A sturdy coop/shelter is really worth it, plus we have 5 large doghouses, low lean-to shelters, bench, lawn furniture, pop-up canopy, plants, a composter, and an old wheelbarrow for the hens to snooze/hide under from flying predators (usually Cooper's Hawks). When the neighborhood Crow murder flies by, they chase the Cooper's out and the Crows don't bother our hens. If we had chicks the Crows might be tempted but they don't bother our adult hens. I love it when the Crows fly by -- my hens are accustomed to the cawing of the Crows and aren't bothered when they fly by. Crows are like guardian flock dogs in the sky!

 

[Sylvester017]

Probably a stupid question but what’s a breda

There are no stupid questions -- only ones that don't get asked LOL!
Here are websites that have a nice background history in a nutshell about the Breda chicken plus photo gallery pages too.

https://voupex.wixsite.com/chickendanzfarm/breed-info
https://voupex.wixsite.com/chickendanzfarm/breed-info
http://www.feathersite.com/Poultry/CGA/Breda/BRKBreda.html

Breda are actually a very old Colonial breed and was as common as Dominiques were on Colonial farmsteads. The Breda recently were recreated in the Netherlands and the Blue/Black/Splash variety got imported into the USA about a decade ago through Greenfire Farms who made it their mission to expose us to rare and unusual chicken breeds from around the world.

 

[Sylvester017]

@GaryDean26 Thank you so much for answering me. Sounds like you went through the sniffles (MS/MG) with your BBS. How great that you have a healthy Breda hen!

You weren't alone experiencing respiratory issues. Every Breda breeder I've dialogued with has gone through the same thing -- at least w/ their BBS. But I got used to it with the Blue Breda. Every Blue juvenile shipped to me had respiratory issues in spite of the seller making sure there were no "sniffles" but I found the BBS notorious for respiratory issues and just accepted it. Shipping stresses Breda and if they didn't have respiratory issues, they'd develop coccidia, and one seller swore their birds were wormed but one Breda arrived w/ worms -- Breda are just too small a gene pool for now and without some new imported lines we'll have to cross-breed some other breed to increase hardiness into the existing USA flocks. Since the AI epidemic a couple years ago in the Midwest, chicken imports have gotten way more restrictive so new Breda lines seem improbable for now.

My vet easily treated w/ Baytril medication and my BBS Breda never had another respiratory episode. My Cuckoo Breda (who I understand were crossed possibly w/ Cuckoo Marans or Malines to get a Cuckoo variety Breda) has been the only Breda variety that never had respiratory issues and she has huge nostrils which many breeders suggested is a contributing factor to sniffles -- but not this Cuckoo! I am just so thankful to have a Breda live this long so far and in decent health.

My problem was never with respiratory, worms, or coccidia issues which are all treatable -- my issue was with leukosis in a couple young juveniles shipped to me for which there is no vaccine or "cure" -- the little darlings just wasted away getting thinner and thinner and never made it to POL. Breda have such low immunity/resistance (at least the BBS seem to) so I'm happy that Breda lovers are researching some viable breeds to cross w/ the BBS to increase hardiness and disease resistance. A major project but so worth it to keep this fantastic breed around. The only question is what breed(s) to select for cross-breeding since the Breda type is so unique and would take a lot of back breeding to return to the proper body type. Breeds like Marans, Brahma, Fayoumi (naturally resistant to leukosis or Marek's), Langshan, even Totleger have been suggested. I remembered your Andalusia breeding book and that's why I asked if you had ever crossed an Andalusian w/your BBS Breda to increase Breda hardiness. Breeding projects cycle through a LOT of birds to get a desired result. Wish I could breed but I'm too old, don't have space, and not zoned for roos.

Another problem is some BBS drop over dead for no apparent reason before they reach age two. My 1-1/2 yr old Blue hen began laying as a pullet for 10+ consecutive months without stop. Too much stress for a lightweight hen so when the heatwave hit we lost her due to low immunity. She was fine bouncing out of the coop in the morning but before noon she unexpectedly passed away during her mid-day snooze. In hindsight I should've suspected not all was ok when her last two eggs were soft-shell! My vet has stressed vitamins, vitamins, vitamins, every time we make a visit to him so I've increased supplementation for all the flock and for several years used organic feeds and produce.

During molt, egg-laying, weather changes, etc, the hens are especially vulnerable to stress and I make sure to give extra doses of liquid vitamins as I can't count on sick or lethargic molting hens to have much appetite to ingest their feed vitamins. Molting takes a lot out of a hen -- she gets reclusive, standoffish, lethargic, loses her appetite, and has little interest in foraging or keeping up with the flock. Our Silkie succumbed to Fowl Pox during her molt, her resistance was low, when none of the other chickens contracted FP. Thanks to the vet the Silkie pulled through with just the dry pox and he had some ophthalmic antibiotic ointment to use on her eye crusts to prevent eye irritation. She's our oldest 7 yr old chicken and top hen now.

I would never want to move away just because of the fabulous veterinarian I have -- he used to work in the poultry industry and has such confidence in diagnosing and treating my chickens' ailments. The mountain rangers bring him injured or sick deer, foxes, owls, lizards, tortoises, etc. He keeps a disabled Starling in his office because it can't be released. He once hatched turtle eggs in an incubator. He takes pictures of my Silkies whenever I take one to his hospital. Vets are nice people but he's extra special around my chickens.

TY again for your kind input!

 

[luckyplucky]

I really hope RFR still raises the Mottleds. I know they have limited breeds of chickens they work with and seems like they change out one of their project breeds every couple years. Let us know if you get some RFR Breda. Late winter/very early Spring is the best time to put in orders for chicks.

It's a sad reality but be prepared for chick mortality. I got 3 Dominique chicks last summer to allow for chick mortality (I really wanted only one chick) and the little buggers ALL survived! But that's ok -- it just means I'll have to delay a year or so before I can add a Breda. I stagger the ages of my hens so that the whole flock doesn't get old all at the same time so I will always have some laying girls left each year. My oldest hen is 7 yrs old and hasn't layed an egg for 2 yrs but she's useful as a top hen teaching the younger pullets the ropes about backyard free-ranging. The Cooper's Hawk visits our backyard a couple times a week and last time he banged himself up flying into the dog kennel cage wall where the girls took shelter.

View attachment 1244995

A sturdy coop/shelter is really worth it, plus we have 5 large doghouses, low lean-to shelters, bench, lawn furniture, pop-up canopy, plants, a composter, and an old wheelbarrow for the hens to snooze/hide under from flying predators (usually Cooper's Hawks). When the neighborhood Crow murder flies by, they chase the Cooper's out and the Crows don't bother our hens. If we had chicks the Crows might be tempted but they don't bother our adult hens. I love it when the Crows fly by -- my hens are accustomed to the cawing of the Crows and aren't bothered when they fly by. Crows are like guardian flock dogs in the sky!

Good to know about the crows, we have lots of them here so now I can welcome their presence more than I used to! We have only had one hawk attack from above, ironically the hawk went for our biggest heaviest gal at the time and was unsuccessful. We've got a pretty good setup, while all the gals (and our 2 bantam roos) have free range of the yard they have the coop, trees, and shrubs that they hide under when needed.

 

[critterbug]

So how many plan on hatching a bunch of breda this spring? I didn't hatch any last year. This year every egg to the incubator. Only problem is most of my males are yucky. To much red in the lobe.

 

[boskelli1571]

I plan on it My mottled should be ready to go by then and I hope to get a black rooster for my Breda hens (3 blue, 1 splash & 1 black).
I do need to get the NPIP folks here so they can test all for LL.
Like Sylvester I watched my last batch drop one by one, so sad.

 

[GaryDean26]

@GaryDean26 Thank you so much for answering me. Sounds like you went through the sniffles (MS/MG) with your BBS. How great that you have a healthy Breda hen!

We had the whole Property get hit with MS the year we did out group of 40 Breda (that was our biggest group of Breda). It is possible that we got the MS from a 5 month old Blue Breda pullet we brought in from another farm in our effort to build a legitimate Breda Breeding line. Most breeds had about 40-60% show signs of MS. We were swift to cull out everyone that showed signs. The Breda however had all but 2-3 cockerels show signs of MS so we got rid of the entire group. We never had signs of MS in the breeding pair though, but the juveniles. We started all of our flocks completely over the following year from chicks that we too to Oklahoma with us. None of those birds ever were in contact with any of the mature flock and we treated the hatching eggs with heat and strong antibiotics to clean up the MS. I think were were successful we haven't had any signs of respiratory illnesses since that time.

I read on the Dutch site that Cochins were often used to outcross Breda which caused problem with the egg color. My guess is that the Blue Breda line came from the UK. The Cuckoo and Mottle lines came from Holland via Canada. The Cuckoos were a show line so I would be surprised if there was any Cuckoo Marans or other recent crosses in them. I am sure they had some cross in them at some point in time before coming to the USA. Before I really started working on the Self Blue color my dream was to breed splash Breda Cockerels to Cuckoo hens so that I could get 100% self blue sex-linked Breda. Have anyone crossed the Blue Breda lines with the Cuckoo lines? If so what issues did you see with crossing the lines?

 

[GaryDean26]

I plan on it My mottled should be ready to go by then and I hope to get a black rooster for my Breda hens (3 blue, 1 splash & 1 black).
I do need to get the NPIP folks here so they can test all for LL.
Like Sylvester I watched my last batch drop one by one, so sad.

I don't know if others have experienced this or not, but every time I bring in a rare breed I have about 20% losses in the first year. After that I choose the strongest birds to breed and don't see many losses in the following years (unless something like MS/MG is introduced to the property). It seems like it takes some adaptation with them the first year.

 

[Sylvester017]

We had the whole Property get hit with MS the year we did out group of 40 Breda (that was our biggest group of Breda). It is possible that we got the MS from a 5 month old Blue Breda pullet we brought in from another farm in our effort to build a legitimate Breda Breeding line. Most breeds had about 40-60% show signs of MS. We were swift to cull out everyone that showed signs. The Breda however had all but 2-3 cockerels show signs of MS so we got rid of the entire group. We never had signs of MS in the breeding pair though, but the juveniles. We started all of our flocks completely over the following year from chicks that we too to Oklahoma with us. None of those birds ever were in contact with any of the mature flock and we treated the hatching eggs with heat and strong antibiotics to clean up the MS. I think were were successful we haven't had any signs of respiratory illnesses since that time.

I read on the Dutch site that Cochins were often used to outcross Breda which caused problem with the egg color. My guess is that the Blue Breda line came from the UK. The Cuckoo and Mottle lines came from Holland via Canada. The Cuckoos were a show line so I would be surprised if there was any Cuckoo Marans or other recent crosses in them. I am sure they had some cross in them at some point in time before coming to the USA. Before I really started working on the Self Blue color my dream was to breed splash Breda Cockerels to Cuckoo hens so that I could get 100% self blue sex-linked Breda. Have anyone crossed the Blue Breda lines with the Cuckoo lines? If so what issues did you see with crossing the lines?

Every BBS Breda juvenile I received from 3 different breeders from 3 different states had respiratory issues. After my first experience, I didn't hesitate to take subsequent shipments immediately to the vet for treatment right out of the shipping box if there was the slightest sneeze or wheeze! A visit to the vet with one initial treatment always cleared the BBS sniffles right up and never re-occurred. Only my Cuckoo Breda arrived with no respiratory issues and she has the biggest nostrils LOL!

Yes, MS/MG birds remain "carruers" of the virus but if the birds are upkept nutritionally I don't find a need to cull them -- just can't use them as breeders which apparently many Breda breeders weren't aware early-on so that now probably every BBS flock in the USA will test positive as "carriers" but Breda carriers with good resistance will not necessarily succumb to symptoms if they are kept in a healthy nutritional condition. I think that's where Waltz's Ark is coming from -- not vaccinating their birds -- in order to develop natural resistance but I have no idea how successful they've been. The one Breda cockerel they shipped to me had respiratory issues, worms, and coccidia and so did the APA Blue Ameraucana pullet they shipped to me plus the Ameraucana had Marek's and had to be put down at the vet. The Breda cockerel survived and never contracted Marek's symptoms but he was supposed to be a pullet order from Waltz's so we had to re-home him -- after a 7 months' order wait I wound up with no birds losing over half a year waiting for the 2 Waltz's birds.

So far I'm tremendously impressed with the Cuckoo Breda if our Cuckoo is any indication of the beauty and hardiness of the variety. I will try getting Blue Breda again in future but currently have my hands full with the maximum birds for my zone. Breda are supposed to lay white eggs - at least the BBS are white. But our Cuckoo lays light pink eggs so I know some cross-breeding ancestry, whether it was Cochin or whatever, the Cuckoo doesn't lay the bright white eggs like the BBS. But that's ok w/ me -- I'm just thrilled the Cuckoo is doing so well, and she's also the largest Breda we've had. She's taller than the BBS hens and lays larger eggs. She's not heavy, but definitely taller and such a pretty regal stance.

Your self-blue Breda project sounds great. I don't know that there are too many owners that have done such a large-scale effort yet -- they're all just trying to get the original Breda gene pool expanded and hardier but it's a bit difficult with the few available flocks at the moment. Too many owners early-on IMO were getting discouraged with the BBS line which seems the least hardy at the moment -- probably why so many past BBS owners have discontinued their lines but there's a comeback of people developing the BBS again -- hurray! I know Chicken Danz Farm has had BBS Breda about a decade now in addition to her numerous other poultry breeds and she raises Breda because she likes them so much. Invariably customers who come to purchase their common or show breeds from Chicken Danz, will go home with a couple Breda as well because they are so pretty (and very good layers as well). Chicken Danz has been diligently medically researching the problems with BBS Breda and has been doing selective breeding and culling to keep her hardiest breeders.

I am so enthralled with the Breda attributes and temperament and know this is a great bird to develop. Maryellen got a couple Silkie-Breda pullet crosses and they were adorable but she didn't keep them -- of course they were sprouting crests -- that's the only crosses I know of so far. Chicken Danz is entertaining thoughts of what cross-breed to use for gene diversity but the Breda is so unique it will take a lot of time to cross back to the original Breda type and temperament. I get so excited talking Breda, can you tell LOL!