BREEDING FOR PRODUCTION...EGGS AND OR MEAT.

[gjensen]

all pullet eggs and 2.0 ounces would be the average for the Australorp.
eleven pullets to select from and tail/back shape, both "bunny" and width could be the primary focus later in the spring after they are all laying.

2oz is large, so as pullets, they are in good shape.

My Catalana hens average 2.5 oz. The pullets reach 2oz early, and are at 2.2 the first spring. I do not care for them to be any larger. I have trouble getting the hen's eggs into the incubator trays now. The egg shape and quality is good, so it is only a matter of not setting the smallest eggs and avoiding off shaped eggs. Maintenance so to speak. I am not interested in jumbo sized eggs. They are not the size and length of real Minorcas.

 

[ronott1]

I just saw a post on the "black Swedish chicken thread" where someone asked if there was a standard yet. Answer was to breed as black as possible.

That is not a standard it is a color. There needs to be shape, weight, tail height, color of eggs and etc.

Also, no production is involved in breeding to a color. Of course the same thing happens in a lot of breeds now. Color is only one part of a standard. When and if a real standard comes out, Guaranteed there will be major faults that do not involve color.

 

[ocap]

2oz is large, so as pullets, they are in good shape.

My Catalana hens average 2.5 oz. The pullets reach 2oz early, and are at 2.2 the first spring. I do not care for them to be any larger. I have trouble getting the hen's eggs into the incubator trays now. The egg shape and quality is good, so it is only a matter of not setting the smallest eggs and avoiding off shaped eggs. Maintenance so to speak. I am not interested in jumbo sized eggs. They are not the size and length of real Minorcas.

good news about egg weight.

now to pick out the best two pullets and hatch from them only, might do that in April. My australorp line is fairly uniform but I can "see" differences. The Brahma pullets all look the same because I was only able to find one pullet in 2013 and they are all her daughters from the same male. I need better weather so I can sit by the pen and enjoy the culling process.

 

[Beer can]

I just saw a post on the "black Swedish chicken thread" where someone asked if there was a standard yet. Answer was to breed as black as possible.

That is not a standard it is a color. There needs to be shape, weight, tail height, color of eggs and etc.

Also, no production is involved in breeding to a color. Of course the same thing happens in a lot of breeds now. Color is only one part of a standard. When and if a real standard comes out, Guaranteed there will be major faults that do not involve color.

The woman I'm getting my crosses from also has pure Cemani. She mentioned this, black is all they care about, black toe nails, tounge, heavy culling, no breed standards. She said she thinks its a big mistake.
Sounds to me like what breeders did to the black Spanish, breeding for a exaggerated white face, from what I heard they originally were a good layer of large eggs and hardy, now their neither.

 

[dfr1973]

I need better weather so I can sit by the pen and enjoy the culling process.

I was just out watching my pullets from Ideal ... there are three I have had my eye on, and someone in the tractor found a lizard perhaps (hard to tell what it started as before they turned it into a rugby ball) and two of the three I've been watching were all over that and in the thick of the Calvin-ball game, taking the morsel from several of the larger red broiler pullets and a couple suspected cockerels. I have also seen them jumping for bugs in the air. I like to see chicks trying to hustle some grub on the side - along with self-supplementing their feed, it is highly entertaining.

 

[DesertChic]

I was never one to get to worked up over personality. I only cared about what they did. That is still the most important part to me, but I have changed a bit in my old age.

My NHs have always been extraordinarily easy to work with. Active enough, but what many would call calm. They have been a joy to manage. Easy to manage is relevant, but I can't stand roost potatoes. LOL I have had a few of those along the way.

My Catalanas have set the bar high for me. I really like the darned things. I did not realize how smitten I would become by them. I picked them up to be a side project, and now they are the focus. I was thrilled with how productive of layers they were, but what has sold me as much was their "personalities". I never thought I would say that.
They are active and assertive. I pictured a more active bird, given the class. I did not picture them being as bold as they are. They are not particularly flighty, because they are not nervous. There has been a few exceptions, but they did not last long. I have not kept any that were especially prone to panic.
They are sharp. I swear they are smarter than the average bird. They pick up on things faster than any other bird that I have had. It is hard to describe, but they have a way about them that I like. They are all business. The game breeds are like that, and you would think they had some in their background.

This does present a few challenges along the way. They do not take to newcomers well. I have to be more thoughtful about how I integrate them after I break them up. A cockerel has to be fully and mentally mature before I introduce one to a couple hens. Otherwise, the hens will fight him (and win). Once he is mentally mature enough, he will assert himself.
Their little social hierarchy is a little more complex. Once it is established, it takes a little more effort on my part, or patience to make a change. You cannot isolate a male once he has been with a group of females. He would lose weight. I do ok, because I try to let them be chickens, and keep a female with him. Or at the least make sure he can see them, or even where the females can approach the cage. This keeps them "mentally fit". They need stimulus. They are also only broke up, during my short breeding season which is about 4-6wks.

For a free range general purpose egg flock, they would be hard to beat. They would not be suited for close confinement. They would survive, and manage, but they need room to be what they are. They cannot be appreciated cooped up in a coop all of the time. Silkies and Cochins would be a better choice. I think that is the case for their entire class. It would be a shame to know they were cooped in a small coop all of the time, and I would not part with any that would be. I ask people that are getting cull layers from me if they will have plenty of room, and be let out regularly. If they have that, they will tolerate most challenges. They are far from being high maintenance. They just need room to be what they are. Going by commercial recommendations for space would not be enough.

In all seriousness, if you haven't written a review on here about the Catalanas then you should, and you should include most if not all of what you've said here about them. This is EXACTLY the kind of information that someone like myself looks for in a chicken breed review. Yes, the statistics about average weight and age to maturity, size and amount of egg laying, etc. are all important, but the information you supplied about personality and habits is equally important to many of us looking to keep a small flock for our personal enjoyment. Just my opinion....

 

[holm25]

Here is the roo I am going to be using!!

 

[Heron's Nest Farm]

Here is the roo I am going to be using!!

WOW!!!!! Gorgeous roo. Don't you just love roos? So luxurious in their coloring. Speaking of Roos...

I have a dilemma: I have narrowed my Olive Egger roo selection down to two boys.I need your thoughts

Roo 1: Great Cuckoo MAran markings- this is where I hope to get the dark brown for that really olive egg. Early to mature. He is already mating with the other hens. A bit of a small frame though. Also, he is pretty aggressive. Actually a bit of a terror, but I do need to cull some boys from the pen...

Roo 2: Large and boxier. Markings aren't very impressive. Is now mature just 2 weeks behind his counterpart. Much nicer and seems to get along with everyone. I think this would yield larger hens therefore bigger eggs. Really the size difference is very noticeable.

Both from same X of cucloo maran and americana. My goal is egg production and of course color.

Should I nail color first or production? Thoughts on choice? Help me out here seasoned breeders.

 

[gjensen]

In all seriousness, if you haven't written a review on here about the Catalanas then you should, and you should include most if not all of what you've said here about them. This is EXACTLY the kind of information that someone like myself looks for in a chicken breed review. Yes, the statistics about average weight and age to maturity, size and amount of egg laying, etc. are all important, but the information you supplied about personality and habits is equally important to many of us looking to keep a small flock for our personal enjoyment. Just my opinion....

I did, but at this point, there really isn't any to be had so it doesn't really matter. A couple hatcheries carry them, but that is not really what they are, so I do not count them. I am not selling any.

 

[gjensen]

WOW!!!!! Gorgeous roo. Don't you just love roos? So luxurious in their coloring. Speaking of Roos...

I have a dilemma: I have narrowed my Olive Egger roo selection down to two boys.I need your thoughts

Roo 1: Great Cuckoo MAran markings- this is where I hope to get the dark brown for that really olive egg. Early to mature. He is already mating with the other hens. A bit of a small frame though. Also, he is pretty aggressive. Actually a bit of a terror, but I do need to cull some boys from the pen...

Roo 2: Large and boxier. Markings aren't very impressive. Is now mature just 2 weeks behind his counterpart. Much nicer and seems to get along with everyone. I think this would yield larger hens therefore bigger eggs. Really the size difference is very noticeable.

Both from same X of cucloo maran and americana. My goal is egg production and of course color.

Should I nail color first or production? Thoughts on choice? Help me out here seasoned breeders.

I do not know what a roo is. It sounds like you are referring to cockerels. LOL.

I am no seasoned breeder.

I do not know what "pretty aggressive" is either. That could mean anything from vigorous to a man fighter. If the later, chop his head off. They are not worth messing with. Regardless of all of the amateur theories (I have heard a lot and smiled), and 'behavior modifications", the bird would have a few "screws loose", and the characteristic is highly heritable. Breeding one is producing more like him.

Really, I do not see where it matters (unless the one is a man fighter). It sounds like an experimental cross to make layers of olive colored eggs. The requirement is a bird from a good dark egg laying strain x a good blue egg laying strain. There is no standard for type or color except your own. You cannot visually tell which would produce better layers that laid bigger or more eggs. To know that would be to prove them by their offspring.

If you are considering trying to breed cuckoo Marans also (which is not clear), then good Marans type should be your goal. Cuckoo is not a difficult color, and could be worked on along the way.

You are the one having to deal with them, and it sounds like you will enjoy the second bird the most.