Buff Orpington pullet with huge swollen thigh on Left leg- Help/advice needed!

[JoyfulPromise]

So this morning after one more Epsom soak, my sister and brother tried to lance the swelling. It was unsuccessful.

My sister cut pretty deep in a couple of places, but all we could see looked like just flesh, and there were no pockets of pus that we could find. Thankfully the bleeding was not too bad and we were able to stop it and we washed the area with an antibacterial wash and put some oils and ointment on it and bandaged it up.

It is very confusing and frustrating! I don't know what else to do, the Epsom baths didn't seem to be helping, and now this didn't work either. My sister says we should just cull her, because she is not laying now, and I am worried because she is not eating much at all. But I hate to just put her down for a sore on her leg! She was such a good layer before, one of the best of our pullets from last year!

I am almost tempted to put her back out in the coop (after this latest trauma to her leg heals a bit) and see what she does. I suspect she misses the other chickens a bit, and I noticed before when she was out there that she seemed to eat more food than she does inside, kind of copying the other hens in their rush for the feeder. I don't know. I realize she is just a chicken, but it is hard to have to get rid of her for what was such a small injury!

 

[elsfieldchickens]

good luck hope she gets better soon

 

[cowcreekgeek]

Well, Goosie has had 5 Epsom baths so far, with no visible results yet. I am trying to be patient, but some others in my family think we should just go ahead and lance it and see if we can get some pus out. Now let me clarify, I am not squeamish AT ALL in regards to squeezing out infection or pus in a wound! I rather enjoy it...

But, in Goosie's case, there is no obvious white head or pocket of pus. It is just a large slightly squishy swollen pink chicken thigh! I hate to just stab it blindly! But several near me think that is the wisest course. Anyone else?

Behavior wise Goosie seems about the same - calm, alert, very picky as to eating, with normal colored loose-ish poops.

One of my main concerns with lancing the swelling is being able to efficiently stop the major bleeding that I am sure will occur. We have used cornstarch, and flour, and cayenne powder in the past with limited success. (the Cayenne actually works better on people!

) Any suggestions as to a reliable blood coagulator that you have used?

Still desperately praying for wisdom!

~Joy

I wouldn't suggest lancing, as it's much wiser to gently work your way into the path of the original wound. But, the swelling is entirely too severe to have not entered the surrounding tissue, therefore, if she's not shown signs of improvement, your only option may be the use of antibiotics.

Penicillin (Pen G, Procaine Penicillin G) must be injected, and are more expensive than other alternatives (plus, you've also gotta buy syringes), although there is a powdered form for use in turkeys.

There are some other alternative ways to obtain antibiotics that I'll not suggest folks try at this point, but two that might be worth considering are actually intended for fish (but, they're the very same antibiotics, just in small and much cheaper capsule form ~'-)

Fish Mox contains Amoxicillin, which is a penicillin antibiotic, and is used w/in humans to treat many different types of infections caused by bacteria, such as ear infections, bladder infections, pneumonia, gonorrhea, and E. coli or salmonella infection.

Fish Flex contains Cephalexin, which is in a group of drugs called cephalosporin antibiotics, and works by interfering with the bacteria's cell wall formation, causing it to rupture, and killing the bacteria. It is used w/in humans to treat infections caused by bacteria, including upper respiratory infections, ear infections, skin infections, and urinary tract infections.

SoOo ... I say, "Pick your poison," but w/o believing either to be ... I've seen both indicated for use w/in poultry, and as alternatives to injections of penicillin in other animals w/ infections resulting from bite wounds, but haven't investigated the possibility of using one w/ another, as some antibiotics work synergistically w/ others (i.e. Terramycin opthalmic ointment contains both oxytetracycline hydrochloride and polymyxin B sulfate for that very reason, and is a *wickedly* good combination ~'-)

 

[cowcreekgeek]

My sister cut pretty deep in a couple of places, but all we could see looked like just flesh, and there were no pockets of pus that we could find. Thankfully the bleeding was not too bad and we were able to stop it and we washed the area with an antibacterial wash and put some oils and ointment on it and bandaged it up.

So much for one key (patience, that is ~'-)

Came back from takin' care of a few things, finished editing a response, posted ... too late.

The additional wounds will have to be monitored closely, as they're into inflamed/infected tissue, and I'm hopin' it was neosporin w/o pain reliever, or some other equivalent, that you used?

It'd be fine for her to be placed outside where she can see/hear the others, as it would improve her 'general sense of well-being' as they put it, but I certainly wouldn't put her back in the coop (unless she was still kept in a carrier/cage of sorts).

Anyhow ... see my previous post for additional suggestions, and be sure 'n give it time ~'-)

 

[JoyfulPromise]

So much for one key (patience, that is ~'-)

I am sorry, but I didn't have much say in the matter. This is a "family" laying pullet, not my personal pet, and others in the family were eager to "do something" especially if lancing a pocket of infection would help to reduce the swelling faster. They said how long is this soaking going to take, and I had no idea, I certainly thought we should keep it up longer than this before trying something drastic. But it was/is a lot of extra work, especially the drying her off afterwards.

I noticed you referred a couple of times in your notes to "other bite wounds" - but there is really NO evidence that this IS a bite wound. It is MUCH more likely that she just caught and ripped it on a snag on the fence or something. Because it is winter here in Michigan, our chickens have been confined to their roomy coop and a smaller covered outdoor pen and scratching area. We are out to the coop 3-4 times a day or more and so we would have seen any strange predators if the came around during the day, and there is no way they could have gotten in the coop at night. Because I didn't see any obvious rough spot or snag, my other thought was if it could possibly have been our rooster - a mature Delaware with good size spurs. If he slipped off Goosie at the wrong angle and then brought his leg back up, could he have gashed her thigh? I don't know for sure.

When (trying to) lance the swelling, my sister attempted to find the original entrance point or gash, but there really is no obvious place, so she did the best she could. I really don't think it is going to "open back up" at this point, but if it is just majorly inflamed tissue, then perhaps the Epsom soaks will eventually bring it down.

My biggest concern at this point is that Goosie is not eating much, and is very picky about what she wants to eat. She pretty much avoids her grains and layer mash, but will eat dried mealworms and live darkling beetles, and occasionally some kefir or yogurt if I offer it. She also has not really cared for lettuce, but LOVES fresh carrot peelings, and will gobble them up! Her poops have been pretty loose as a result of her finicky eating, but still a normal color. Otherwise she is not drooping or acting miserable, but is still alert and greets me with a low clucking whenever I go to see her. If I can get her to eat enough variety, then I am hoping to keep her for a while and continue to treat her leg with Epsom soaks and healing antibacterial and natural antibiotic oils. If she starts acting worse or droopy and miserable, then I suppose I will have to give in to the rest of the family and cull her, for her sake as well as ours.

Thanks again for all the good wishes and especially for the advice and help! I'm sorry I couldn't follow it all more closely.
I will let you all know how Goosie is doing when I can.

~Joy

 

[JoyfulPromise]

There are some other alternative ways to obtain antibiotics that I'll not suggest folks try at this point, but two that might be worth considering are actually intended for fish (but, they're the very same antibiotics, just in small and much cheaper capsule form ~'-)

Fish Mox contains Amoxicillin, which is a penicillin antibiotic, and is used w/in humans to treat many different types of infections caused by bacteria, such as ear infections, bladder infections, pneumonia, gonorrhea, and E. coli or salmonella infection.

Fish Flex contains Cephalexin, which is in a group of drugs called cephalosporin antibiotics, and works by interfering with the bacteria's cell wall formation, causing it to rupture, and killing the bacteria. It is used w/in humans to treat infections caused by bacteria, including upper respiratory infections, ear infections, skin infections, and urinary tract infections.

SoOo ... I say, "Pick your poison," but w/o believing either to be ... I've seen both indicated for use w/in poultry, and as alternatives to injections of penicillin in other animals w/ infections resulting from bite wounds, but haven't investigated the possibility of using one w/ another, as some antibiotics work synergistically w/ others (i.e. Terramycin opthalmic ointment contains both oxytetracycline hydrochloride and polymyxin B sulfate for that very reason, and is a *wickedly* good combination ~'-)

Just out of curiosity, where can you find these "fish antibiotics" and how would you administer them to a chicken? You mention they are in capsules - would you open the capsule and dissolve it in water? Or try and sprinkle it on her food? And do you have any idea how much is necessary/safe for a large size (6lb) Orpington hen?

 

[cowcreekgeek]

For certain, she coulda been spurred, or gripped, as has been the case w/ a few other injuries I've helped w/ on here. But, it'd almost be better if it were a bite ... quite sure your rooster's feet/spurs are no cleaner than an animal's mouth.

At this point, the wounds should be fully closed, save for the new ones. If they were clean, and appear to have no infection forming w/in 'em, then the epsom salt soaks are no longer particularly helpful ... it's also most nearly impossible for any cream or poltice or oils to be of any use beyond topical dressing, as they cannot and will not enter the bloodstream sufficiently.

Again, antibiotic options outlined above may be beneficial ...
(see previously previous post ~'-)

For certain, whether w/ the additional help of internal antibiotics or on the merits of her own immune system (which you can also boost/supplement naturally), this infection will either be defeated or succumbed to, entirely from w/in -- it's simply on the *inside* at this point.

NOTE: There's nothin' wrong w/ refusing to use antibiotics w/in your flock, or culling one that would survive if they were provided. But, putting her back w/ the others when she is clearly carrying bacterial infection would present a serious risk to the others.

You could also choose to provide the antibiotics, but give the bird to somebody that doesn't mind their use (once she's all better, of course ~'-)

 

[kacklinkelly]

Just to let you know am still hoping the best for your chicken.

 

[JoyfulPromise]

Thanks kacklinkelly! I do have some positive news to report! After the unsuccessful lancing/surgery on Goosie, she seemed to suffer no worse effects other than a large dark scab that formed over the new cut and around the bottom of her swelling. In fact, it almost seemed like the swelling was a little bit smaller in the next couple of days. I gave her a couple of more Epsom baths to make sure there was no new infection from the lancing, and kept putting healing essential oils and ointments on her leg several times a day.

Goosie continued to act normally, but continued to be extremely picky about her food! She refused to eat the regular moistened layer feed, and for several days would gobble carrot peels and lettuce strips and ate some whole wheat bread crumbs that were soaked in vitamin juice. One day I gave her a banty egg, lightly scrambled with the crushed eggshell included. I sprinkled a little Poultry Nutribalancer, Kelp, and Organic Fishmeal on top for extra nutrients and protein, and thankfully, she ate it all!

I could tell she was getting tired of being cooped up indoors though, and thankfully, this week we have had a nice January Thaw here in Michigan that melted most, if not all of the current snow in our yard. So the past few days I have taken Goosie out for a few hours when it was nice (40-50º) and she loved gobbling grass, scratching, and even trying out a nice dust bath! I carefully watched her around the rest of our hens when they were let out, and it didn't look like the pecking order had changed too much - some hens were friendly, and others bopped her on the head to remind her they were still on top!

She can walk normally, is only a little stiff when running, and after a few practice tries to get back in to the hang of things, seems to be able to jump and perch just fine!

She was out with the other hens all afternoon today for the first time (for that long) and I watched her this evening and was very pleased when she jumped up onto our 2 & 3 ft high perches just fine on her own. I am still hoping the swelling will go down on its own eventually, but for now I believe she will be happier out with the other chickens, as long as they don't notice her scabs and start to pick at them. Don't worry, I will be keeping a sharp eye out for that, and will be bringing her in a couple of times a day to keep up with the oils and healing salves.

Thanks again for the prayers and good wishes! I will try and update with pictures later as I see more progress.

~Joy

 

[mg15]

Such good news, Thank you.
MG