Can anyone recommend a feed for a hen with crop / digestive issues?

[TwoCrows]

Hi folks,

Butchie update! She continues to do well and is really looking good. She's on the 6th day of her second round of ACS, and I'm also giving her some yeast buster to help her digestion. She's eating only protein (eggs or sardines) and a little bit of quinoa or sweet potato every day to keep her blood sugar stable. Her crop has been empty every morning now for two weeks! But I'm also really happy to report that all of the hardness and bloating in her lower abdomen is gone. I think the inflammation and gasses in her intestines are finally going away, hopefully for good.

Another good sign is that her poop is more consistently brown (not yellowish) in color with the urates more separated. It's still muddy, but I think the ACS is causing that partway.

She is definitely absorbing more nutrients and water into her system though. Her comb is perfectly upright and has a good firm and hydrated feel to it. (It was floppy and dry feeling for months before this treatment and diet change). Her skin is much less flaky and looks like it's regenerating, but I still give her a little exfoliating scrub with diluted sulphur soap once a day.

She is very happy. She goes outside, forages a bit, comes back in, and is very chatty. Hard to believe she was on deaths door a couple weeks ago.

The yeast ball in her crop is still there. In the morning I can't even feel it. By the late afternoon, it's about the size of a plum pit. I think it's going to take a few months of low carb, wheat and soy free diet with probiotics and yeast buster to knock it down.

Maybe I should do "maintenance rounds" of ACS every 4 - 6 weeks for a few days to keep it in check?



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Aww...Butchie DOES look a lot better, I am sure she feels fabulous too! She looks pretty darn healthy to me!! You are doing everything right, especially with her diet, I would definitely keep this up for a few months. Yeast can linger in the tissues for a long time, even go dormant, so keep the carbs low just as you are.

As for the Copper and her crop....If her crop is COMPLETELY empty every morning, and I mean you feel nothing in there, the afternoon ball you feel is not yeast. That will be the accumulation of food throughout the day. Yeast balls in the crop dry out overnight and if she has doughy Yeast, you will feel it in the morning. So this said, after this round of Copper, I would stop with it and see if she can go a week or two without it, empty crop in the morning. Mornings first thing before drinking and eating, are the only time you can judge a crop.

You have done a wonderful job with Butchie, keep up ALL you are doing for her, she is in the best hands with you! And thanks for the update, I love a happy crop ending!!

 

[TwoCrows]

@TwoCrows, you suggested a homeopathic sulphur for her runny poop. I actually have pure technical grade sulphur -- you can make an organic-approved plant spray with it that prevents leaf rust, mildews, and other plant plagues. In the tropics, with all the fungi and mildews around, they really wreak havoc on the fruit trees. Technical grade means it's the purest form and stays suspended in water.

I'm started researching and I'm going to do A LOT more about this, but I'm thinking I can make a homeopathic sulphur remedy instead of giving her something like Sulmet that also comes with stronger antibiotics. I think antibiotics are the last thing she needs.

Hopefully, her loose poo will firm up as her intestines heal, but I'm going to look into the sulphur remedy in the meantime. I'll keep you posted.

Sulphur definitely reduces inflammation, so if you know how to make a tincture out of it, you might give it a try, it may help calm her intestines. Start out with a drop at a time just to see how she will react to it. It's not toxic but just the same, I'd go very slowly.

 

[TropicalChickies]

Aww...Butchie DOES look a lot better, I am sure she feels fabulous too! She looks pretty darn healthy to me!! You are doing everything right, especially with her diet, I would definitely keep this up for a few months. Yeast can linger in the tissues for a long time, even go dormant, so keep the carbs low just as you are.

As for the Copper and her crop....If her crop is COMPLETELY empty every morning, and I mean you feel nothing in there, the afternoon ball you feel is not yeast. That will be the accumulation of food throughout the day. Yeast balls in the crop dry out overnight and if she has doughy Yeast, you will feel it in the morning. So this said, after this round of Copper, I would stop with it and see if she can go a week or two without it, empty crop in the morning. Mornings first thing before drinking and eating, are the only time you can judge a crop.

You have done a wonderful job with Butchie, keep up ALL you are doing for her, she is in the best hands with you! And thanks for the update, I love a happy crop ending!!

Oh ok! That is so good to know about the yeast! I thought it was the ball getting bigger during the day. I'll finish up this round of copper and then get her on probiotics and keep her system "pickled" with ACV and/or yeast buster as needed.

I will keep tabs on her. I'm so happy I was able to help her along with everyone's guidance here.

Because now I have another drama -- I thought we hatched a cockerel and a pullet five months ago, and now it turns out we have two cockerels. One is very precocious, already crowing and mating, and his "girlfriend" is already sitting on eggs! The other one is trying to catch up, but the older hens are kicking his butt. The two cockerels have had a few fights, but I break them up and send them to their corners so they seem to have come to a truce. I'm determined to get them to live in harmony because they are both beautiful and I want to keep them both. So now I need a few more pullets and to give the later blooming cockerel his own space to become a man!

It's going to be a challenge because they both have gamecock genes in them. (People breed gamecocks here in the sticks of South America-- not me! It's a horrible sport.) But they aren't purebred, so I'm hoping that with help, the common chicken genes will take over.

I know people say they have the instinct to fight and all that, but I think it's only partly true. Animals reflect the energy of their owners and surroundings. This is a place of peace and Im betting on peace. So, we'll see!

 

[TropicalChickies]

Sulphur definitely reduces inflammation, so if you know how to make a tincture out of it, you might give it a try, it may help calm her intestines. Start out with a drop at a time just to see how she will react to it. It's not toxic but just the same, I'd go very slowly.

Yep, I'll see how she does for at least a few weeks first after this round of ACS and on probiotics.

 

[TropicalChickies]

Oh ok! That is so good to know about the yeast! I thought it was the ball getting bigger during the day. I'll finish up this round of copper and then get her on probiotics and keep her system "pickled" with ACV and/or yeast buster as needed.

I will keep tabs on her. I'm so happy I was able to help her along with everyone's guidance here.

Because now I have another drama -- I thought we hatched a cockerel and a pullet five months ago, and now it turns out we have two cockerels. One is very precocious, already crowing and mating, and his "girlfriend" is already sitting on eggs! The other one is trying to catch up, but the older hens are kicking his butt. The two cockerels have had a few fights, but I break them up and send them to their corners so they seem to have come to a truce. I'm determined to get them to live in harmony because they are both beautiful and I want to keep them both. So now I need a few more pullets and to give the later blooming cockerel his own space to become a man!

It's going to be a challenge because they both have gamecock genes in them. (People breed gamecocks here in the sticks of South America-- not me! It's a horrible sport.) But they aren't purebred, so I'm hoping that with help, the common chicken genes will take over.

I know people say they have the instinct to fight and all that, but I think it's only partly true. Animals reflect the energy of their owners and surroundings. This is a place of peace and Im betting on peace. So, we'll see!

And I didn't mean to imply that I'm breeding gamecocks! How awful. Even though the birds are so gorgeous. I just meant I got these eggs from our neighbor in the village where there are a lot of these mixed breed oriental gamecocks about, so I know they have some of the genetics.

Anyway, Butchie is super grateful for all of your help and is really enjoying life for the first time in many months. The change in her is incredible. Thanks everybody and I'll keep you updated on her soon.

 

[Wyorp Rock]

Butchie looks great!

I'm interested to read how the sulfur goes.

Ahhhh now!
It's o.k. South America has some nice gamecocks. I agree, I don't like the sport, but I do like the birds. I have American Gamefowl (one is my avatar), never had any with Oriental blood. I do wish you luck on keeping them separated and away from one another. If they are bred anything like what I have then you can't love and peace that instinct out of them. If they have been diluted over the years, then you may not have too many issues.
Mine are not diluted, so they have to be separated and managed very early in life, the instinct is absolutely there.

 

[TwoCrows]

Yep, I'll see how she does for at least a few weeks first after this round of ACS and on probiotics.

I would definitely get her off the Copper for a while. Sounds like she is ready to start healing. She is probably loaded with Copper and it will take time to be flushed from her liver and tissues. I think over time with probiotics her intestines will heal, the digestive enzymes will also return. Keep up with her diet and I think she will heal completely!

 

[TropicalChickies]

I would definitely get her off the Copper for a while. Sounds like she is ready to start healing. She is probably loaded with Copper and it will take time to be flushed from her liver and tissues. I think over time with probiotics her intestines will heal, the digestive enzymes will also return. Keep up with her diet and I think she will heal completely!

Ok, will do. I felt around in her crop early this morning very carefully and didn't feel anything. Today is day 7 of the copper, so I think tmrw I will take her off and get probiotics into her.

Of course I'm wondering what kicked this all off seven months ago. She was really terribly ill -- pooping greenish water, vent gleet, hunched up, papery sounding breath, not moving, not eating, laid some wrinkly deformed eggs, terrible smell like old socks and moldy cheese). She came back a little after deworming and ACS before, but she was clearly not well. I have a few suspicions (possible IB that inflamed the organs), I'll never know but somehow her Ph got really screwed up. Plus before I could get ACS, I was trying Nystatin and then Clotrimazol, neither worked. However, she got this yeast, it got so deep in her tissues that only ACS could get at it.

But I'm thinking that if she had malignant tumors as an underlying cause, she wouldn't be getting better now, she'd more likely have died or gotten steadily worse.
More and more, I'm thinking she got sick, messed up her Ph, and developed an intolerance to something in the feed, soy or wheat perhaps.

After all, it's been almost eight months since she initially got sick. So I'm hoping along with you that she's ready to heal!

 

[TropicalChickies]

Butchie looks great!

I'm interested to read how the sulfur goes.

Ahhhh now!
It's o.k. South America has some nice gamecocks. I agree, I don't like the sport, but I do like the birds. I have American Gamefowl (one is my avatar), never had any with Oriental blood. I do wish you luck on keeping them separated and away from one another. If they are bred anything like what I have then you can't love and peace that instinct out of them. If they have been diluted over the years, then you may not have too many issues.
Mine are not diluted, so they have to be separated and managed very early in life, the instinct is absolutely there.

Thanks! Yeah, I bet that instinct is powerful, they've been bred to fight for thousands of years!

I think these fellas are pretty diluted to be honest. The person who gave me the eggs isn't a gamecock breeder. One has already asserted his dominance and the other seems to be more submissive. But I feel badly for the the beta fellow because the dominant won't let him mate and the younger hens reject him as a result. The older hens want no part of either of them, and Cleo just kicks both their butts. So my plan is to get a couple healthy 5-6 month old pullets about the same age as these cockerels and put them in a separate area with the more submissive cockerel so they can have their own little society. I've always had a weakness for underdogs! I'll post a separate thread about the fellas over in the proper forum to keep this one on topic so I can get some insight from more experienced roosterists.

 

[TwoCrows]

Ok, will do. I felt around in her crop early this morning very carefully and didn't feel anything. Today is day 7 of the copper, so I think tmrw I will take her off and get probiotics into her.

Of course I'm wondering what kicked this all off seven months ago. She was really terribly ill -- pooping greenish water, vent gleet, hunched up, papery sounding breath, not moving, not eating, laid some wrinkly deformed eggs, terrible smell like old socks and moldy cheese). She came back a little after deworming and ACS before, but she was clearly not well. I have a few suspicions (possible IBS that inflamed the organs), I'll never know but somehow her Ph got really screwed up. Plus before I could get ACS, I was trying Nystatin and then Clotrimazol, neither worked. However, she got this yeast, it got so deep in her tissues that only ACS could get at it.

But I'm thinking that if she had malignant tumors as an underlying cause, she wouldn't be getting better now, she'd more likely have died or gotten steadily worse.
More and more, I'm thinking she got sick, messed up her Ph, and developed an intolerance to something in the feed, soy or wheat perhaps.

After all, it's been almost eight months since she initially got sick. So I'm hoping along with you that she's ready to heal!

Glad she is doing so well now! Like humans, each chicken is wired up differently, genetics play a huge part in their health, their environment, what they eat and drink, etc... It's difficult to diagnose why she became ill, could be any number of things. The rest of your flock may have suffered with it as well however their immune systems dealt with it going unnoticed by you. So we treat the symptoms until we figure it all out years and years later. Sometimes never. But you are definitely the right track, watch her and control her diet for months to come. She may completely heal over time and she can go back to eating everything, or you may need to watch her like a hawk for the rest of her days. Either way, you have done well by her and she is enjoying life! Great job! Give Butchie a big hug for me!