Cochin breeding, genetics, and showing

[cicichick]

Hi - New question about showing banty frizzled cochins....anyone have any success showing a frizzled cochin? My son has shown a cochin pair...smooth rooster and frizzled hen. They did not place at the Fair last year. Another girl showed a frizzled cochin pair this year...they looked great, but she did not place either. Same judge both years. They were both up against some great chickens so it may be that they just weren't good enough to place. His hen just hatched 5 cochins and 3 are frizzled...he is thinking about keeping them to show. But I'm wondering if frizzles are considered against standard and a novelty so they just won't do well anywhere. Any experience or ideas?

 

[lilcrow]

Quote:
My SOP is still packed away in box somewhere?????

buy I'm pretty sure they are not a recognized variety. I don't know if you can even call frizzle a variety because you can see frizzle in every variety (color). It's more of a condition of the feathers I think. I would say that your son is rowing up stream if he wants to "win" with a frizzle, but most of us who are breeding the lesser know varieties i.e., Silver Pencil, Silver Laced, Gold Lace, Partridge, Birchen, etc., know that we are doing the same. We don't breed and show to "win" per se, at least not the big wins. Of course everyone likes to win, but we breed what we have for the love of it. Showing at a fair is very different from showing at a sanctioned show. He will do better at fairs possibly (under different judges though), but I don't think he'll do much at an APA or ABA show.
If I'm wrong, I'm sure someone can set you straight on this.

 

[Black Cochin Bantams]

Quote:
I saw a very good white frizzle last year get best featherleg at a show of over 1500 birds but it doesn't happen all that often. I think it is more about the quality/type of the bird rather than whether it is frizzle or smooth. Frizzle are accepted in the standard and are not frowned upon in any way. Fairs happen when many birds are not in best condition. Also I see kids showing birds that are only 4 months old against birds that are 14-18 months old in their prime. It is hard for a young bird to compete on an equal footing. Solid colors win more often than patterned birds. If he is really wanting to be competitive consider some birds from a breeder that has had some show success. Hatchery birds don't have a chance.

 

[dak]

Ms. Lewis Rich :

Love what I have Karl and Norman Rau. Am trying to keep it pure!

 

[cicichick]

Quote:
My SOP is still packed away in box somewhere?????

buy I'm pretty sure they are not a recognized variety. I don't know if you can even call frizzle a variety because you can see frizzle in every variety (color). It's more of a condition of the feathers I think. I would say that your son is rowing up stream if he wants to "win" with a frizzle, but most of us who are breeding the lesser know varieties i.e., Silver Pencil, Silver Laced, Gold Lace, Partridge, Birchen, etc., know that we are doing the same. We don't breed and show to "win" per se, at least not the big wins. Of course everyone likes to win, but we breed what we have for the love of it. Showing at a fair is very different from showing at a sanctioned show. He will do better at fairs possibly (under different judges though), but I don't think he'll do much at an APA or ABA show.
If I'm wrong, I'm sure someone can set you straight on this.

Thanks for the info and advice.

 

[cicichick]

Quote:
I saw a very good white frizzle last year get best featherleg at a show of over 1500 birds but it doesn't happen all that often. I think it is more about the quality/type of the bird rather than whether it is frizzle or smooth. Frizzle are accepted in the standard and are not frowned upon in any way. Fairs happen when many birds are not in best condition. Also I see kids showing birds that are only 4 months old against birds that are 14-18 months old in their prime. It is hard for a young bird to compete on an equal footing. Solid colors win more often than patterned birds. If he is really wanting to be competitive consider some birds from a breeder that has had some show success. Hatchery birds don't have a chance.

He wants to try an Ohio show in November with a hatchery bird. So appreciate your comments...expectations on winning will be low & we will focus on the experience only.

 

[Coopa Cabana]

Frizzles are accepted by both the APA and ABA. Hopefully, someone that shows Frizzles can respond as to how to enter them. I'm not sure if Frizzle is part of the Breed or part of the Variety.

For instance, if you have a White Frizzle Cochin Bantam, which way do you fill out your entry form:

Class: Feather Legged
Breed: Cochin
Variety: White Frizzle

or is it:

Class: Feather Legged
Breed: Cochin Frizzle
Variety: White

 

[Ms. Lewis Rich]

I may be wrong but you may show them at any show as any other variety, AOV

 

[Coopa Cabana]

I found this online:

By the Book(s)

The American Standard of Perfection published by the American Poultry Association states, “Frizzles are one of our odd breeds, and little is known about their origin. Charles Darwin classes them as ‘Frizzled or Caffie Fowls—not uncommon in India, and with feathers curling backwards and primary feathers of wing and tail imperfect.’ The main points for exhibition purposes are the curl, which is most pronounced on feathers not too broad; the purity of color in plumage, correctness in leg color; i.e., yellow legs for the white, red or buff, and yellow or willow for other varieties. A Standard breed since the first Standard in 1874.

“Frizzles may be shown in any breed and variety set forth in this Standard of Perfection. All sections of the bird should conform to the shape description of the breed. The plumage color should conform to the color plumage description of the breed and variety involved. A Frizzle of any recognized breed may compete for class champion as provided under the rules of the A.P.A.”

“Frizzled Bantams” from the Bantam Standard, published by the American Bantam Association, states, “There is no Frizzle breed, only frizzled versions of any breed. Frizzled bantams are common and are shown mostly in the Cochin, Plymouth Rock, Japanese and Polish breeds.”

 

[jbear]

Quote:
I think it's tomato tamato.. really really. I usually put it like you have on the top version.. but depends on how big the space is for variety! lol!