Tried hard to get good pix of my main mottled rooster today. 2 million pictures later...
Cochin breeding, genetics, and showing
- Thread starter lilcrow
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- Thread starter
- #162
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My, my, he certainly is striking, takes my breath away. I so much wish I had a way to raise Columbians, even my Birchens give me fits. I just can't keep enough UV off of them and the roos particularly get tawny eventually. They're gorgeous right after a molt, but it goes down hill from there. Besides the obvious, any suggestions? I hang sheets up around the runs during the day - two fold, it increases their shade and I THINK it helps to reduce the UV light. I'd love to know if there is anything else I can do short of a building which I can't afford at this time.
My, my, he certainly is striking, takes my breath away. I so much wish I had a way to raise Columbians, even my Birchens give me fits. I just can't keep enough UV off of them and the roos particularly get tawny eventually. They're gorgeous right after a molt, but it goes down hill from there. Besides the obvious, any suggestions? I hang sheets up around the runs during the day - two fold, it increases their shade and I THINK it helps to reduce the UV light. I'd love to know if there is anything else I can do short of a building which I can't afford at this time.
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- #163
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OK I'm confused, regarding the Lavender gene, I thought I understood it to be a diluting gene. Is this incorrect? And how does the Andalusian gene "dilute" specifically as it relates to splash? Maybe this is all semantics, but I'd like to understand it better.
You are correct that lav is a diluting gene - it dilutes both black and red pigments. But it is a gene unto itself - lavender is not a diluted form of black. Did I help or further muddy the water?
Helped............a lot! Thanks Gail.
OK I'm confused, regarding the Lavender gene, I thought I understood it to be a diluting gene. Is this incorrect? And how does the Andalusian gene "dilute" specifically as it relates to splash? Maybe this is all semantics, but I'd like to understand it better.
You are correct that lav is a diluting gene - it dilutes both black and red pigments. But it is a gene unto itself - lavender is not a diluted form of black. Did I help or further muddy the water?
Helped............a lot! Thanks Gail.
- Thread starter
- #164
Quote:
OK I'm confused, regarding the Lavender gene, I thought I understood it to be a diluting gene. Is this incorrect? And how does the Andalusian gene "dilute" specifically as it relates to splash? Maybe this is all semantics, but I'd like to understand it better.
the Andalusion Blue Dilutes Black to blue when 1 copy of teh gene is present, when the offspring inherit 2 copies of the gene you get splash.
BL/BL = Black
BL/bl= Blue
bl/bl= splash
lavendar is a seperate gene all together that breeds true, that is to say it will not produce black or splash. The Lavendar or Self Blue bird will also not be laced, will often a bluish tint to the beak as well.
OK, this helps a bunch also. I knew the info on the Lav gene, but didn't know about the Andalusian gene.
So this brings up a question I have about the Lemon Blues (which I don't breed, but admire). I understand this is a cross between a Brown-Red and a Blue. Since there are the complications with the Andalusian factor which causes them to NOT breed true, could you go at it from the direction of using a Lav. to stabilize the dilution factor and then work the lacing in after the dilution was set, or are the Lav and lacing simply not able to live together?
OK I'm confused, regarding the Lavender gene, I thought I understood it to be a diluting gene. Is this incorrect? And how does the Andalusian gene "dilute" specifically as it relates to splash? Maybe this is all semantics, but I'd like to understand it better.
the Andalusion Blue Dilutes Black to blue when 1 copy of teh gene is present, when the offspring inherit 2 copies of the gene you get splash.
BL/BL = Black
BL/bl= Blue
bl/bl= splash
lavendar is a seperate gene all together that breeds true, that is to say it will not produce black or splash. The Lavendar or Self Blue bird will also not be laced, will often a bluish tint to the beak as well.
OK, this helps a bunch also. I knew the info on the Lav gene, but didn't know about the Andalusian gene.
So this brings up a question I have about the Lemon Blues (which I don't breed, but admire). I understand this is a cross between a Brown-Red and a Blue. Since there are the complications with the Andalusian factor which causes them to NOT breed true, could you go at it from the direction of using a Lav. to stabilize the dilution factor and then work the lacing in after the dilution was set, or are the Lav and lacing simply not able to live together?
Quote:
My, my, he certainly is striking, takes my breath away. I so much wish I had a way to raise Columbians, even my Birchens give me fits. I just can't keep enough UV off of them and the roos particularly get tawny eventually. They're gorgeous right after a molt, but it goes down hill from there. Besides the obvious, any suggestions? I hang sheets up around the runs during the day - two fold, it increases their shade and I THINK it helps to reduce the UV light. I'd love to know if there is anything else I can do short of a building which I can't afford at this time.
they make a Solar screen that will block up to 95% of UV and you can tack it to a seperate frame to place over your pens or just tack to your pens.. it isn't much more expensive than poultry wire.. It is offered in a few %'s so you can pick and choose what you like.. I think 80 works real good.
My, my, he certainly is striking, takes my breath away. I so much wish I had a way to raise Columbians, even my Birchens give me fits. I just can't keep enough UV off of them and the roos particularly get tawny eventually. They're gorgeous right after a molt, but it goes down hill from there. Besides the obvious, any suggestions? I hang sheets up around the runs during the day - two fold, it increases their shade and I THINK it helps to reduce the UV light. I'd love to know if there is anything else I can do short of a building which I can't afford at this time.
they make a Solar screen that will block up to 95% of UV and you can tack it to a seperate frame to place over your pens or just tack to your pens.. it isn't much more expensive than poultry wire.. It is offered in a few %'s so you can pick and choose what you like.. I think 80 works real good.
Quote:
the Andalusion Blue Dilutes Black to blue when 1 copy of teh gene is present, when the offspring inherit 2 copies of the gene you get splash.
BL/BL = Black
BL/bl= Blue
bl/bl= splash
lavendar is a seperate gene all together that breeds true, that is to say it will not produce black or splash. The Lavendar or Self Blue bird will also not be laced, will often a bluish tint to the beak as well.
OK, this helps a bunch also. I knew the info on the Lav gene, but didn't know about the Andalusian gene.
So this brings up a question I have about the Lemon Blues (which I don't breed, but admire). I understand this is a cross between a Brown-Red and a Blue. Since there are the complications with the Andalusian factor which causes them to NOT breed true, could you go at it from the direction of using a Lav. to stabilize the dilution factor and then work the lacing in after the dilution was set, or are the Lav and lacing simply not able to live together?
I think I recall someone trying it but it messed up the hackle, saddle and wing bow color to more of a brass than lemon. Lacing can occour with Lav. but typically only when other things are present and very hard to breed for. beyond that the Lemon Blue should be an even shade of Slaty blue where as lavendar is always a lighter even bluish color.
When breeding a genetically birchen (ER) lemon blue they are quite simple with some brown red, mostly LB and a few Lemon Splash all are goo dlooking birds and have thier place in a breed pen.
the Andalusion Blue Dilutes Black to blue when 1 copy of teh gene is present, when the offspring inherit 2 copies of the gene you get splash.
BL/BL = Black
BL/bl= Blue
bl/bl= splash
lavendar is a seperate gene all together that breeds true, that is to say it will not produce black or splash. The Lavendar or Self Blue bird will also not be laced, will often a bluish tint to the beak as well.
OK, this helps a bunch also. I knew the info on the Lav gene, but didn't know about the Andalusian gene.
So this brings up a question I have about the Lemon Blues (which I don't breed, but admire). I understand this is a cross between a Brown-Red and a Blue. Since there are the complications with the Andalusian factor which causes them to NOT breed true, could you go at it from the direction of using a Lav. to stabilize the dilution factor and then work the lacing in after the dilution was set, or are the Lav and lacing simply not able to live together?
I think I recall someone trying it but it messed up the hackle, saddle and wing bow color to more of a brass than lemon. Lacing can occour with Lav. but typically only when other things are present and very hard to breed for. beyond that the Lemon Blue should be an even shade of Slaty blue where as lavendar is always a lighter even bluish color.
When breeding a genetically birchen (ER) lemon blue they are quite simple with some brown red, mostly LB and a few Lemon Splash all are goo dlooking birds and have thier place in a breed pen.
- Thread starter
- #167
Quote:
My, my, he certainly is striking, takes my breath away. I so much wish I had a way to raise Columbians, even my Birchens give me fits. I just can't keep enough UV off of them and the roos particularly get tawny eventually. They're gorgeous right after a molt, but it goes down hill from there. Besides the obvious, any suggestions? I hang sheets up around the runs during the day - two fold, it increases their shade and I THINK it helps to reduce the UV light. I'd love to know if there is anything else I can do short of a building which I can't afford at this time.
they make a Solar screen that will block up to 95% of UV and you can tack it to a seperate frame to place over your pens or just tack to your pens.. it isn't much more expensive than poultry wire.. It is offered in a few %'s so you can pick and choose what you like.. I think 80 works real good.
Fantastic!! Thank you so much for the info, I'll start looking immediately. Should it be used on Partridge and Blues (non-white birds) also? It would seem maybe the Blue is more fragile, but ?????
My, my, he certainly is striking, takes my breath away. I so much wish I had a way to raise Columbians, even my Birchens give me fits. I just can't keep enough UV off of them and the roos particularly get tawny eventually. They're gorgeous right after a molt, but it goes down hill from there. Besides the obvious, any suggestions? I hang sheets up around the runs during the day - two fold, it increases their shade and I THINK it helps to reduce the UV light. I'd love to know if there is anything else I can do short of a building which I can't afford at this time.
they make a Solar screen that will block up to 95% of UV and you can tack it to a seperate frame to place over your pens or just tack to your pens.. it isn't much more expensive than poultry wire.. It is offered in a few %'s so you can pick and choose what you like.. I think 80 works real good.
Fantastic!! Thank you so much for the info, I'll start looking immediately. Should it be used on Partridge and Blues (non-white birds) also? It would seem maybe the Blue is more fragile, but ?????
- Thread starter
- #168
Quote:
OK, this helps a bunch also. I knew the info on the Lav gene, but didn't know about the Andalusian gene.
So this brings up a question I have about the Lemon Blues (which I don't breed, but admire). I understand this is a cross between a Brown-Red and a Blue. Since there are the complications with the Andalusian factor which causes them to NOT breed true, could you go at it from the direction of using a Lav. to stabilize the dilution factor and then work the lacing in after the dilution was set, or are the Lav and lacing simply not able to live together?
I think I recall someone trying it but it messed up the hackle, saddle and wing bow color to more of a brass than lemon. Lacing can occour with Lav. but typically only when other things are present and very hard to breed for. beyond that the Lemon Blue should be an even shade of Slaty blue where as lavendar is always a lighter even bluish color.
When breeding a genetically birchen (ER) lemon blue they are quite simple with some brown red, mostly LB and a few Lemon Splash all are goo dlooking birds and have thier place in a breed pen.
Very interesting.........thanks for the clarification.
OK, this helps a bunch also. I knew the info on the Lav gene, but didn't know about the Andalusian gene.
So this brings up a question I have about the Lemon Blues (which I don't breed, but admire). I understand this is a cross between a Brown-Red and a Blue. Since there are the complications with the Andalusian factor which causes them to NOT breed true, could you go at it from the direction of using a Lav. to stabilize the dilution factor and then work the lacing in after the dilution was set, or are the Lav and lacing simply not able to live together?
I think I recall someone trying it but it messed up the hackle, saddle and wing bow color to more of a brass than lemon. Lacing can occour with Lav. but typically only when other things are present and very hard to breed for. beyond that the Lemon Blue should be an even shade of Slaty blue where as lavendar is always a lighter even bluish color.
When breeding a genetically birchen (ER) lemon blue they are quite simple with some brown red, mostly LB and a few Lemon Splash all are goo dlooking birds and have thier place in a breed pen.
Very interesting.........thanks for the clarification.
I know van Dort's "Genetics of Chicken Colours" is pricey and almost impossible to find, but I would very highly recommend Brian Reeder's "Intro to Color Forms of the Domestic Fowl" for anyone interested in color genetics. There are no fancy pictures - just plain, easy to understand genetics with descriptions of most color varieties, and it's affordable.
Here's a link to purchasing it on Amazon for anyone interested:
http://www.amazon.com/Introduction-...=sr_1_4?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1314333567&sr=1-4
Here's a link to purchasing it on Amazon for anyone interested:
http://www.amazon.com/Introduction-...=sr_1_4?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1314333567&sr=1-4
Quote:
My, my, he certainly is striking, takes my breath away. I so much wish I had a way to raise Columbians, even my Birchens give me fits. I just can't keep enough UV off of them and the roos particularly get tawny eventually. They're gorgeous right after a molt, but it goes down hill from there. Besides the obvious, any suggestions? I hang sheets up around the runs during the day - two fold, it increases their shade and I THINK it helps to reduce the UV light. I'd love to know if there is anything else I can do short of a building which I can't afford at this time.
My offer still stands that I will bring you a young male that you could breed to your pullet.
My, my, he certainly is striking, takes my breath away. I so much wish I had a way to raise Columbians, even my Birchens give me fits. I just can't keep enough UV off of them and the roos particularly get tawny eventually. They're gorgeous right after a molt, but it goes down hill from there. Besides the obvious, any suggestions? I hang sheets up around the runs during the day - two fold, it increases their shade and I THINK it helps to reduce the UV light. I'd love to know if there is anything else I can do short of a building which I can't afford at this time.
My offer still stands that I will bring you a young male that you could breed to your pullet.
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