Cream Legbars

[caychris]

This is not just a duck away they actually lower themselves spread wings a bit and some even thump the ground with their feet. Its the submission stance in the mating actually. The longer they are in the laying cycle the squatting instinct fades a bit. But at the outset the hormones tend to kick in and causes them to squat on instinct. You will notice it the first time you actually see it.

 

[iPickYupik]

They aren't Legbars but some of my hens started squatting long before they laid and some lay and still don't squat for me. The best indicator I've found for me is checking the birds pelvic bones. When they are young they are very close together and there's no space between them. They slowly move apart as they mature. When you are holding your bird and you can slide your hand from the chest, along the breast bone to the pelvis and can easily tell that 2 fingers will sit between the two pelvic bones/hips, they will start laying very soon.

 

[ChicKat]

May I ask - in cream legbars, what would be the best sign that they are about to lay? My girls are now 16 (Jenny & Lissa) and 17 (Paula) weeks old. Paula's comb is starting to get a bit redder/bigger (of course, she's older). From what I've read, I shouldn't expect them to lay until about 24 weeks - how reliable is this (vs. needing to give them nest boxes before this)?

The reason I ask is that I have the three girls in a small starter coop with attached run (and time to roam in a larger area each day as well). The nest boxes are pretty wee, and I have them blocked off right now with cardboard to keep them from sleeping there (the coop part is also pretty wee). I will be building them a larger coop (got plans for The Garden Coop) to house them and some new Naked Neck, New Hampshire, and Black Copper Maran flock mates coming this fall, and ideally I'd like to have it done before these three girls start laying, so they can use those newer nest boxes. I am having the property fenced right now, and then having some tree work done at the coop site, so I need to delay a bit before starting...

I just wanted to know what to look for and what sort of construction deadline I had.

- Ant Farm

I would expect eggs around 24 weeks. Behaviorally -- they may 'play house' and test out the nest boxes.... it's cute. Physically - you can examine the vent of a chicken in lay and out of lay -- there are probably whole threads here on BYC and a google search may give you photos.

 

[animalgrl]

So, I have a CL pullet who I was told hatched last November. She has never laid an egg. AT one point in about April/May she was squatting for me but she has stopped doing that. Her comb and wattles are bright red, much redder than my younger CM and EE pullets who have both started laying. She seems healthy otherwise - lovely plumage, eating/drinking/pooping normally and active. She's a lovely bird and I'll keep her regardless, but it's frustrating because I really was looking forward to some blue eggs (And I probably paid more than I should have for her). Since she's almost a year old and not laying, does that mean I got a defective hen who is never going to lay?

 

[napdognewfie]

Are you sure that she isn't hiding the eggs or maybe even eating them?

 

[Fire Ant Farm]

This is not just a duck away they actually lower themselves spread wings a bit and some even thump the ground with their feet. Its the submission stance in the mating actually. The longer they are in the laying cycle the squatting instinct fades a bit. But at the outset the hormones tend to kick in and causes them to squat on instinct. You will notice it the first time you actually see it.

They aren't Legbars but some of my hens started squatting long before they laid and some lay and still don't squat for me. The best indicator I've found for me is checking the birds pelvic bones. When they are young they are very close together and there's no space between them. They slowly move apart as they mature. When you are holding your bird and you can slide your hand from the chest, along the breast bone to the pelvis and can easily tell that 2 fingers will sit between the two pelvic bones/hips, they will start laying very soon.

I would expect eggs around 24 weeks. Behaviorally -- they may 'play house' and test out the nest boxes.... it's cute. Physically - you can examine the vent of a chicken in lay and out of lay -- there are probably whole threads here on BYC and a google search may give you photos.

All very helpful. I had read about the vent thing, but wasn't sure how much ahead of time that this began to change.

I think the punchline is that I need to get my coop built ASAP regardless!

- Ant Farm

 

[ChicopeeBrookFM]

My understanding of recessive genes is that it will show 'all or nothing' --- I use the example of recessive whites.  a normal looking Cream Legbar could carry recessive white. You would need to have two copies of recessive white to have it show -- It doesn't produce a slightly lighter albeit normally patterned CL when only one copy is present. 

Therefore It was really confusing to me when people were saying they could look at a chicken and say 'it may have one cream gene'.  

Since a lot of time has elapsed since those olden days...we have situations where people do know their own flocks and the background of their chicks (as in pedigree) -- and they can know if there is the possibility of one Cream gene.   (Although with my understanding of genes -- it wouldn't look different from a gold chicken)---- 

Another thing that I am really proud of the CL community for is that we now recognize that there is a range of buttery-shades all acceptable as Cream -- at one time if it didn't look like a white/silver hackled bird, then it wasn't cream. 

Regarding the wing-triangle having only black-and-white or gray-and-white barring as the only indicator of cream -- I think that there are a number of Cream Legbars -- including the Applegarth pair and the 2014 UK winner that could 'break' that rule...so although the SOP says that -- I don't think that a CL is disqualified (or that it is a gold-colored and crested blue egg layer) if it has some other tints in wing triangle.  Perhaps JMO - I think it is also that the SOP says that the comb should have 6-points -- and if a CL has 5 or 7 points it is still a CL.   Not 'impure' or hybrid or mutt -- there is a person on FB who is really quick to tell people that their CLs aren't CLs (so I hear, and have been sent cut-and-pastes of, since I don't do FB)--- IMO this is an extreme disservice to the breed.  I think his conclusions are based upon -- (dunno - mostly color I guess) --  As the breed becomes more prevalent in the American landscape - the 'cream will rise to the top' - If a certain color is consistently winning at shows. then competitors will drift toward that color.  for people that aren't avid showers, but want a friendly blue egg layer--- hopefully all the 'mutts, impure and hybrids' -- are still going to be around for years and years into the future.  

so my thought is -- the wing triangle can tell you if you have a perfect Cream Legbar -- but so can the comb and crest -- and color is one of the lesser important traits.  There is a line of CLs that emphasized color -- and may have lost some of the strength of autosexing -- IMO - autosexing is a more valuable characteristic.
 

I just wanted to share, since someone asked previously, a photo of the yellow downed JR CL roo. He is 5 weeks old now and feathering out and finally was still enough to capture a clear shot.

 

[caychris]

I just wanted to share, since someone asked previously, a photo of the yellow downed JR CL roo. He is 5 weeks old now and feathering out and finally was still enough to capture a clear shot.

where is the pic

 

[ChicopeeBrookFM]

Working on that -- didn't upload the first time. Since I'm re-posting, I am wondering if anyone knows if the auto-sexing traits disappear at a certian age between hatching and adulthood and if there is a period of time when they are unsexable. I'm asking because the roos seem, in some cases to be losing their light spots as they feather out.

 

[ChicopeeBrookFM]

where is the pic

They are nice and I like that there is high interest and a good pool of folks with knowledge!! Here he is: