Cubalaya Thread For Sharing Pics and Discussing Our Birds

[Jungleexplorer]

Maybe she's a real black breasted red.

Okay, my brain just went poof! What do you mean "Real BBRed"? I thought Wheaten colored hens were "real" BBReds when it comes to Cubalayas. I have about 50 chicks on the ground from the same two trios and only this one turned out this way. Just to make sure I am understanding this. Should I be doing back flips with joy or preparing the machete?

 

[troyer]

BBRed is a duckwing color with the females being wild type in color and in the wheaten the females are cinnamon colored. No, don't get out the machete just yet, let her develop more before deciding what to do with her.
There are some people desiring to own the real wild type BBred in cubalaya.

 

[troyer]

A beautiful blue cubalaya chick amongst it's siblings 3 days old.

 

[cubalaya]

some grades and some pure:

 

[RobbysRoost]

Time to beg mom.

 

[cubakid]

I

A beautiful blue cubalaya chick amongst it's siblings 3 days old.

I think it is actually white, look at the wing feathers. This is how some of my whites are hatching.

 

[troyer]

I
I think it is actually white, look at the wing feathers. This is how some of my whites are hatching.

If it's white it has to be recessive white, because neither parent is white.

 

[gallorojo]

There has been almost too much activity on here for me to keep up with!! Bear with me as I address things in order-
1) I was with Shamoman and his uncle , and Troyer, on Saturday morning, and was part of a long conversation regarding the history of the breed. I think I can help explain what he meant by the comment that the tails are too long, etc. I had asked how the breed has changed over the years, and was told it has gotten much smaller, more delicate, longer beaked, smaller headed, white in the lobes, feathers on the face, shorter legged , softer feathered , and, without true lobster tails. The birds in the old days were much more oriental like over all, but with a unique lobster tail and more abundant feathering than all the other orientals like Shamo, etc. I think we all know the standard calls for a great deal of tail length, I think the comments made were reflective of a general sense of frustration over how an essentially oriental breed has been changed by adding true long tail blood. Shamoman knows as well as any of us what a good Cubalaya looks like, and what the standard calls for.

2) Regarding importing birds or eggs- I think eggs would be best without doubt. I like JE's suggestion that we organize ourselves first. I think we should start a real breeders club like many other breeds have before we do anything else. If we can't get our s..t together enough to make a breeders club work, then I doubt we can make a shared importation plan work either. It would be nice to build relationships and trust outside these forums before we import anything. I will be glad to help and am open to suggestions on how to get a club started . I also wanted to add that my Mother will be going to Germany in a year and would be willing to carry eggs back if we can work out the rest of the details on how to do things legally.

3) Very nice pictures, Cubalaya !!! I think about half the birds came from me, lol!! That BB Red is the Thai cross I gave you, right? The angle of the back and tail is great, that's how you want the females to come to, hopefully he can help you in that regard and in others. I'm glad to see you still have the Golden I have you, he looks good. Have you tried mating his daughters back to him yet? He has a good low, well spread tail, if you line breed to him you should be able to get good lobster tails in his daughters. You have made good progress with the whites as well, one if the females looks especially nice.

4) On the Asil cross- let's first remember that Shamoman has way more experience with Asils and Cubalayas than anyone on here, period. It's not a bad cross, I'm doing it myself, with the same excellent Asils Cubalaya and Fowlsessed have. However, I sm doing the cross knowing full well it will mess up the tail, absolute guarantee. I am doing the cross myself to correct the head issues and add muscle and bone, which, are plenty good reasons to do the cross. An Asil head will help better than any other breed to get the Cubalaya heads right. An Asil tail is very different from a Cubalaya tail though, yes, it's often below the horizontal, but they nearly always have a "break" in the downward line where they angle up just slightly, they don't generally have the full spread a Cubalaya should, and none of them in the USA have the lobster tail structure. The lobster tail is unique, described by Schmudde from his book as such-"whereby the lower main tail feathers overlap the next upper one- in males and females- kind of "fanning" out and with the side and main sickles in the male forming an elegant cape, unique for the breed and an absolute required characteristic . " this type of tail is not found on any other breed in the USA, it is not the same as an Asil tail or a Sumatra tail. The only thing that will fix the tails if they need fixing is a Cubalaya with the correct tail!! The oriental breeds that are used for crossing are to fix all the problems I stated earlier, never to fix the tails, any breed you cross to a Cubalaya will ruin the tail for years to come, obviously an Asil or Shamo is a better choice tail wise than a Cochin , and is surely fixable, but only if the tails were good to start with. Some of the guys here in PA have done these crosses before most of us even heard of the breed, they do know what they are talking about.

5 ) Jungle Explorer- you pullet is a wheaten wild type cross that favors the wild type more than the wheaten. Wild type is the " true" BB Red, but it is not what is called for in the Cubalaya standard. The standard calls for wheaten females, but if this pullet turns out nice, I would keep her, her sons would be show able and true to standard. Historically some old breeders did not keep wheaten females, they just showed males, which is fine.

 

[tigercreek]

Shamoman, the prices quoted on your link sound very reasonable. Count me in.


I might have to carve a few special flutes to fund my habit ;-)

What did I miss? I did not see a post with a link to prices. Was it taken down?? If not, can some kind soul please direct me to it?? .....stan

 

[cubalaya]

thanks gallo. to be honest with you, that silver wheaton hen is the only daughter that has ever hatched from him. got plenty of males from him. i bred the daughter back to him and got more males. none of the males had the good tail angle that he has no matter what i breed him to. i kept one of his best sons and will try the silver wheaton hen with him.
the white hen that looks good, her father is the black that you got from me and her mother is the other hen in the pic.
on the asil grades, the asil that we have are a little different than fowlsessed's. his are viper line with yellow legs and shorter tail. i never expected perfect lobster tails in the first generation or two of these asil grades. by the fifth or sixth generation maybe. the reason for using long tailed , white legged asil was less to fix later on.
if everybody is agreed that the german blood is what is needed then i would like to try some too, i guess. i also know that it may bring a whole new set of problems.