Diary & Notes ~ Air Cell Detatched SHIPPED Chicken Eggs for incubation and hatching

[loveourbirds]

Its a hard decision to make, but it does get away from you. After a certain number of chickens, self sufficiency morphs into huge feed bills and a regular worming schedule and the electricity it takes to run the incubators and the operation, bedding etc.

I am really loving the bresse as far as self-sufficiency. They do well with the free ranging, they tolerate the heat well enough and they are really meaty birds. I think I'm going to phase out some of my show breeds and phase in some bresse to my free range flock. I want to be able to fill the freezer before I go to the feed store.

this farm makes some money, but you are right - the costs of keeping it up through the winter are astronomical. 450 lbs of feed a week, $300-$400 electric bills, about 30 bales of bedding a month. i havent noticed the cost of running incubators so much, but brooders are another story; 1 -250 watt heat lamp costs about $32 a month to keep on (not counting cost of bulb) in the busy season we will run 20 heat lamps - doesn't take long to really rack up the bills then.

u sound like my husband

your husband must be a smart man!

i bet he's handsome too!

I think its a big move to do all of them, have u taken into account where ur most moneys come from, I am sure u have! I find it tends to be spread out with mine. what is cambar?

it kind of comes from all directions, but the 2 of us can only do so much. on the old english i have to raise about 120 to get an excellent trio, that's alot of work!

from my article:
Cambar: The original line is now extinct. They were created in England by crossing Campines and Barred Plymouth Rocks. They were the first of the autosexing breeds developed at Cambridge.

 

[Sally Sunshine]

Hello Viola!

Hello everyone! Jumping in this thread with some newly arrived shipped Blue Wheaten Americaunas with detatched air cells. I have read the OP a few times and I have a good idea of my plan, but I have some questions too.

The op? have you gone to the updated Hatching 101 article? if not link in my signature below. How detatched? are they rolling, bubbly or just "loose" air cells?

1) How long is too long to wait to set eggs? I have a 2nd shipment of eggs coming, it should have arrived today but it didn't, and with tomorrow's holiday it may not arrive until Friday. After a 24hr rest, that means setting on Saturday. Today being Wednesday, that would be 3 full days of rest for my Americauanas.
-Is 3 days resting acceptable? At what point do you lose viability? I do not know the exact lay date, but they were shipped on Monday. I'd guess the eggs would be at least 1 week old by then.
-Should I refrain from turning the eggs for the full 3 rest days? It is recommended to not turn for 24 hours, and then an additional 48 hours inside the incubator. I figure I could just not turn for all 3 days rest.
-If so, should I then begin turning the eggs on day 1 of incubation? Or should I continue to refrain from turning for an additional 36-48 hours of incubation?
-It is recommended in this thread to use an egg carton and turn by hand. Is that because an egg turner goes beyond 45 degrees when it turns? I have an automatic egg turner I would like to use, but if it will cause risk to my eggs then I won't use it!

Some of us rest 12-24 before setting, however if I have a good batch of eggs I will set them immediately if the temps are the same as my room, if they are cold, YOU MUST settle them to room temp, as with detatched and rolling cells. I settle for about 12 hrs and then add them and I lay good eggs on side after marking one side with a line (or X or O) and start turning x3 and the reason I use the egg carton is that I and I alone have control over turning those eggs, I can do so very gently in the carton by fliping/rotating side up. Gentle is important, also not candling them until at least day 7 is key, and when you candle keep the egg still, move the candler NEVER ROLL an loose egg ever! Its a hard thing not to do because you just HAVE TO KNOW if its reattached, if its alive let it alone its ALIVE dont worry about the air cell at this point, just keep up what your doing! Sometimes you can just set a candler on top and its good enough to check viability.

If I was in your situation and I only had one incubator I would rest these eggs and do not turn them and then settle the new ones for 6 hrs and set everyone together. I hope that makes sense!



2) One of my eggs has several hairline cracks. I can't see it from the outside, only when I candle it. I read in the OP that you tossed your cracked egg, but later wished you kept it with crayon wax or nail polish.
-What's the best thing to coat the crack in, wax or polish? Any hints on how to do this? It seems like hot melted wax on a cold egg might be bad. But chemical polish doesn't seem good, either. How do?

I wouldnt try to save an egg at this point unless I paid a fortune for it, if you do try this please contain the egg in its own area so if it does give bacteria you dont ruin the rest, its your call but I personally wont take that chance. If I accidently crack an egg that is viable living embryo towards the end, yes I will try to keep her alive and keep a good eye on her movement during candles. I used wax crayon and candle.

 

[Sally Sunshine]

Quote: I am sorry I have a pea brain when it comes to remembering. I am blessed with many white spots on my brain from illness in my 30's. I need pen and paper to keep things in order Thats why I have to take so many notes.

 

[rbaker0345]

I don't have any white spots on my brain, but it still works like a sieve. I've got post-its all over.

 

[Farmer Viola]

The op? have you gone to the updated Hatching 101 article? if not link in my signature below. How detatched? are they rolling, bubbly or just "loose" air cells?

Yes ma'am! This is my second hatch, and I have probably read the Hatching 101 article.. oh.. maybe 50 times by now! (no exaggeration, LOL)

I didn't see any with individual bubbles, luckily. I saw some with saddling down the side of the egg, and others were loose or rolling about the egg. I didn't experiment a lot with rolling the air cell around, I wanted to keep it in place at the top of the egg. I believe 3 eggs were not detatched from what I could tell.

Quote: THANK YOU!!! So helpful!
I was unsure about whether its appropriate to turn the egg over while candling, so that's really helpful to know, keep it right side up. It just *seems* bad to turn them all around by instinct, anyway.

I also read not to candle or weigh detatched AC eggs until day 15, but you say you do it on day 7? I can wait if it means my eggs have a better chance of survival. I really want these Americauanas to live!

Ok so you are saying, get the 2nd shipment Friday, give them 6 hours to rest and acclimate to temperature, then set them all on Friday, got it. The 1 thing that could wrench this plan is if the 2nd shipment is detatched as well. (knock on wood)

Quote: Ok, thanks, it's not worth the risk so I will toss it

I thought of something else... we have a wood burning stove as our heat source in our house, so the house is pretty warm (70-80) depending on where you are in the house. My spare bathroom is poorly insulated and stays cool, it was 60-65 in there today so that's where my eggs are resting (50% humiditiy - & no one uses this BR). At night it could get colder in the bathroom.. it's 30 here at night.. so maybe 40-50 in the bathroom overnight? I'm not sure. But this is the coolest place in the house for them. Is it TOO cool?
I forgot how much worry eggs bring!!

 

[Sally Sunshine]

I don't have any white spots on my brain, but it still works like a sieve. I've got post-its all over.

I use dry erase on my fridge, I have notes on my cell, I have several notepads for each of my endeavors, I have files upon files of word files on my 8 usb key thinggers! DH says I need an external drive, I never really looked into what they are.

 

[Sally Sunshine]

Quote: THANK YOU!!! So helpful!
I was unsure about whether its appropriate to turn the egg over while candling, so that's really helpful to know, keep it right side up. It just *seems* bad to turn them all around by instinct, anyway.
You can turn a good egg about fine when candling its the rolling and detatched you dont want to mess with, and again if you can candle whilst in the box or gently lift straight up enough to get the light on and look in your ok! I go to about 10 days before I candle, but I dont get near as excited to see a live embryo anymore lol so I just let them be.

I also read not to candle or weigh detatched AC eggs until day 15, but you say you do it on day 7? I can wait if it means my eggs have a better chance of survival. I really want these Americauanas to live! again if your careful and just lift the egg straight up and candle from above your ok, if not just let it alone.

Ok so you are saying, get the 2nd shipment Friday, give them 6 hours to rest and acclimate to temperature, then set them all on Friday, got it. The 1 thing that could wrench this plan is if the 2nd shipment is detatched as well. (knock on wood) Remember when you first add eggs depending on room temp it may drop the temp on the bator, just let them go for about 2 hours and keep watch they should be up to what your bator was set at in 4 hrs if its not adjust but again keep checking that temp ALOT the first day and then the next day several times. Sometimes I added too cold of eggs and it took forever to get to temp so I had to adjust higher and then bring it back down, I was well over 4 hrs and they still were too cold.

Quote: Ok, thanks, it's not worth the risk so I will toss it

I thought of something else... we have a wood burning stove as our heat source in our house, so the house is pretty warm (70-80) depending on where you are in the house. My spare bathroom is poorly insulated and stays cool, it was 60-65 in there today so that's where my eggs are resting (50% humiditiy - & no one uses this BR). At night it could get colder in the bathroom.. it's 30 here at night.. so maybe 40-50 in the bathroom overnight? I'm not sure. But this is the coolest place in the house for them. Is it TOO cool?
I forgot how much worry eggs bring!!
My guess is the room is only getting 50, are you sure its going that low to 40? I have set some eggs from the fridge and they hatched fine, I dont suggest it but eggs can take alot more than we think! so I think you should be ok. They didnt wash the eggs did they? also the size of the air cell gives you an idea of age, if you candle one and get a pic of the air cell it will help us to see what you have. Anotherwords the larger the air cell the rougher the shipment would be on the egg resulting in bad air cells. Thats why we request as fresh as eggs as possible, see oz's notice to egg shippers (pdf I think) in the 101 article.

 

[loveourbirds]

i live by the theory that when you memorize something it creates a wrinkle in your brain. my problem is all the wrinkles are starting to overlap (like my family tree), memories are starting to crossfire.

i blame it on "sometimer's disease"

 

[Farmer Viola]

Quote: oh yes!! I have 3 thermometers and 3 hydrometers and the bator has been running for a few days now at a steady temp The plan is to dry hatch, foam incubator, I don't use vent plugs at all. Humidity should be in the 40's once eggs are added, if something is TOO low then I use a small piece of wet sponge to get it up but shouldn't be the case with around 24 eggs, I hope. Stop turning at day 16 for detached air cells.. lockdown day 18 is 65% humidity with wet sponges again.

Quote: They were packaged exceptionally well they had individual bubble wrap, packed in a box with newspaper shavings, packed in another box with newspaper shavings and very well marked with orange/black fragile stickers. There was no damage to the box that I could see, and none were actually burst open. The eggs are from a seller from here on BYC, so I didn't use the notice because I could see how well they packaged their eggs.
Edit: they traveled far, from Gerogia to Oregon, left Monday morning arrived at my door Wednesday morning. I only paid $40, and the box looked fine on the outside so I don't know that I would have a claim?
The other egg package is from California, less distance, so I'm hopeful.

Quote: ok thanks! I was thinking I would slowly try to raise the temperature in the bathroom using the heat in the main room from the woodstove. right now the bathroom is closed and the bedroom it's in is closed, so no heat going in there! I can get them slowly over several hours to 70 and 80, possibly even 90 degrees before putting them in the bator, getting closer and closer to the fire room. Sounds funny but it works! I'm deathly afraid of the eggs temp rising too quick and sweating, so I might do this over 8? hours to be safe.

Quote: no I'm not sure if it goes to 40.. I have a thermometer that will show the record low from the night that I will leave in there to know for sure, hopefully it doesn't get that low and I'm just paranoid.

The eggs aren't washed, but most of them are very clean only one is soiled.
I did think that one aircell looked particularly large, but it was saddled and from my understanding that can basically cause the air to spread out and poke less into the eggwhite, causing it to appear larger on it's surface? and that is why you have to weigh to see weightloss in those? Not sure if I understand that correctly, or not. Also, they were the freshest the seller has since they sell a dozen every week, and they were laid right up until the day they were shipped, but how many days backwards I'm unsure. My guess is 3 because 3 of the eggs look similar in color and shape and maybe came from the same hen. I will try to get a candle pic tonight. I can candle them in-carton in the bathroom after dark without moving them!

edit: I tried to take candle pics but they came out awful, can't see anything, in carton or in my hand (even though the egg is completely illuminated in real life there is nothing on the camera). they are blue eggs.

 

[chicksooner]

she seemed better after the doctor again this morning, But has since downturn, Doc said he will assume she picked up an adenovirus, which in turn caused the conjuctavitis and sinus infection which in turn caused semiorbital cellulitis of her eye tissues, and she has tonsilitis with green things with nasty coming out of them along with major nausia and 103 fever which motrin works in bringing it down with the help alternating tylenol. This is exact to what I delt with Lucas two weeks ago, but he did not have the major eye issues.

Hugs to you and her. Boo on stupid mom who brought you a sick kid to watch. If it were me I would great kids at the door with a thermometer and send anyone with a fever back home.
Praying she is better quick.

My guess is the room is only getting 50, are you sure its going that low to 40? I have set some eggs from the fridge and they hatched fine, I dont suggest it but eggs can take alot more than we think! so I think you should be ok. They didnt wash the eggs did they? also the size of the air cell gives you an idea of age, if you candle one and get a pic of the air cell it will help us to see what you have. Anotherwords the larger the air cell the rougher the shipment would be on the egg resulting in bad air cells. Thats why we request as fresh as eggs as possible, see oz's notice to egg shippers (pdf I think) in the 101 article.

Storing eggs that cool is fine. Bring them to temp in the room with the bator before putting them in. Also if the incubator is in a cool room it might have a harder time maintaining temp. You will have more temp fluctuations which could throw off the whole hatch or in some cases ruin it completely. Good luck.