Don't understand the importance of "non GMO"

[MeepBeep]

I grant you that selective breeding is a form of genetic modification, but it is a passive form; it's never going to have results like, for example, those horrid little day-glo-colored zebra danios.

I fully beg to differ, look at that 'natural' diversity of life on this plant that has come from natural selective breeding and natural mutations aka evolution... The 'efflorescent' gene you speak of is in fact a result of natural evolution in jellyfish and sea anemones... Man didn't make that gene, nature did... It's also flawed to infer that natural evolution won't or hasn't caused a florescent genes to appear in fish, as it has... In fact naturally florescent fish are quite common and not unique... Would that gene have ever appeared in danios naturally in due time, maybe not or possibly so that is a question no one has the answer for...

IMO never is a strong world that should be avoided in this type of discussion, as it's an inherently flawed speculation, not a fact...

 

[MeepBeep]

I personally seek out organic, non GMO'S, and locally produced products

The problem I outlined in my previous post, the issue that many choose to either ignore or are ignorant to, is that the organic and non-GMO labels are misleading at best, a total lie in many instances...

Lets look at two examples, one that is widespread...

That being Clearfield (Above) wheat, just like ' Roundup Ready Corn' it was was genetically engineered and modified in a lab to be resistant that companies particular pesticide...

They are both Genetically Modified Organisms, a result of artificial gene splicing in a lab, but they used different processes to splice that pesticide resistant gene into the plant, thus Clearfield is sold and marketed as non-GMO and even sold as certified organic if it's grown without pesticides...

Another widespread example is the 'Rio Red Grapefruit' the 'official' grapefruit crop of Texas, it's the result of radiation exposure and mutation experiments, yet it's considered non-GMO and if the farmer grows it without pesticides it's sold as certified organic...

Using the two above examples (there are 1000s more) most would consider the non-GMO and organic labeling to be at minimum quite misleading...

 

[torilovessmiles]

We as a country have allowed GMO's to become a part of our food crops just by the process of demanding cheap food. People seem unwilling to pay money for good food. Stop demanding your McDonald's hamburger cost only a dollar, stop complaining when the cost of dairy goes up. I don't know if GMO'S are bad, I do know they have been bad for the family farms and local producers who can't compete with the Monsanto's, or the Tyson chickens, we are coming down to a few companies controlling our food production, that makes me more nervous. I personally seek out organic, non GMO'S, and locally produced products just because I wish to have some say on where I get my food from now and hopefully in the future.

This is actually a good point, but remember that not all organic foods are from "mom and pop" businesses, and are often owned by the same big businesses that produce cheap food in massive amounts, and not all small farmers use organic methods. Some GMOs are no longer patented, so local farmers are likely to begin using them as well. So this isn't a problem with GMOs themselves, moreso monopoly-type businesses in the food industry. Purely healthwise, there isn't a reason to use non-GMO feed over conventional feed.
That being said, we do have a problem in the US, where many people are eating 3000+ calories per day and claiming that they can't afford to feed their families because egg and meat prices have gone up.

 

[Mutt Farm]

I'm going to add a third perspective to this great discussion. A little on the edge of relevancy, but I hope you find irony and humor. My Pop's perspective. He's 83, raised on a farm in Mi, had work horses to plow, worked on a turkey farm, worked construction as an adult, 50 years Laborers Union. Raised every bird imaginable. Who knew, when I mentioned non-GMO and pesticide free last night what an earful I would get!

!!! I think he started with "Oh BS"!

As a kid, to earn FFA $$, they would go around town spraying milk barns with DDT whitewash! Sprayed peoples yards and sprayed all over the shores of Howell Lake for mosquitos! In construction, he worked with asbestos for many years too! He's 83, 2 knee replacements, 1 shoulder surgery, 1 stroke (fully recovered) and only takes 1 baby aspirin and a lipitor daily. He lives in his fancy "man cave" out back. He works our tiny garden, feeds and cleans the 2 horses, goes to breakfast with his buddies, so healthy. His perspective: well, at the end of the rant, it was cautionary. Stories of his generation dying from cancer, wishing they would have known.

 

[oldhenlikesdogs]

That funny my parents are late 70's and she been talking about the evils of GMO's, I tell her she's old, why is she worried now, she's not going to live long enough to know the difference, she says she's concerned about her children, I say it's not her business. There are evils everywhere, but surprisingly people keep living longer, and are in better shape.

 

[MeepBeep]

As a kid, to earn FFA $$, they would go around town spraying milk barns with DDT whitewash! Sprayed peoples yards and sprayed all over the shores of Howell Lake for mosquitos!

Reminds me of the stories my grandmother told me growing up in an orphanage... She said one of the highlights of summer was when they handed out the DDT sprayers to the children and set them loose to spray the property, she said they used them like water guns spraying each other...

Anyway it's because of that haphazard no testing and no cares of days gone by, that we now do extensive testing and scientific study, is that study and testing the end all, no... But, it at least provides a solid scientific baseline to reference vs hyperbole, hearsay or pure speculation...

 

[rides2far]

Very interesting discussion. I'm using a non GMO/organic feed for my pullets simply because it was the only layer feed I could find that uses animal protein in it. Most other feeds have jumped on the vegetarian/vegan bandwagon & don't use animal protein. (I'm not criticizing vegetarians or vegans - I don't care what you eat

). It's expensive, but I'll admit it smells really good & the chickens don't seem to waste much. I've fermented the powdery feed left in my feeder & will give them some for the 1st time on Friday. Again, an interesting discussion. I can see good points made by both sides.

 

[Folly's place]

I'm enjoying this thread too. I also remember the DDT, dead robins in the yard after the city sprayed, BUT insecticides like that pretty much eliminated malaria in the US. We win some and loose some, and learn later that using XXX makes us break out in purple spots in thirty years... No cultivated crop or animal is totally 'natural', and there's no way I want to be an ancient hunter-gatherer, and be old at 29! Mary

 

[shortgrass]

Well I can add in from the producers POV... My parents and grandparents etc etc.... And I... Grow corn, hay, wheat, etc.... Seed companies have made it almost impossible to get seed that ISNT GMO unless you want to pay an arm and a leg for it... Then most can't afford the beneficials and OMRI approved pesticides and weed control. ITS HARD WORK growing nin GMO... Organic for that matter... We can source organic corn now, FINALLY.. For a good price... But non GMO? next to impossible for production. It runs the cost of that crop into the red, and the consumer won't pay $5 an ear at walmart for it, but that's what WE need to cover our costs.

Im switching the whole farm organic, next is non GMO. Alfalfa has been done. Non GMO, organic. Wheat, organic but GMO, corn, organic but GMO.

It's finding the seedvand knowing how to maximize it without costs through the roof getting passed on to YOU.

Others have done an excellent job of explaining what happens when natural meets unnatural.... Monsanto is learning about Amaranth right now. It's resistant to Round up, their glory herbicide they modified the corn for... It comes back and bites ya in the behind, messing with stuff you don't know the consequences of..

Selective breeding is way different than genetic modification. I use selective breeding every day


That's why it costs so much, and that's why it's worth it.

 

[torilovessmiles]

Well I can add in from the producers POV... My parents and grandparents etc etc.... And I... Grow corn, hay, wheat, etc.... Seed companies have made it almost impossible to get seed that ISNT GMO unless you want to pay an arm and a leg for it... Then most can't afford the beneficials and OMRI approved pesticides and weed control. ITS HARD WORK growing nin GMO... Organic for that matter... We can source organic corn now, FINALLY.. For a good price... But non GMO? next to impossible for production. It runs the cost of that crop into the red, and the consumer won't pay $5 an ear at walmart for it, but that's what WE need to cover our costs.

Im switching the whole farm organic, next is non GMO. Alfalfa has been done. Non GMO, organic. Wheat, organic but GMO, corn, organic but GMO.

It's finding the seedvand knowing how to maximize it without costs through the roof getting passed on to YOU.

Others have done an excellent job of explaining what happens when natural meets unnatural.... Monsanto is learning about Amaranth right now. It's resistant to Round up, their glory herbicide they modified the corn for... It comes back and bites ya in the behind, messing with stuff you don't know the consequences of..

Selective breeding is way different than genetic modification. I use selective breeding every day

That's why it costs so much, and that's why it's worth it.

According to the US Department of Agriculture, all certified organic MUST be non-GMO. If it's GMO, it is not and cannot legally be sold as organic.
http://www.usda.gov/wps/portal/usda/usdahome?contentidonly=true&contentid=organic-agriculture.html

Quote:

Can you give examples as to why selective breeding is different from genetic modification, particularly healthwise, other than "it just is"? Both are changing an organism's genetics in a way that it would not naturally occur. I posted about this previously, giving examples of the side effects of the genetic mutations that we have bred into animals, and we have done it to plants as well, on the same level, purely through selective breeding.