How many chickens would you need to keep to supply all the meat and eggs your family eats?

[ChocolateMouse]

Well, that's true of almost anything. If you don't feed and protect your livestock you're gonna get horrible results. In fact, pretty soon chances are good you won't have any livestock at all before long....

Honestly, if someone tried to sell me a chicken kept under conditions without medical care, feed, shelter and security I'd be hesitant to think they're much better off than chickens who have those things but are crowded and pooped on. I don't think being harassed and snatched up by predators and half-starved is particularly ethical. So it doesn't really fit into the idea of eating better quality more humanely raised meat.
That's why I really like low-stocked tractored birds so much. I think they're one of the best models out there.

Under more ethical circumstances you can easily reach more than 4 chicks per bird.

 

[sourland]

Trolling at its finest. Folks, there is an expert in our midst. I applaud the evident skill. It is true that our posts tend to portray our true character.

 

[ChocolateMouse]

Not sure if you mean me, or Shad, tbh. Not that it matters much.

Trolling suggest deliberate ill intent to start trouble. I'm fairly sure nobody here has that (though I have my reservations).

 

[Shadrach]

Well, that's true of almost anything. If you don't feed and protect your livestock you're gonna get horrible results. In fact, pretty soon chances are good you won't have any livestock at all before long....

Honestly, if someone tried to sell me a chicken kept under conditions without medical care, feed, shelter and security I'd be hesitant to think they're much better off than chickens who have those things but are crowded and pooped on. I don't think being harassed and snatched up by predators and half-starved is particularly ethical. So it doesn't really fit into the idea of eating better quality more humanely raised meat.
That's why I really like low-stocked tractored birds so much. I think they're one of the best models out there.

Under more ethical circumstances you can easily reach more than 4 chicks per bird.

Oh, I was under the impression that you free ranged given all you've had to say in this thread.

 

[ChocolateMouse]

Oh, I was under the impression that you free ranged given all you've had to say in this thread.

I thought you were BETTER than that since you expressed OPINIONS on the internet. *doffs tophat and polishes monocle* How disappointing.

Anyhow, sarcasm over your dismissal aside - nice moving of the goalposts there, 30 pages in. (Feasibility under humane smallholding conditions to feasibility under near feral conditions.)

The majority of america considers my chickens free range and they VASTLY exceed the legal requirements by leagues. They have a coop they roost in at night and a large fenced in area with edible plants and insects that's safe from predators. There's space to preform all normal biological activities without conflict, smell, or increased parasite loads. In the late fall (about now) that space is expanded about 5Xs to the exhausted garden beds and lawn as well. My chickens are not almost feral, though, no.

Again, reality conflicts here, luckily. Nobody would bother eating chicken at all if they all had to be all-but feral to be considered "free range" and I think you'd be hard pressed to find a back yard in america that meets your very strange specific requirements. Honestly I think even if you think having a fence on your property or a safe pen for your chickens means your birds aren't "free-range", I think most people in the world wouldn't want that sort of free-ranged bird. Especially after hearing your description of your baby chicks dropping like flies.

So, yeah. 2lb birds, living feral in the woods, half getting eaten by predators, never being fed, not given medical care, brooding their own chicks exclusively, all but hunting wild chickens.... A) would explain your model. B) Seems like bad husbandry to me and I would not feel happy with animals treated that way.
I mean how many of us remind people to be responsible for their animals welfare on here by keeping them safe and making sure they're well fed and have medical treatment? How many of us say "Only One Bad Day" as a mantra? The situation you're describing sounds awfully stressful for a domesticated animal.

I wouldn't wanna try to feed a population under those circumstances either. Luckily they don't reflect reality for the majority of the world. And I don't know anyone who wants what you're describing to be the default.

 

[cmom]

That's a lot of chickens for a coop, run and incubator system.
What do you do with the 200/300 chicks you hatch? You write you sell the extra males. Are they sold for meat?
The processing costs is something we are looking into now. It may prove to be more cost effective to have a commercial concern do the processing.

Approximately half of the hatches will be male. I sell some of them them for meat and some are sold to others I have dealt with in the past who resell the birds or people that want my breeds to add to their existing flock or starting into chickens to establish their flocks. Usually in the spring I will sell some females. I really don't care at that point because I don't have to feed them anymore. I do grow out all of my chicks and keep the best as future breeders. I have a dozen coops so I have plenty of space. Selling the extra males helps to recoup most of the cost of feeding them while I am growing them out.

 

[Molpet]

Well, that's true of almost anything. If you don't feed and protect your livestock you're gonna get horrible results. In fact, pretty soon chances are good you won't have any livestock at all before long....

Honestly, if someone tried to sell me a chicken kept under conditions without medical care, feed, shelter and security I'd be hesitant to think they're much better off than chickens who have those things but are crowded and pooped on. I don't think being harassed and snatched up by predators and half-starved is particularly ethical. So it doesn't really fit into the idea of eating better quality more humanely raised meat.
That's why I really like low-stocked tractored birds so much. I think they're one of the best models out there.

Under more ethical circumstances you can easily reach more than 4 chicks per bird.

Oh people in my grandparents day didn't feed chickens, they ate whatever they could find and the other livestock left. Dogs helped with the predators. Didn't feed the dogs either.
Chicken dinner on Sundays. Leftovers for lunch.
Not sure how many they had or hatched but they had plenty of chicken. There was a hen house, but never shut in.

 

[ChocolateMouse]

Oh people in my grandparents day didn't feed chickens, they ate whatever they could find and the other livestock left. Dogs helped with the predators. Didn't feed the dogs either.
Chicken dinner on Sundays. Leftovers for lunch.
Not sure how many they had or hatched but they had plenty of chicken. There was a hen house, but never shut in.

In your grandparents day there were 1/3rd the people in the world, though, and the chickens were MUCH much smaller and laid many fewer eggs. Property sizes were larger on average too. My grandparents did the same, mom told me stories from when she was a kid. "A handful of corn for the whole flock in the morning if it had snowed overnight and nothing else." She made fun of my for feeding my chickens. She stopped when she saw how nice they dress out and how many eggs we get. Her birds were never that nice.

There was a time when hunter/gatherer was a viable option too. It's just not any more. Nor is it considered particularly humane to not feed your animals, especially with their modern needs. They've changed on a biological level to no longer need almost zero food. Dogs too.

 

[Shadrach]

I thought you were BETTER than that since you expressed OPINIONS on the internet. *doffs tophat and polishes monocle* How disappointing.

Anyhow, sarcasm over your dismissal aside - nice moving of the goalposts there, 30 pages in.

The majority of america considers my chickens free range and they VASTLY exceed the legal requirements by leagues. They have a coop they roost in at night and a large fenced in area with edible plants and insects that's safe from predators. There's space to preform all normal biological activities without conflict, smell, or increased parasite loads. In the late fall (about now) that space is expanded about 5Xs to the exhausted garden beds and lawn as well. My chickens are not almost feral, though, no.

Again, reality conflicts here, luckily. Nobody would bother eating chicken at all if they all had to be all-but feral to be considered "free range" and I think you'd be hard pressed to find a back yard in america that meets your very strange specific requirements. Honestly I think even if you think having a fence on your property or a safe pen for your chickens means your birds aren't "free-range", I think most people in the world wouldn't want that sort of free-ranged bird. Especially after hearing your description of your baby chicks dropping like flies.

So, yeah. 2lb birds, living feral in the woods, half getting eaten by predators, never being fed, not given medical care, brooding their own chicks exclusively, all but hunting wild chickens.... A) would explain your model. B) Seems like bad husbandry to me and I would not feel happy with animals treated that way.
I mean how many of us remind people to be responsible for their animals welfare on here by keeping them safe and making sure they're well fed and have medical treatment? How many of us say "Only One Bad Day" as a mantra? The situation you're describing sounds awfully stressful for a domesticated animal.

I wouldn't wanna try to feed a population under those circumstances either. Luckily they don't reflect reality for the majority of the world. And I don't know anyone who wants what you're describing to be the default.

Most people on the mountain I live on free range. If you look world wide I think you would find that free range is a very common way of keeping chickens. There are quite a few on BYC who free range.
I don't recall writing anything about no medical care, or attempting to enhance their security. I do feed the chickens here and they will get fed on this project.
The hens losing chicks is one of the things you have to accept when free ranging. The story above is one of many. Hatching disasters happen whether the hen is in a coop or outside.

 

[Shadrach]

Approximately half of the hatches will be male. I sell some of them them for meat and some are sold to others I have dealt with in the past who resell the birds or people that want my breeds to add to their existing flock or starting into chickens to establish their flocks. Usually in the spring I will sell some females. I really don't care at that point because I don't have to feed them anymore. I do grow out all of my chicks and keep the best as future breeders. I have a dozen coops so I have plenty of space. Selling the extra males helps to recoup most of the cost of feeding them while I am growing them out.

At what age do you think you can reliably judge the quality of the pullets and cockerels you've grown out?
I was talking about this with a man from the project yesterday. I think it's quite a skill.