International Black Copper Marans Thread - Breeding to the SOP

[Chooks man]

I understand what you're saying. It is frustrating to say the least. I am culling any LA chicks with vulture hocks and not keeping any with middle toe feathering. Should I cull the entire LA line?? I am willing to part with them and focus on my FRF birds if you think it would be best.

What I was thinking is maybe only keeping a few of the best LA pullets.. no excess white, no vulture hocks, and no middle toe feathering, then cull everything else.. including LA parent stock, all chick cockerels and all cull pullets. Then take those best pullets and put a FRF cockerel over them. Then take pullets from that mating and put a FRF cockerel back over them.. and so on and so forth until I am satisfied the vulture hocks gene is long gone.

My theory with what I would be trying to accomplish is:

1. The LA line has better tail angle and longer backs and the hens are nice and large, unlike my dainty FRF girl who is smaller and leaner. A lot of the genes for type and size comes from the hen. By using the LA pullets I think I could improve tail angle and back length.

2. Color comes from the cock in a mating. The LA line has some parasitic white and the FRF birds do not. By culling the LA cockerels and using a FRF male over the LA pullets the parasitic white could be corrected.

3. The LA birds have heavier leg feathering, the FRF birds have lighter. This could be corrected also this way.

The FRFxLA birds would be a project and marked differently than my pure FRF birds. I will continue to breed my main pen of FRF birds pure.

Thoughts?

I see your problem .you have to be very careful here and don t focus too much on the problem and forget the quality of your LA line .

you are saying LA chooks are better type . larger birds and better tail set . all this quality has to be maintained and bred true .Don t dismiss them because of the fault they carry Vulture Hooks and middle toes feathering

1) I agree with you on this point .LA pullet will improve the type and the tail set .

2) you are correct on the second point .color come from the rooster . so by using FRF rooster over the LA pullet you are going to improve the feathers color and type .

3) this point Heavy shank feathering is going to take you a quite some time to breed it out of your flock .

if you want to clear this problem faster out of your line .you need to find a clear shanks bird with a good type .that will balance the equation out . you need to add the recessive pti+ to your line. Because pti+ added to Pti2 will produce a healthy number of Pti1 marans type.

Breeding take time and passion .
Do no cull too early maybe your are missing out on other good trait .

good luck my friend

Chooks man

 

[chickengr]

here Hercules junior at 24 days of age .hasn t finished feathering up yet .very hard to a nice photo of him .he is a shy type .he doesn t know how special he is .



his genome is Ewh/Ewh. S/s+. Db/db+ . C+/c . Pti1/Pti1. ...........etc
and here is his brother .he is black Tail Buff .Golden based s+/s+


gorgeous comb .and nice long back

all White Storm turn up to be Super Sire .I m well pleased to have him .

here another half brother ( from different hen) he is Black tail Buff . he is a better type .wider at the shoulder


sorry it is a same cockerel

I try to find the other one

he is early feathering type . I like him better .

White Storm and his ladies are going to stay together for a long time . they are not going any where . THE ROYAL BLOOD LINE . I like a lot they progeny

Chooks man

congrats on hercules junior! he and the others are charmers.

it seems I am colour blind with chickens. I would say that your buff cockerels are red. I wonder if my red naked neck is buff. and my araucana boy then might be sort of buff colombian and not red.

 

[Chooks man]

congrats on hercules junior! he and the others are charmers.

it seems I am colour blind with chickens. I would say that your buff cockerels are red. I wonder if my red naked neck is buff. and my araucana boy then might be sort of buff colombian and not red.

you are not color blind .they are red now but they will molt into buff .they will have black flames on the bottom part of they hackles .

here the photo of an adult Black tail Buff marans Ginger

the buff marans variety is not stable .has many variation . the French marans Club when to do some work to separate the red type from the buff .

Chooks man

 

[kcrandall]

I popped 25 eggs into the incubator this evening - 8 BCM x BCM, 7 BCM x Splash Copper and 10 BCM x Blue Copper. I should get a 50/50 Blue and Black Copper split. All eggs are marked by mating pair so I can track their production.

I hope to be able to post pics in about 3 weeks. This weekend I'm going to change up my mating pairs then do it all again when this hatch is done.

Keith

 

[Chooks man]

I popped 25 eggs into the incubator this evening - 8 BCM x BCM, 7 BCM x Splash Copper and 10 BCM x Blue Copper. I should get a 50/50 Blue and Black Copper split. All eggs are marked by mating pair so I can track their production.

I hope to be able to post pics in about 3 weeks. This weekend I'm going to change up my mating pairs then do it all again when this hatch is done.

Keith

that is great number of eggs .

about the BC X BLC , you will get like you said 50% each color ( in the genetic calculator not in the reality ) .you will get some BC and other BLC .
I got more Black than Blue from the same crossing . BC rooster ( Djabel ) over a 4 BLC hens .

the Black copper coming out of this cross are true Black copper NOT Split .doesn t exist split ,Black copper to Blue . Blue will be blues and Black will be Black . only what you have to be aware of is the dark Blue chicks .some are so dark people mistake them for a Black that all .

how many chicks you managed to hatch from the first mating?
you need minimum of 25 chicks by rooster to catch the genetic train if you want to improve your flock .

I can t wait to see the new hatch from you .

all the best .

Chooks man

PS .my last hatch was yesterday 25 healthy chicks . now is the time for me to clean all the incubator and hatcher .than put them in store room .

 

[pioneerchick816]

Chooks man you can ALWAYS post pics of your 25 healthy chick hatch

 

[Chooks man]

Chooks man you can ALWAYS post pics of your 25 healthy chick hatch

sorry I did not take photo of them . too many photos .

I took the photos of the last group . I added the new hatch to them to form one large group 60 together.





they are the last left in the house . they still in the laundry room . the rest are all out in the big nursery or out .

I like this group because has 4 chicks pure golden salmon 2 Blue golden salmon and 2 Golden salmon classic type .

well happy about that .

chooks man

 

[chickengr]

sorry I did not take photo of them . too many photos .

I took the photos of the last group . I added the new hatch to them to form one large group 60 together.





they are the last left in the house . they still in the laundry room . the rest are all out in the big nursery or out .

I like this group because has 4 chicks pure golden salmon 2 Blue golden salmon and 2 Golden salmon classic type .

well happy about that .

chooks man

little cuties!

what do you cross to get golden salmon?

 

[Chooks man]

little cuties!

what do you cross to get golden salmon?

I crossed to chooks both of them carriers of golden salmon .one copy each .So when mated together they produced a pure Golden salmon only 4 .

this is new line I m working on it .
I have a different line too a pure Golden salmon rooster and his progeny . with a Wheaten hens . so they have just one copy .

it is always good to have more than one line to work with

chooks man

 

[pioneerchick816]

60 is even better