International Black Copper Marans Thread - Breeding to the SOP

[chickengr]

I hear Europe is crazy with energy taxes this year. It feels like everyone's taxes for energy everywhere are going up!

it is not only energy taxes. the government borrows money so that they can have high salaries and every household that has electricity supply pays taxes according to the size of the house and the area where it is placed. there is a bunch of invented taxes.

 

[BlueTheBrahma]

I feel like I need to make a decision for what direction I should take my marans in. As with most of my pure breeds, I aim to breed the to the sop and eventually show them, when the shows open again in England. Being in the UK, the English standard is used instead of the French/US. The English standard is strangely different from the rest of the world, placing less emphasis on body length and having feathered shanks as a fault rather than a need. To be honest, I’m not a huge fan of black, barred birds, which put me off getting English Cuckoos in the first place. Im thinking maybe I could breed golden cuckoos instead. Am I right in saying I can breed golden cuckoos by introducing barring to black coppers? Basically I’m just looking for advice: is it worth keeping my French marans and breeding them to the French standard if I can’t show them? Could I use them to breed English standards band keep the great egg colour from French blood? Should I start again with pure English marans? Do you think it would be rewarding to breed French standards as well as English ones?
I know that’s a lot of questions that may be hard to answer, I’m just looking for some pointers.
Thanks.

 

[Chooks man]

I feel like I need to make a decision for what direction I should take my marans in. As with most of my pure breeds, I aim to breed the to the sop and eventually show them, when the shows open again in England. Being in the UK, the English standard is used instead of the French/US. The English standard is strangely different from the rest of the world, placing less emphasis on body length and having feathered shanks as a fault rather than a need. To be honest, I’m not a huge fan of black, barred birds, which put me off getting English Cuckoos in the first place. Im thinking maybe I could breed golden cuckoos instead. Am I right in saying I can breed golden cuckoos by introducing barring to black coppers? Basically I’m just looking for advice: is it worth keeping my French marans and breeding them to the French standard if I can’t show them? Could I use them to breed English standards band keep the great egg colour from French blood? Should I start again with pure English marans? Do you think it would be rewarding to breed French standards as well as English ones?
I know that’s a lot of questions that may be hard to answer, I’m just looking for some pointers.
Thanks.

you are in England and you want to put the work needed to breed to SOP so you can show them ,nothing wrong with that .i you have to breed to the English SOP other wise you can show them . I know there is few places in UK they are starting to show the french type along with English type .
yes you can use the English Silver cuckoo marans to cross it to a French Black copper to produce a Golden cuckoo marans ,lot work is needed to breed it true but it s not hard because the barring gene is dominant you can always select for it .the golden is easier to breed from the silver .need few generation of selective breeding .
if you are interested in breeding them let me know and I will give you a breeding program to work with till you breed them true ,
it is nice feeling to put a hard work to bred your own strain .

my marans are a blind og old OZ lines ,new French and English strain all ixed together to create a my stunning varieties as close to the original marans of the old day when my mother and grand mother where breeding them long time ago .big ,long ,chunky chooks lay very dark eggs .
chooks man

 

[Smokerbill]

I gave my #2 cockerel away yesterday. A few days ago he tried to kill the #1 cockerel, so I decided it was time to let him go.

The whole flock is much more relaxed and happy now with just one cockerel with the hens. He can now focus on being a good rooster with the hens, without having to deal with another rooster at the same time.

 

[BlueTheBrahma]

you are in England and you want to put the work needed to breed to SOP so you can show them ,nothing wrong with that .i you have to breed to the English SOP other wise you can show them . I know there is few places in UK they are starting to show the french type along with English type .
yes you can use the English Silver cuckoo marans to cross it to a French Black copper to produce a Golden cuckoo marans ,lot work is needed to breed it true but it s not hard because the barring gene is dominant you can always select for it .the golden is easier to breed from the silver .need few generation of selective breeding .
if you are interested in breeding them let me know and I will give you a breeding program to work with till you breed them true ,
it is nice feeling to put a hard work to bred your own strain .

my marans are a blind og old OZ lines ,new French and English strain all ixed together to create a my stunning varieties as close to the original marans of the old day when my mother and grand mother where breeding them long time ago .big ,long ,chunky chooks lay very dark eggs .
chooks man

Thank you. I will have to see what birds I can get hold of. I have one English dark cuckoo marans but her egg colour is poor and she’s very old. She is my biggest non Brahma/Brahma cross hen though. I’ll get some pictures of that hen later. I know the darks are more common, so if I ended up with those, could I cross them and then breed back to black copper birds to breed out the solid black for birchen? Are golden cuckoos s+/s+ and just lighter because of barring? Because usually when I hear golden I think of split S/s+ birds, but they cannot breed true.
I would love some help with a breeding programme, thank you. It probably won’t be for a while yet, but I’m happy to plan in advance. ideally I need their own pen sorted and probably a couple less Wellie Roos so I can deal with the crowing.
How many birds am I looking for, and ideally hens and/or Roos? If the dark egg genes are from the roo, then maybe I should use Loki the BCM over cuckoo hens, but I know using a cuckoo roo over BCM hens would be more direct as barring would breed true when I crossed the roo back to those pullets.

I think I might keep the French ones too so I have a small group of them, and I’ll just work with them more slowly over the years. Hopefully eventually the English shows start allowing them.

Thanks

 

[Chooks man]

Thank you. I will have to see what birds I can get hold of. I have one English dark cuckoo marans but her egg colour is poor and she’s very old. She is my biggest non Brahma/Brahma cross hen though. I’ll get some pictures of that hen later. I know the darks are more common, so if I ended up with those, could I cross them and then breed back to black copper birds to breed out the solid black for birchen? Are golden cuckoos s+/s+ and just lighter because of barring? Because usually when I hear golden I think of split S/s+ birds, but they cannot breed true.
I would love some help with a breeding programme, thank you. It probably won’t be for a while yet, but I’m happy to plan in advance. ideally I need their own pen sorted and probably a couple less Wellie Roos so I can deal with the crowing.
How many birds am I looking for, and ideally hens and/or Roos? If the dark egg genes are from the roo, then maybe I should use Loki the BCM over cuckoo hens, but I know using a cuckoo roo over BCM hens would be more direct as barring would breed true when I crossed the roo back to those pullets.

I think I might keep the French ones too so I have a small group of them, and I’ll just work with them more slowly over the years. Hopefully eventually the English shows start allowing them.

Thanks

using a BCM rooster or a cuckoo hen will work but will take longer that all .but if the BCM rooster is a dark egg gene carrier than it is worth it for sure ,you don t want to spend that much time to breed some thng doesn t lay dark eggs .that will be worst of time .
to breed a new strain of any chooks breed you need genetic diversity because you are going to work in a close cyrcle no outside bird is allowed to the breeding program so you can breed them true quicker and purest too .
I will recommend 4 hens and 2 rooster unrelated will be better for this sort of work .a trio of black copper and a trio of Cuckoos will work very well .
a golden cuckoo are s+/s+ just a double barring turn they copper into golden that all .
let me know how many chooks you can get your hand on and I will design a breeding program specific for them ,we only can work with what we have .
chooks man

 

[BlueTheBrahma]

using a BCM rooster or a cuckoo hen will work but will take longer that all .but if the BCM rooster is a dark egg gene carrier than it is worth it for sure ,you don t want to spend that much time to breed some thng doesn t lay dark eggs .that will be worst of time .
to breed a new strain of any chooks breed you need genetic diversity because you are going to work in a close cyrcle no outside bird is allowed to the breeding program so you can breed them true quicker and purest too .
I will recommend 4 hens and 2 rooster unrelated will be better for this sort of work .a trio of black copper and a trio of Cuckoos will work very well .
a golden cuckoo are s+/s+ just a double barring turn they copper into golden that all .
let me know how many chooks you can get your hand on and I will design a breeding program specific for them ,we only can work with what we have .
chooks man

Well I have a trio of BCMs (one hen is BlCM but obviously half her offspring will be Black anyway). I will be on the lookout for English standard cuckoos, I think I’ll try adults rather than hatching eggs because I have an order for some layers from my next broody silkie, and I don’t see the weather improving this year for a chance later on.

I should have a shed coming which I’m going to set up for the Brahmas and then I should have their current shed to be used for marans.

I’ll send pictures of my old cuckoo hen soon, though I don’t think she’ll be worth breeding with due to her egg colour.

 

[Chooks man]

Well I have a trio of BCMs (one hen is BlCM but obviously half her offspring will be Black anyway). I will be on the lookout for English standard cuckoos, I think I’ll try adults rather than hatching eggs because I have an order for some layers from my next broody silkie, and I don’t see the weather improving this year for a chance later on.

I should have a shed coming which I’m going to set up for the Brahmas and then I should have their current shed to be used for marans.

I’ll send pictures of my old cuckoo hen soon, though I don’t think she’ll be worth breeding with due to her egg colour.

I agree with you your cuckoo hen is not worth breeding from ,you are in Englend and there some lovely cuckoo marans strain in there for sure you can find some dark eggs layer to work with .
cool you have a trio of BCM half of the job is done ,get a good english cuckoo trio .dark eggs layer .
my original silver cuckoo line I bred in 2015 come from a English cuckoo marans rooster ,all his daughter where dark eggs layer .
chooks man

 

[BlueTheBrahma]

I agree with you your cuckoo hen is not worth breeding from ,you are in Englend and there some lovely cuckoo marans strain in there for sure you can find some dark eggs layer to work with .
cool you have a trio of BCM half of the job is done ,get a good english cuckoo trio .dark eggs layer .
my original silver cuckoo line I bred in 2015 come from a English cuckoo marans rooster ,all his daughter where dark eggs layer .
chooks man

This is the cuckoo hen, to be honest if she didn’t have pink skin I’d assume she was a barred rock. Don’t think I’ll breed with her, she’a quite fragile anyway so I’ve retired her to the silkie pen.
@Chooks man , do you have some golden cuckoos? I’d love to see pictures of them, so I know what good quality ones look like. I’ve tried scrolling through this thread and haven’t found any.


Just got back from holiday and realised how much bigger my marans eggs have gotten. Here are some from my BlCM (top) and BCM (bottom) hens. I feel like they look lighter on camera

Thanks

 

[Chooks man]

View attachment 3594784This is the cuckoo hen, to be honest if she didn’t have pink skin I’d assume she was a barred rock. Don’t think I’ll breed with her, she’a quite fragile anyway so I’ve retired her to the silkie pen.
@Chooks man , do you have some golden cuckoos? I’d love to see pictures of them, so I know what good quality ones look like. I’ve tried scrolling through this thread and haven’t found any.


Just got back from holiday and realised how much bigger my marans eggs have gotten. Here are some from my BlCM (top) and BCM (bottom) hens. I feel like they look lighter on camera
View attachment 3594799View attachment 3594801
Thanks

stunning size and color for sure .you need to breed these hens for sure .
I have lost my old golden cuckoo line years ago but I in process of rebreeding them again .I bred the F1 progeny ( first generation ,father is a dark silver cuckoo ,mother BLC .)
I will look in my photo album and post some photos of my old strain .
chooks man