Is it ok to feed laying hens layer feed

[EggSighted4Life]

Is flock raiser the same as starter/grower? I buy my feed at tractor supply and I only buy organic. It looks like I only have a choice of starter/grower and layer.

Well, not exactly the same.. but should be *similar* in nutrients (within a range regarding specifically protein (17-20% ish) and calcium (1-2%)).. with regards to chickens. Some starter/grower may be deficient in niacin for ducklings, or amino acids etc as compared to "flock raiser", if not being used for chicks or chickens.. ie, turkey, game birds, etc. Just for basic full disclosure purposes.

I'm quite impressed to see how many offerings are available and continually changing at TSC! Check out their site often to see what formulations they might have available and which one you like the best. The even offer free store delivery on some items that aren't carried in stock. And I get my guinea pig food delivered to my door free when spending $49+, So I add an extra bag and spread out my deliveries just a little longer.. yes, I bought 75# of QUALITY guinea pig food for $60, that's a steal! Sorry for the cheap shot sticking in a photo of 3 of my little stinkers, the Three Amigos.. Honcho, Poncho, Sancho.. in that order. I have 7 boars and 2 princesses!

But you are correct it is challenging to find a "flock raiser" that is made or certified organic.. And those are usually easiest found in starter or layer formulas. I try not to be anti-layer.. but holistically (IMO) speaking for the bird and even your family the starter/grower, with oyster shell free choice on the side is a better long term choice than layer. Egg shells are fine but not usually enough to sustain a layer long term. The only thing layer has that others don't is the added calcium and usually decreased other nutrients (protein is the main one), but still consider acceptable as meeting their need at or above a prescribed minimum according to the species and age it is labeled for according to law in the US.

I agree with most of what the other poster said except the protein causing angel wing.. which according to my research is more genetics coupled with excess energy from ANY source. The lack of niacin cause them leg issues not angel wing either. Still, fairly informative and obviously some effort put into the post!

 

[Crazy Fun Chicken Lady]

Unfortunately, TSC is not the best source if Organic matters to you. It caters to a differing crowd - and honestly, the major manufacturers seem to cater to Organics with eggs on their mind, not Organic Meat Birds. At a guess, their are many more ovo-lacto vegetarians than all organic carnivores AND, at least in somewhat urban areas (where TSCs tend to be), city regulations likely allow hens in small quantities, but no roosters at all - and meat birds tend to be males, for a host of reasons.

Before I found a local mill, I was using Nutrena NatureWise All Flock - its All Natural but NOT certified organic. The key numbers for me? 18% Protein, 1.5% Calcium +/-, 2.5% Fat, up to 6% fiber.

Your TSC probably carries Nature's Best Organic Starter/Grower. Its numbers?
18% Protein, 1.1% Calcium +/-, 2.75% fat, 5.5% fiber. Close enough.

The Purina Organic Starter/Grower might be available too, more expensive still. 18% Protein, 1.2% Calcium, 3% Fat, 5.5% Fiber. Again, we're in the right range.

Lots of people use (again, not organic) Purina Flock Raiser. 20% Protein, 1.0%+/- Calcium , 3.5% Fat, 5% Fiber Again, good range there.

For comparison, your typical layer will only be 16% or maybe 17% Protein - which is low for (all) chicks, means slow growth in meat birds, ducks, etc and probably slow molt on your layers, while its calcium is usually in the 3.5% to 4% range.

tl;dr - more Protein good (to a point - ducks w/ too much protein and not enough niacin can develop angel wing, but you aren't raising ducks, so...), more calcium than 1 to 1.5% bad.

Hope that helps!

I have been feeding my chicks the Nature’s best organic starter/grower and then I always switch to the Nature’s best layer once they start laying. Are you recommending I give them the starter/grower all the time? My adults are going through an extremely heavy Molt right now. I’ve tried to up their protein with supplements and other things but I feel like they are still struggling. It would be easy for me to switch them permanently to the starter/grower. I have a mixed flock of 44 chickens with 22 different breeds. Half are adults and half are teenagers and there are only two roosters who are teenagers at the moment. None of them are meat chickens. They are pets and egg layers. Thank you so much for all of your help so far.

 

[U_Stormcrow]

I won't dispute @EggSighted4Life re: AngelWing in ducks, none of mine have ever demonstrated the tendency, was repeating only what I had read across numerous sources I researched prior to purchasing ducks the first time. Of course, i've never fed my ducks higher than 20% protein, and I don't give them stale bread. My wife's sourdough is too good to let it go stale!

Unfortunately, none of the big manufacturers list more than a handful of things on their guaranteed analysis, so even if you did research on exactly what trace minerals you needed in what quantity, and what balance of amino acids, you still couldn't look at a bag and say "yes or no" with any confidence. Yes, the All Flock, Flock Raiser, etc claim they've done everything right, but beyond some extra niacin for the ducks, I've not seen the evidence in the package printed analysis.

@Crazy Fun Chicken Lady - were it me, due to the different ages in your flock, I'd go to Grower/Starter for all plus free choice oyster shell and get myself down to a single feed to stock and keep fresh. If they were all laying age hens, on a cost basis, I would look at exclusively layer feed, but not if they are having a difficult molt. The extra protein treats you are offering are a good response since the protein content of layer is usually quite low. You are being a good chicken mama by doing so - but the cost of those treats stands in opposition to the one factor making layer superior to all flock, cost. So, based on the situation you've described, I would choose all flock, or in your case, organic grower/starter.

 

[EggSighted4Life]

Unfortunately, none of the big manufacturers list more than a handful of things on their guaranteed analysis, so even if you did research on exactly what trace minerals you needed in what quantity, and what balance of amino acids, you still couldn't look at a bag and say "yes or no" with any confidence.

Unfortunately what's included on the guaranteed analysis is only what's required to be there by law, many times. To find out anything else, contacting the manufacturer is a good way to get the whole thing.

Are you recommending I give them the starter/grower all the time? My adults are going through an extremely heavy Molt right now. I’ve tried to up their protein with supplements and other things

Yep.

What are these other treats? Many touted high protein treats are in fact high fat really.. Eggs.. 34% protein and 64% fat according to their energy (aka calorie) content. Meal worms.. 48% protein but 40% fat, for example..
mealworms

Also.. much different to go into molt with extra nutrients on board than try to respond after the fact... is what I've learned,

 

[GC-Raptor]

Is flock raiser the same as starter/grower?

Very similar. I just bought a bag of Non-Medicated Starter-Grower 18% for my Pullets and Hens 6 months and 26 months old respectively.
I offer Oyster Shells separately.
If you have ducklings you'll need to add nutritional or brewers yeast.

I don't buy Organic, but if I did I like Nature's Best, readily available at my local TSC. GC

 

[Crazy Fun Chicken Lady]

I won't dispute @EggSighted4Life re: AngelWing in ducks, none of mine have ever demonstrated the tendency, was repeating only what I had read across numerous sources I researched prior to purchasing ducks the first time. Of course, i've never fed my ducks higher than 20% protein, and I don't give them stale bread. My wife's sourdough is too good to let it go stale!

Unfortunately, none of the big manufacturers list more than a handful of things on their guaranteed analysis, so even if you did research on exactly what trace minerals you needed in what quantity, and what balance of amino acids, you still couldn't look at a bag and say "yes or no" with any confidence. Yes, the All Flock, Flock Raiser, etc claim they've done everything right, but beyond some extra niacin for the ducks, I've not seen the evidence in the package printed analysis.

@Crazy Fun Chicken Lady - were it me, due to the different ages in your flock, I'd go to Grower/Starter for all plus free choice oyster shell and get myself down to a single feed to stock and keep fresh. If they were all laying age hens, on a cost basis, I would look at exclusively layer feed, but not if they are having a difficult molt. The extra protein treats you are offering are a good response since the protein content of layer is usually quite low. You are being a good chicken mama by doing so - but the cost of those treats stands in opposition to the one factor making layer superior to all flock, cost. So, based on the situation you've described, I would choose all flock, or in your case, organic grower/starter.

Thank you so much for all the advice. I will be transitioning them to the organic starter grower with oyster shells in a separate container.

 

[claudiabostic]

When I first got chickens I only had hens and I fed them organic layer. When I got roosters I switched everybody to organic grower with oyster shell on the side, and I've fed them that way for about 2 years now. The molts are much shorter and the chickens are not nearly as miserable when molting.