Is this a Prolapse?

[tinydinos]

I have a three year old Old English Bantam hen - the photo of her I've attached is for reference but not from today - who started laying again last week after a several month pause. Her last egg was the day before yesterday and was intact but had a rough shell. Yesterday she went into her nestbox to lay but emerged a while later without having done so. I noticed her behind had a small yellowish mess. She was definitely not feeling her best, a bit fluffed and off her feed last night, but drank lots of Nutri-drench dosed water. As it was sunset I let her go in with the others, and hoped she might get the egg out overnight, as she sometimes does. She has never had any laying problems before, mind, just she sometimes lays late in the day.

This morning she had a large mess stuck to her butt feathers: yellowish, white, and some normal chicken crap, and also this thing, above the mess - see two attached photos. It's encrusted with... tissue? crap? around the edges. And underneath it looks matte black in color, although if I shine a bright light at it, perhaps it is filled with a dark liquid, like a blood blister? The feel is quite like a soft-shelled egg, though much smaller. It is not particularly warm to the touch.

The photos I see of prolapses seem to be shiny pink and swollen? I can find no hole/outlet in the extruded part. I have not tried to move the thing in, out, or around much, lest in my ignorance I make things worse.

I cleaned it up quite a bit with warm water and Vetericyn, putting light pressure on it while doing so, so she wouldn't keep trying to push it out. I peeled a little bit of the stuff coating it off, revealing nothing much. She was panting a lot as I tended to her, and I am giving her a break as I write this.

I put her in a dark box in the house but she escaped it, took a large poop on the floor, green and white, that seemed to be mixed with liquid that was something of an egg white consistency, and is now hunting around for food. (I am not giving her food just now but she has water.) The poop seemed to come out between the black thing and the bottom edge of her vent. She is active, tail held erect, and her comb is bright red but she is unsurprisingly walking a bit gingerly and is fluffed up a bit.

As far as vets go, mine retired and to my knowledge there are no longer any in the area who know anything about chickens. Or ducks. I very recently had an ailing duck and after lots of calls got a large animal farm vet to agree to do an x-ray out of the kindness of his heart (she had tumors.) So I am on my own.

Any help you all can provide is much appreciated, thank you.

 

[EggSighted4Life]

I cleaned it up quite a bit with warm water and Vetericyn

Welcome to BYC!

Sorry your lady is out of sorts.

Reproductive hiccups as the system comes back on line are unfortunate and softees and multi yolkers are far too common.

It does look like a blow out of sorts.. maybe with a soft egg stuck inside.. almost like a herniated reproductive tract that prolapsed more than a prolapsed vent.

Please understand I am novice to this.. I might do a luke warm epsom soak and try to push the internal trapped egg (if that's what it is, could it be a poop) toward the invisible opening that MIGHT lead the right way back towards the vent?? And THEN get that "membrane" pushed pack in like you are thinking??

https://the-chicken-chick.com/prolapse-vent-causes-treatment-graphic/

Nutridrench and water are good.. but I don't think I would withhold feed. I might offer it moistened.. or I might even offer a scrambled egg which will be nutritious and EASY to digest.. short term.. it's 34% protein and 64% fat, but a good quick pick me up with lots of micro nutrients and should not create any blockage.

Maybe @Eggcessive or @Wyorp Rock have information to share or know someone who does? TIA.

Hope this resolve quickly!

 

[tinydinos]

Thank you for your response! I've given her some scrambled egg which she ate avidly.

I am truly uncertain where the "blowout" goes, but knowing that's what it is, is a start, and that I should be looking for a way *in* for the exposed membrane is definitely key. I guess the hole is tucked in underneath, just inside her vent, because that's where the poop is coming from.

Now, should I put Prep H, which I have on hand, in the vicinity? Or wait until I've things hopefully put back, or not at all since it's an 'old hat' remedy?

These are questions for anybody of course, don't mean to hammer at you @EggSighted4Life just because you were so kind as to reply

 

[EggSighted4Life]

I wouldn't prep H what I'm seeing.. and only giving my best guess.

It's always wise to get a second or third opinion.. And always use YOUR best judgement.

 

[tinydinos]

Well, she's back to resting as attempt number one at putting the thing back in was a fail. It's neither hard nor soft, doesn't compress well, and her breathing was getting very distressed.

I did get things clean again and trim more feathers resulting in a better look underneath. Basically the thing is only attached at the top of her vent, leaving a channel/space along the bottom which is where the poop is coming out. And probably the egg innards that I suspect the yellow/white/thick clear stuff to have been.

Getting that unobstructed look at part of her vent does confirm that the vent itself is not out of place or swollen.

She''s in a dimly lit spot by the gas heater, sitting funny, but seemingly content to stay.

Thank you

 

[Eggcessive]

I am not sure what that is coming out of the vent. It doesn’t look like a typical prolapse, but something some material stuck in the vent. I would lubricate a gloved finger and try to go around the object and get it out.

 

[tinydinos]

Well, @Eggcessive , I had already pushed the matter back inside her, after a cleaning, but it felt wrong, like pushing a ball up her, rather than correcting something out of place. She was able to sit better afterwards but didn't feel any better for it. She maintained her perch in a kennel in the heated bathroom the night through.

But, whatever it is was out again this morning (see pics attached) more completely than before, and the surface is rougher and firmer to the touch now, too, even after a morning soak and cleaning. It's really like this discrete black ball, about the size of a small grape, only it seems to still be connected somewhere inside her and it definitely hurts her if I move it around too much. Resulting in that worrisome panting and clicking in her breathing.

It's not "stuck" to the top of her vent anymore, and I can get in all away around between the wall of her vent and the object but. OTOH, her vent is swollen in a way it wasn't yesterday. She throbs and pushes if I touch her back there, like an eggbound hen might.

Here are some pics from right after her soaking bath. That yellow streak of tissue(?) is stuck pretty firmly to the black ball so I will need to scrape it off if I'm to remove it. She's still evacuating matter from between the extrusion and the bottom of her vent but it's yellow-white and gloopy.

She only ate scrambled egg and a bit of apple yesterday and really worrisomely has stopped drinking. Her balance is starting to get a bit wobbly and she stands with her front lowered and tail high.

I am concerned that if I use force on extracting the thing I will tear something inside of her. I am wondering if she is feeling so poorly because of infection at this point but not sure how to address that, especially as she is not drinking.

Thank you for your help in this!

 

[Wyorp Rock]

I wonder if it's an intact follicle with a soft shell attached inside the vent. Just speculation on my part of course, since you mention the size of a grape and it seems to go inside too.
This is what I'm thinking that is (with the soft shell still collapsed inside), but definitely could be wrong
https://www.backyardchickens.com/th...ood-ball-inside-soft-shelled-egg-pic.1324813/
https://www.backyardchickens.com/th...e-out-of-old-english-game-bantam-hen.1321148/

Do you think it's possible?

I would definitely try to get keep her hydrated. I would also get calcium into her - for this I would give 1 Caltrate tablet once a day for 3 days.

The yellow and white gloopy stuff coming out is likely poop (urates) and it will be sticky.

 

[tinydinos]

Oh wow, that.. could be, @Wyorp Rock . My early impression was that it was some type of blood sac but I didn't know how that made sense.

I gave her some whole milk yoghurt, just out of desperation that she wasn't taking on any food *or* water and it's a favorite treat of hers. Just now she drank some Nutridrench spiked water. She's all puffed up and not feeling good, still wobbly, but at least she's taken on some fluids. I will see if I can get that Calcium into her.

Thanks!

 

[Wyorp Rock]

Oh wow, that.. could be, @Wyorp Rock . My early impression was that it was some type of blood sac but I didn't know how that made sense.

I gave her some whole milk yoghurt, just out of desperation that she wasn't taking on any food *or* water and it's a favorite treat of hers. Just now she drank some Nutridrench spiked water. She's all puffed up and not feeling good, still wobbly, but at least she's taken on some fluids. I will see if I can get that Calcium into her.

Thanks!

Does it feel firm-ish?

The thing is if that is blocking the vent and she's not able to poop, then it's not a good scenario. I would try lubricating around. Mineral oil if you have it or KY jelly? If not, then Prep H, vaseline or coconut oil.

All we can go by is your description and the photos - that does not look like a typical prolapse of tissue to me.