Karma -- Thoughts?

[Marshmallow Man]

I was horrified by that story. I never followed it that closely. I knew she was delusional but not to what extent. That was such a shame.

It seems like a lot of people that are on psyche medications don't like to take them. I guess you have to do the nurse routine and be sure they take them. I sure would if I thought my kids could be in danger. Didn't she say God told her to do it? I guess if you hear voices in your head it must be God.

George you must kill Sadam.

 

[Q9]

Quote:
No, thank you

I still think it immoral, unethical and insane that a newborn has sin. No matter HOW you explain it.

We can always debate, but until that day, many of us won't know. But in the meantime, it is FUN debating, as long as you can debate with the right people!

Huge theological debate over that, too. Call me sick, but I lean heavily on the side of Original Sin, no matter how I feel about it. It's what the Bible says, and the Bible is the Word of God, so, yeah. I don't LIKE the thought of it, but then again, like the Bible says, who is the clay to challenge the potter?

Thanks for staying reasonable. Guess we'll find out who's right on Judgement Day.

Oh, yeah, do yourself a favor and Google "Pascal's Wager."

 

[darkmatter]

Karma-----sure, whatever you call it, I've seen self-centered evil people get their just rewards tenfold for their actions. Although it seems good deeds and behaviors don't show as dramatic results, it does seem to affect a wider group with good things/life. So yes, the phrase as you sow, so shall ye reap is not bull-hockey.

 

[Marshmallow Man]

When my children were very young my parents would watch them occasionally. My father took them to the Catholic church and had the baptized without our knowledge. He was so afraid of original sin. Catholics baptize shortly after birth. They just sprinkle holy water vs immersion. We didn't find this out till after my father passed away. My wife was upset but she loved my Dad and didn't make an issue of it. I didn't really care one way or the other. It gave him peace. He went to the grave feeling that he had failed with me. Least I could do was not be upset over a little holy water. Besides you never know. Hate to see my kid go to hell for something she didn't do. Something nobody will ever know.

 

[nonseq]

Quote:
I know you didn't ask me, so you don't have to read this if you don't want to

I think that the Original Sin was a dang good excuse for all of humanity to be able to do pretty much what they darn well pleased and STILL get into heaven, if that's what you believe. I just can't find it in myself to believe that a newborn has done anything wrong.

I agree. I like the confession thing. Do anything you want and go to confession. For a few Hail Mary's you can get away with murder. Did you ever read Pillars of the Earth? the King and the Dukes would kill people needlessly and would get redemption from the local Bishop in exchange for money donations. I've always been amazed at what people will do because of their fear of what happens after death.

I wonder what would happen to humanity if somehow the entire World found out that there was no God. No nothing. We are just worm food. Do you think everyone would just go berzerk?

Have ever read Towing Jehovah by James Morrow? It takes a stab at answering that question.

 

[noodleroo]

Quote:
Since you started this, I was wondering when you'd chime in. And I wondered where you were going with this post. Now I get it, I think.

There are some things in life of which I am absolutely certain. This is one of them: Everybody messes up. Some of us mess up a lot. We stop messing up when we choose to stop. We can feel guilty about it and punish ourselves for the rest of our lives or we can forgive ourselves and get on with it. That is exactly what karma is about; not letting the 'unskillful' hamper the 'skillful'.

In my work, I see people that have REALLY messed up. I'm talking prison gang guys, murderers, burglars - people that have made really bad choices. They really aren't all that different than you or me; just a few bad choices away, really. Where there is great good, there is the potential for great evil.

One of these guys that I know made it out of the system, decided that he was done. He knew that his choice to change his life and come over to the 'good' could get him killed. When he refused a gang order and said he wanted out, he was taken out and shot, stabbed, beaten and left on the side of the road for dead. But he didn't die. He decided that he was going to lead a productive life and is doing exactly that today. He was able to forgive himself so that he could get on with it. He is a great guy today, helps lots of people, has a great wife, a great dog... Scars, you bet; physically and mentaly. But maybe we need our scars to make us whole...

Just think, Boyd, would you be the man you are today without your scars?

 

[Whispering Winds]

Quote:
Since you started this, I was wondering when you'd chime in. And I wondered where you were going with this post. Now I get it, I think.

There are some things in life of which I am absolutely certain. This is one of them: Everybody messes up. Some of us mess up a lot. We stop messing up when we choose to stop. We can feel guilty about it and punish ourselves for the rest of our lives or we can forgive ourselves and get on with it. That is exactly what karma is about; not letting the 'unskillful' hamper the 'skillful'.

In my work, I see people that have REALLY messed up. I'm talking prison gang guys, murderers, burglars - people that have made really bad choices. They really aren't all that different than you or me; just a few bad choices away, really. Where there is great good, there is the potential for great evil.

One of these guys that I know made it out of the system, decided that he was done. He knew that his choice to change his life and come over to the 'good' could get him killed. When he refused a gang order and said he wanted out, he was taken out and shot, stabbed, beaten and left on the side of the road for dead. But he didn't die. He decided that he was going to lead a productive life and is doing exactly that today. He was able to forgive himself so that he could get on with it. He is a great guy today, helps lots of people, has a great wife, a great dog... Scars, you bet; physically and mentaly. But maybe we need our scars to make us whole...

Just think, Boyd, would you be the man you are today without your scars?

This is good. I agree. We are what we are, and I go to Sunday School almost every Sunday, and actually get more out of it than I do the church sermon. I actually have a SS teacher who's oldest son was married to my sister and they divorced. Had a son together who is my favorite person in the whole world, as far as my relatives are concerned. The dad/son/ex was killed in a horrific car wreck, alcohol related when nephew was 6 years old. It caused untold grief and heartache in my family for many many years. To this day, my nephew and his mom do not really "connect" because of a legal suit that gave custody to the paternal grandparents. This has never been, nor IMO will be addressed head on by either party, no matter how many "insinuations" are made in SS about doing bad things and asking for forgiveness. I truly believe that she has done enough good in the ensuing years to more than make up for the evil she did at the time of the son's death and legal battle, because I know what she does at the age of 87 and its amazing!! I also think she grieves over what she did, because she talks about getting on her knees and praying for forgiveness at a time when "I thought I knew what was best for everyone, and I hurt a lot of people in the process." I think that takes a very big person to say that in front of a class of several people. I think, sometimes the 12 step program is a good way to live. I only know a couple of them, but the one where you go back and ask to be forgiven for something bad you did to someone makes me feel like that might be a good place to start. I do believe that you cannot forgive or be forgiven, until you are able to forgive yourself, and be able to live with yourself. . .love thyself really is a good way to start out.
I learn every Sunday, no matter how its put, that God is a loving God and he forgives. I sort of like the idea of heaven being in levels, although this is NOT a Baptist belief from what I have so far gathered. I believe it might be one of the other beliefs, like Hindu or something. . . You don't just get to go to the top of the class because you are born again. It sort of irks me to think that Jeffrey Daumer, John Gacy, and Ted Bundy are up there or out there with my dear sweet grandma's and aunts . . .I think you should have to earn a level at a time. I also dearly love the old Indian belief, and have mentioned on it here several times that every animal we owned in our lifetime will be at the gate to decide if we are allowed to enter. THEY choose. Would it be if it was that simple.

Don't you all think that we just should live our lives to the best of our ability. You don't have to be smart, rich, pretty, handsome, or all in one piece to be good and kind. Kindness is simply overlooked these days . . .decency is overlooked these days . . .and honesty and integrity have taken a back seat to evil in all forms. I was a model teen, never did much of anything that my mom and dad told me not too, simply because I loved them and never wanted to do anything to bring them hurt or embarrassment . . .I was a rare bird to say the least, but then I had children. OMG, did I get some ancestral throwbacks, but you know what . . .they are all in their 30's, and while I don't agree with everything they do, they are good people. They treat everyone they come in contact with, with kindness and decency and that makes me happy and they know it. They also treat us with the same kindness and respect and I feel like maybe we didn't screw them up too much!

I believe in Karma, but I think it comes in all forms. I truly believe what goes around comes around, it might not be today, tomorrow or next week, but your due will come if you have not made an attempt to pay back society in some way . . . I also like to think that God is watching over me, or a guardian angel is, and it comforts me. If that is a goofy thought, then so be it.


Good topic Boyd. Thought you might be opening a can of worms, but it really was very enlightening and educational for me. I wasn't raised in church, but my mom and dad were both excellent people and always did good. . .so religion has never been a real big interest to me . . .but I love reading what the rest of you have written. I did get Baptized a year ago Palm Sunday, and while it soothed me, I also felt like the devil was after me more than ever before. . .does that sound crazy?

 

[Duramaxgirl]

I'm not sure where at this thread is in discussion. But I don't believe it karma. But my husbands always says. "what goes around comes around" meaning if your moral and good and do kind to others it will be returned to you. I don't know if I agree but he is a very giving person. I tend to be selfish (opposites attract ya know) and he loves to help others and give of his talents. He is a very quiet guy and most all people respect him... So maybe he's right? I think people use him but who knows.... He is a contractor and you wouldn't believe how many friends and family we have want him to build stuff for free...

 

[Boyd]

Quote:
Since you started this, I was wondering when you'd chime in. And I wondered where you were going with this post. Now I get it, I think.

There are some things in life of which I am absolutely certain. This is one of them: Everybody messes up. Some of us mess up a lot. We stop messing up when we choose to stop. We can feel guilty about it and punish ourselves for the rest of our lives or we can forgive ourselves and get on with it. That is exactly what karma is about; not letting the 'unskillful' hamper the 'skillful'.

In my work, I see people that have REALLY messed up. I'm talking prison gang guys, murderers, burglars - people that have made really bad choices. They really aren't all that different than you or me; just a few bad choices away, really. Where there is great good, there is the potential for great evil.

One of these guys that I know made it out of the system, decided that he was done. He knew that his choice to change his life and come over to the 'good' could get him killed. When he refused a gang order and said he wanted out, he was taken out and shot, stabbed, beaten and left on the side of the road for dead. But he didn't die. He decided that he was going to lead a productive life and is doing exactly that today. He was able to forgive himself so that he could get on with it. He is a great guy today, helps lots of people, has a great wife, a great dog... Scars, you bet; physically and mentaly. But maybe we need our scars to make us whole...

Just think, Boyd, would you be the man you are today without your scars?

nope, not me. they define me.

 

[debilorrah]