Let's talk Cuckoo and WHITE marans... breeding strategies...
- Thread starter geebs
- Start date
Quote:
Tell me about it! I just lost 16 out of 17 eggs to a last minute, well overnight, heat spike!
One chick made it into the world. Time for me to get a Sportsman! In the mean time, I just set 7 eggs this morning in my plug n play bator. This time, I will hatch them out in this one too! Don't give up, I know how depressing it can get, believe me.
Another reason for frequent hand turning. I find it easier to monitor them. last week I found a "weeping egg" that I wouldn't have found if I had a "no touch" there were actually two of them and I found them just in time I am sure. That woud have been a terrible explosion!!l
Tell me about it! I just lost 16 out of 17 eggs to a last minute, well overnight, heat spike!
Another reason for frequent hand turning. I find it easier to monitor them. last week I found a "weeping egg" that I wouldn't have found if I had a "no touch" there were actually two of them and I found them just in time I am sure. That woud have been a terrible explosion!!l
Quote:
Where do you have your humidity? I have heard that for Marans, because of the thicker shell, lower humidity works better. Are you having a problem with fertility, or with quitters? If nothing grows, it would be fertility, growth then not hatching would be a problem with incubation. Does anybody on here do a dry incubation?
Where do you have your humidity? I have heard that for Marans, because of the thicker shell, lower humidity works better. Are you having a problem with fertility, or with quitters? If nothing grows, it would be fertility, growth then not hatching would be a problem with incubation. Does anybody on here do a dry incubation?
I tried a modified dry method this last hatch. I had more eggs that were going to hatch, (before the heat spike), then I've ever had. Out of 17 eggs, I had 12 of them rocking and peeping. I set my bator at 25% and let it fluctuate with the ambient humidity as it would. Went to maybe 37% at best. Then for the lockdown, I bumped it up to 65%. Trying the same with this new set of 7 eggs, only this time I will hatch them out in the incubator they are in, instead of transferring to the styrobator.
Quote:
Where do you have your humidity? I have heard that for Marans, because of the thicker shell, lower humidity works better. Are you having a problem with fertility, or with quitters? If nothing grows, it would be fertility, growth then not hatching would be a problem with incubation. Does anybody on here do a dry incubation?
I have done "dry" incuabting. I have a 1949 Buckeye Incubator that is made from 4" think solid redwood. I dry hatched for the first part of this season ( Feb,march) it held and average of 18% humidity and I had about a 65-70% hatch rate.
Without adding water it holds 35% humidity on moist spring days. I will not go lower than that anymore because I have found that the chicks come out too sticky and often the membrane will dry on them as they are piping and cause them to stick mid rotation. I get the best result with 35-40% on day 18-21 I mist the eggs with a warm spray bottle.
I run my hovabator at 40% the entire time.
Where do you have your humidity? I have heard that for Marans, because of the thicker shell, lower humidity works better. Are you having a problem with fertility, or with quitters? If nothing grows, it would be fertility, growth then not hatching would be a problem with incubation. Does anybody on here do a dry incubation?
I have done "dry" incuabting. I have a 1949 Buckeye Incubator that is made from 4" think solid redwood. I dry hatched for the first part of this season ( Feb,march) it held and average of 18% humidity and I had about a 65-70% hatch rate.
Without adding water it holds 35% humidity on moist spring days. I will not go lower than that anymore because I have found that the chicks come out too sticky and often the membrane will dry on them as they are piping and cause them to stick mid rotation. I get the best result with 35-40% on day 18-21 I mist the eggs with a warm spray bottle.
I run my hovabator at 40% the entire time.
this is interesting on dry hatching.....http://paraguinparadise.netfirms.com/Dry Incubation.htm
Quote:
When you did the "dry" incubation, did you up the humidity for lockdown? That is one thing I have noticed that some people call it a "dry hatch" which is incorrect. Dry incubation is a lower humidity for the first 18 days then higher humidity for the hatch. When I have read people talking about "dry hatch" makes me think that the humidity is never raised which can cause all kinds of trouble.
When you did the "dry" incubation, did you up the humidity for lockdown? That is one thing I have noticed that some people call it a "dry hatch" which is incorrect. Dry incubation is a lower humidity for the first 18 days then higher humidity for the hatch. When I have read people talking about "dry hatch" makes me think that the humidity is never raised which can cause all kinds of trouble.
Quote:
Will try and answer some of your questions. I plan on showing at Columdus this year if I have anything that is a good representative of the Marans breed. You will not see anything from me that looks like the Black Copper that were showed the past couple of year there.
I am breeding for show Marans only and have no intentions of trying to breed a12 on the 9 color chart. To be honest I have yet to see a BC males at any show that I would take home . I have asked for anyone to show a BC without DQ's and major faults talking about male and would like to see a picture.
I have hatched a lot of garbage and will take the credit for it also. There are no big guys out there showing BC marans at the shows in my area or yours. I have showed in the Michigan, Indiana, Ohio shows for close to 50 years, I have not showed since before the last Crossroads show.
I cull the culls because they will reproduce their likeness. Hope to see you at Columbus.
Will try and answer some of your questions. I plan on showing at Columdus this year if I have anything that is a good representative of the Marans breed. You will not see anything from me that looks like the Black Copper that were showed the past couple of year there.
I am breeding for show Marans only and have no intentions of trying to breed a12 on the 9 color chart. To be honest I have yet to see a BC males at any show that I would take home . I have asked for anyone to show a BC without DQ's and major faults talking about male and would like to see a picture.
I have hatched a lot of garbage and will take the credit for it also. There are no big guys out there showing BC marans at the shows in my area or yours. I have showed in the Michigan, Indiana, Ohio shows for close to 50 years, I have not showed since before the last Crossroads show.
I cull the culls because they will reproduce their likeness. Hope to see you at Columbus.
Quote:
Will try and answer some of your questions. I plan on showing at Columdus this year if I have anything that is a good representative of the Marans breed. You will not see anything from me that looks like the Black Copper that were showed the past couple of year there.
I am breeding for show Marans only and have no intentions of trying to breed a12 on the 9 color chart. To be honest I have yet to see a BC males at any show that I would take home . I have asked for anyone to show a BC without DQ's and major faults talking about male and would like to see a picture.
I have hatched a lot of garbage and will take the credit for it also. There are no big guys out there showing BC marans at the shows in my area or yours. I have showed in the Michigan, Indiana, Ohio shows for close to 50 years, I have not showed since before the last Crossroads show.
I cull the culls because they will reproduce their likeness. Hope to see you at Columbus.
I am not intentionally breeding for "show" birds. I do appreciate a well maintained flock and the amount of work that it takes. I am trying to breed for the more common desired qualities mainly the egg color. I do have to sell some to help pay for everything but I am honest with those I sell to and have found that most are looking for two things...dark eggs and leg feathers. Wether or not their hackels are too long, the color is orange instead of mahogany, the eye is yellow not red does not matter. I am not selling mine as SQ birds. I am not asking SQ prices, and I know when to take one to the butcher. I can guarantee I won't be killing chicks. I like the unusual ones and I have 10 acres to free range what ever I want.
The one bad thing about accepting them to the APA is that if they can't really be considered a Marans if they don't produce a #4 or better how could you really show one?? I suppose you could just show what looks like a Marans and be very happy since they are beautiful birds. But so are many other breeds. It would be easier to buy some show stock from someone and continue with that than to take on a variety of a breed that has not been around for more than a decade or two.
I prefer the dark eggs that is why I keep mine longer than most people. You can't tell what a rooster is going to throw or a pullet is going to make until you see the result. You have been showing for a long time, did you choose Marans for the Challenge? It certainly is one. I was told by a couple different breeders that it takes about 5 years to really establish a good flock or a variety with a good egg color.
I don't think a 9 or 12 would even be possible. I would rather keep mine where they are 5-7 and have them lay that for the entire season. I have some from a line of Davis/Presley that do. It seems like it is hard to get the egg color out of the pretier ones.
The only show I have been to had a trio of wheaten and one BCM, and like you said, I could find faults with each but until more peole get out and show them there won't be much of a standard to go by. From my understanding and research of the breed it seems that there are different lines for show and different lines for achieving the dark egg color. That is even how it is in Europe. My Sister in law is from Germany and she showed Marans for a long time there and told me all about it when we first met.
Are you showing in Columbus? I just might have a pair to take. They might not be perfect but at least I will be braver than most and put them out there. Someone has to be the first one in. I may also show my bantam Marans pullets and eggs. I guess I should make it worth the trip.
Will try and answer some of your questions. I plan on showing at Columdus this year if I have anything that is a good representative of the Marans breed. You will not see anything from me that looks like the Black Copper that were showed the past couple of year there.
I am breeding for show Marans only and have no intentions of trying to breed a12 on the 9 color chart. To be honest I have yet to see a BC males at any show that I would take home . I have asked for anyone to show a BC without DQ's and major faults talking about male and would like to see a picture.
I have hatched a lot of garbage and will take the credit for it also. There are no big guys out there showing BC marans at the shows in my area or yours. I have showed in the Michigan, Indiana, Ohio shows for close to 50 years, I have not showed since before the last Crossroads show.
I cull the culls because they will reproduce their likeness. Hope to see you at Columbus.
I am not intentionally breeding for "show" birds. I do appreciate a well maintained flock and the amount of work that it takes. I am trying to breed for the more common desired qualities mainly the egg color. I do have to sell some to help pay for everything but I am honest with those I sell to and have found that most are looking for two things...dark eggs and leg feathers. Wether or not their hackels are too long, the color is orange instead of mahogany, the eye is yellow not red does not matter. I am not selling mine as SQ birds. I am not asking SQ prices, and I know when to take one to the butcher. I can guarantee I won't be killing chicks. I like the unusual ones and I have 10 acres to free range what ever I want.
The one bad thing about accepting them to the APA is that if they can't really be considered a Marans if they don't produce a #4 or better how could you really show one?? I suppose you could just show what looks like a Marans and be very happy since they are beautiful birds. But so are many other breeds. It would be easier to buy some show stock from someone and continue with that than to take on a variety of a breed that has not been around for more than a decade or two.
I prefer the dark eggs that is why I keep mine longer than most people. You can't tell what a rooster is going to throw or a pullet is going to make until you see the result. You have been showing for a long time, did you choose Marans for the Challenge? It certainly is one. I was told by a couple different breeders that it takes about 5 years to really establish a good flock or a variety with a good egg color.
I don't think a 9 or 12 would even be possible. I would rather keep mine where they are 5-7 and have them lay that for the entire season. I have some from a line of Davis/Presley that do. It seems like it is hard to get the egg color out of the pretier ones.
The only show I have been to had a trio of wheaten and one BCM, and like you said, I could find faults with each but until more peole get out and show them there won't be much of a standard to go by. From my understanding and research of the breed it seems that there are different lines for show and different lines for achieving the dark egg color. That is even how it is in Europe. My Sister in law is from Germany and she showed Marans for a long time there and told me all about it when we first met.
Are you showing in Columbus? I just might have a pair to take. They might not be perfect but at least I will be braver than most and put them out there. Someone has to be the first one in. I may also show my bantam Marans pullets and eggs. I guess I should make it worth the trip.
Quote:
When you did the "dry" incubation, did you up the humidity for lockdown? That is one thing I have noticed that some people call it a "dry hatch" which is incorrect. Dry incubation is a lower humidity for the first 18 days then higher humidity for the hatch. When I have read people talking about "dry hatch" makes me think that the humidity is never raised which can cause all kinds of trouble.
Yeah, I thought the dry hatch name was odd too. If you did not have any humidity you would be making "jerkey eggs" I watch for the air pocket and the size of it.
I keep moving eggs in and out during incubation. I never really do a lock down. My lockdown consists of not opening that drawer. If the humidity drops below 35* I will mist the day 18+ eggs with water. I keep a spray mister in the bottom of the incuabtor and it stays warm so it doesn't chill the eggs. Most of what I have that does not hatch is due to fertility. I open almost every egg that does not hatch to monitor what went on. I keep track of it in my breeding journal to sse if there is a problem with a particular pairing.
My biggest problem is that with the thick dark marans shells it is very hard to candle. So often I have to just let it ride until day 23 and pray for no poppers!!
When you did the "dry" incubation, did you up the humidity for lockdown? That is one thing I have noticed that some people call it a "dry hatch" which is incorrect. Dry incubation is a lower humidity for the first 18 days then higher humidity for the hatch. When I have read people talking about "dry hatch" makes me think that the humidity is never raised which can cause all kinds of trouble.
Yeah, I thought the dry hatch name was odd too. If you did not have any humidity you would be making "jerkey eggs" I watch for the air pocket and the size of it.
I keep moving eggs in and out during incubation. I never really do a lock down. My lockdown consists of not opening that drawer. If the humidity drops below 35* I will mist the day 18+ eggs with water. I keep a spray mister in the bottom of the incuabtor and it stays warm so it doesn't chill the eggs. Most of what I have that does not hatch is due to fertility. I open almost every egg that does not hatch to monitor what went on. I keep track of it in my breeding journal to sse if there is a problem with a particular pairing.
My biggest problem is that with the thick dark marans shells it is very hard to candle. So often I have to just let it ride until day 23 and pray for no poppers!!
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